2020-09-10 GnuCash IRC logs
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02:19:05 <grepular> Thanks for the suggestions
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05:08:41 <gjanssens> .
05:09:28 <gjanssens> chris: I'm reading through the conversation on PR #667
05:10:25 <gjanssens> Can you refresh my memory - split.date_reconciled is that the date entered by the user in the reconcile window ?
05:10:53 <gjanssens> And if the user mistypes this is why we can have odd reconcile dates ?
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05:53:22 <chris> gjanssens: bingo!
05:54:16 <gjanssens> Ok thanks.
05:54:34 <gjanssens> I'm trying to formulate a decent answer on that PR ;)
05:54:54 <chris> reconciled_date can be set via: (1) invalid input during reconcile (2) QIF importer sets whatever .qif says (3) AqBanking sets to today IIRC
05:54:57 <gjanssens> But it does take a while to grok the issue again after my hiatus
05:55:23 <chris> my wish is that whwnever I reconcile, I'm basically adding a balance assertion which is currently lost in time
05:55:41 <gjanssens> And is .qif known to set it wrong ?
05:57:09 <chris> looking at qif I think it doesn't set reconcile_date at all
05:57:32 <gjanssens> Oh right, that was the problem.
05:57:42 <gjanssens> As such it should not set YREC either.
05:57:50 <chris> \o/ exactly
05:58:27 <gjanssens> File a bug and add a PR ;) That way that bug can be solved quickly...
05:58:44 * chris wonder who will fix qif importer :-/
05:58:58 <gjanssens> Isn't that written in guile ?
05:59:18 <chris> yes 100% in guile, but UI in using C and guile salad
06:00:38 <gjanssens> Ok. The fix would probably consit of finding where "YREC" is set and change that to "CREC", ideally setting date_reconciled at the same time.
06:00:48 <gjanssens> That should even be doable in guile salad...
06:01:27 <gjanssens> The trick is to find which date_reconciled. I would assume qif also provides some kind of statement date.
06:03:40 <chris> IMHO It'll be safer to avoid setting YREC in QIF imports?
06:04:57 <gjanssens> Isn't that what I said ?
06:06:02 <chris> Yes. I meant if there's no YREC in imports then date_reconciled doesn't need to be set.
06:07:33 <chris> gtg out for a bit
06:07:44 <gjanssens> Is date_reconciled only set for YREC ? I assumed it would also be set for CREC (cleared splits). That may a completely false assumtion on my side though.
06:07:51 <gjanssens> See you later
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08:27:02 <andreas^> I'm interested in developing for Gnucash.
08:27:02 <gncbot> andreas^: Sent 42 weeks, 4 days, 13 hours, and 18 minutes ago: <chris> I think you'd budget the expense on the month you're spending it.
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10:16:27 <gjanssens> andreas^: great, what do you have in mind ?
10:21:14 <andreas^> gjanssens: I'm not sure, what is there to choose from? I'm not that into front end stuff like GUI.
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10:33:48 <gjanssens> andreas^: have you read through https://wiki.gnucash.org/wiki/GnuCash#Getting_involved_in_the_GnuCash_project ?
10:34:03 <gjanssens> It has several suggestions on how to get started
10:34:33 <andreas^> gjanssens: yