2020-10-23 GnuCash IRC logs
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00:09:55 <fell> Chris, the exchange rate path is one of the more complex graph theoretical problems.
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00:12:38 <fell> Imagine a company like HSBC trading over the day from JP, HK,SG, ... unitl the last exchange in America with GBP, EUR, USD, …
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00:16:28 <fell> You need to limit the combinatorical explosion.
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00:18:27 <fell> There are cases of home users with a unique solution.
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00:19:41 <fell> But as soon as more solutions exist, the assignment is restricted by the users local law.
00:22:06 <fell> And that law can require FiFo, HiFo, LiFo, … depending on the type of asset (current, medium, loong term).
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02:28:44 <guiu> chris, could you elaborate a little bit more how to do that ? ( "could use the cash-flow chart originating from asset-account, then (in libwebkit2) click on wanted accounts in chartjs chart to hide them" ). I am lost in the libwekbit2 part.
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05:40:43 <coaboa_> Hey folks, afriend o f mine wants to utilize gnomecash for her startup, located in germany. We stumbled upon some questions: how can we exchange date with the tax connsultant, he asked to use software which is GoBD and SKR04 Complient. Is gnucash supporting the current SKR04 Account Scheme ?
05:40:50 <coaboa_> https://wiki.gnucash.org/wiki/De/Projekte
05:42:35 <coaboa_> Shows some older information and its not clear if it is supported and how the exchange (DATEV / ELSTER /other exchange format) with thetax authorities will work?
05:43:07 <coaboa_> any help is appreciated + thx in advance
05:57:25 <chris> guiu: if you use linux then you have libwebkit2. on macOS or windows you can't, unless you export html and open from modern browser. so: firefox(win32/macOS) or gnucash(linux) you'll click on chart elements to hide accounts.
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06:50:20 <andreas^> hello all.
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07:02:50 <andreas^> https://www.gnucash.org/docs/v4/C/gnucash-guide/cbook-together1.html
07:03:49 <andreas^> 5.5.2: I click on a free line and type "ABC Hardware" then click the Split button. I input two withdrawals, Household and Tools. Then when I press Enter the line just disappears.
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07:11:58 <warlord> andreas^, because you don't have a split anchoring the transaction to the current account. Instead of hitting split after you enter "ABC Hardware", tab over to withdrawals and enter the total amount. THEN after you hit split you can split the amount between Household and Tools.
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07:41:25 <andreas^> warlord: that doesn't work either.
07:43:58 <warlord> What account are you entering this in?
07:44:32 <andreas^> warlord: Checking.
07:47:45 <andreas^> I don't think I've gotten the hang of split accounts.
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07:56:37 <warlord> andreas^, okay, let's start from the beginning.
07:57:06 <warlord> A basic transaction has two Splits, a Debit into account A and a Credit into account B. This moves value from B (Credit) into A (Debit).
07:57:16 <warlord> A "Split Transaction" has > 2 Splits.
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07:58:00 <warlord> The total of Debits must equal the total of Credits in a transaction.
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07:58:27 <warlord> Finally, for a transaction to appear in an account, it must have a Split that touches that account.
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07:58:48 <warlord> For example, Assets:Bank:Checking -> Expenses:Groceries + Expenses:Supplies.
07:58:56 <warlord> 3 Splits (one to each account).
07:59:16 <warlord> Credit A:B:C $20, Debit E:G $15, Debit E:S $5.
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07:59:38 <warlord> In general, we recommend entering transactions from Asset and Liability accounts -- it can be more confusing otherwise.
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08:02:05 <andreas^> warlord: "The total of Debits must equal the total of Credits in a transaction." - if I have two withdrawals of $50 each, I must enter a deposit of $100?
08:02:25 <andreas^> a third entry.
08:03:58 <warlord> If you have two $50 withdrawals, where is that money going?
08:04:30 <andreas^> to Expenses.
08:04:50 <warlord> Why are there 2 $50 withdrawals?
08:05:19 <warlord> USUALLY it would be ONE withdrawal into multiple expenses, not multiple withdrawals into one expense.
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08:07:06 <andreas^> warlord: one withdrawal for each expense.
08:09:23 <warlord> Then you have multiple, simple transactions, Cash -> Expense1 ; Cash -> Expense2. That's not a Split Transaction.
08:15:42 <andreas^> warlord: so what I'm missing out is a deposit of the amount that is withdrawn.
08:16:11 <warlord> No.... andreas^ please go read the Tutorial & Guide so you can understand double-entry accounting.
08:18:10 <chris> warlord: cristi at #805 has skills
08:18:34 <warlord> chris, :)
08:20:30 <chris> andreas^ https://beancount.github.io/docs/the_double_entry_counting_method.html has similar theory but different approach if you prefer
08:20:55 <chris> ^ if "T" touches >2 accounts then gnucash calls it a 'split transaction'
08:23:51 <andreas^> I will read that chris.
08:32:37 <chris> warlord: your views are very welcome too... are you any good at solving the 0-1 knapsack problem with duplicate amounts?
08:46:50 <warlord> Um. nope. ;)
08:46:58 <warlord> Algorithms was not my strong suit :)
08:47:50 <chris> :-o
08:54:56 <andreas^> warlord: I'm reading that page and it seems like what I missed out on was a deposit of the amount withdrawn, but you said no so I don't understand.
08:55:30 <andreas^> the sum of all postings should be 0, is that correct?
08:57:46 <warlord> andreas^, No, the sum of all splits in a transaction must be 0
08:59:00 <andreas^> so with two withdrawals of $50 there needs to be a deposit of $100?
09:00:27 <chris> andreas^ no; you have no obligation to deposit $100 when you withdraw $50 from the bank twice, right?
09:00:38 <warlord> Please don't call them withdrawals and deposits. With two credits of $50 you need a debit of $100.
09:00:39 <chris> read the documents fully
09:01:18 <warlord> A deposit into you account is yet another transaction, that requires it's OWN double-entry (e.g. Income:Salary)
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10:00:13 <chris> andreas^ to simplify: A Transaction has 2 or more splits. A 2-split transaction has Debit and Credit. A 3-split has 1Debit+2Credits or 2Debit+1Credit.
10:00:39 <chris> Simple 2-split: Income:Salary -$20 and Asset:Bank +20
10:00:52 <chris> Simple 2-split: Asset:Bank -5 and Expense:Food +5
10:01:09 <chris> Simple 3-split: Asset:Bank -25 and Expense:food 20 and Expense:Gas 5
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10:02:04 <chris> Simple 3-split: Asset:Bank -1,000 and Liability:HomeLoan -99,000 and Asset:House +100,000
10:08:10 <chris> oops andreas already gone
10:10:24 <warlord> yea, oops.
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14:50:37 <jralls> chris, warlord, I think you were missing that andreas^ is probably using informal accounting labels so their debit and credit columns are labelled deposit and withdrawal. They're not a native English speaker so they don't know about the bigger-picture meaning of those words, hence the confusion.
14:53:37 <CDB-Work> i don't know about stateside, but in Canada, most retail banks use debit/credit as labels on the customer's bank statements
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14:54:25 <jralls> They do that here too, but as we often have to tell newbs they do it from their viewpoint which is the reverse of the customer's.
14:54:27 <CDB-Work> (albeit with the labels reversed, since the bank always states debit credit from the bank's perspective, rather than the account holder's perspective. e.g. a deposit is a credit to the bank)
14:54:28 <warlord> CDB-Work, they do here, too, but they are reversed
14:54:47 <CDB-Work> looks like we are all on the same wavelength!
14:55:10 <jralls> Yeah, we've all been around that block a few (thousand) times.
14:55:30 <CDB-Work> or in my case, the same block 50 time every year with the same audit client....
14:56:03 <jralls> You have a client you have to audit weekly?!
14:56:33 <jralls> Or is it 50 times in one meeting once a year?
14:56:43 <CDB-Work> no no, on an annual basis, during the 2 month audit completion period, i repeat the same message what feels like 50+ times, each year
14:56:55 <CDB-Work> within that 2 month window
15:03:35 <CDB-Work> on unrelated matters, if Wm is as disruptive as you make him out to be, has there been consideration to blacklisting him?
15:17:50 <warlord> CDB-Work, he is under email moderation. but not a good way to moderate BZ
15:18:42 <CDB-Work> meaning he does not receive emails for BZ activity?
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15:23:23 <CDB-Work> well, either way, I guess you all have been living with this fact for a while now, and at some point I will also become accustomed and numb to it
15:23:46 <jralls> No, meaning that his posts to gnucash-user have to be looked at by the list moderator before they go to the list. BZ doesn't have a good way to limit individual users and besides it would be easy for him to create new user ids there.
15:26:18 <CDB-Work> well... that is unfortunate indeed
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15:56:35 <fell> I wonder, if we should split in label1 in /gnucash/gtkbuilder/window-autoclear.glade in header and text. Otherwise we will loose the existing translations of the header.
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16:09:00 <jralls> fell, You mean on PR805, right?
16:10:45 <fell> https://github.com/Gnucash/gnucash/commit/e9f6703562e4bb6524875ecf6155d4397690eccc
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16:11:38 <fell> It
16:12:13 <fell> with the title centered it looks also nicer, IMHO
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16:12:58 <jralls> Oh, OK. He expanded it more in PR805. Why don't you suggest there that he split it up. I think chris already asked you to look at the labels.
16:14:52 <fell> there are too many PRs to watch. ;-)
16:23:53 <jralls> Yeah. Never mind review. :-/
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23:06:04 <chris> jralls: I believe my 'never round' comes from gnc-numeric.cpp:359 - the comment "//May throw" is a nice clue!
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23:18:54 <chris> jralls: #805 had typo now fixed (i think)
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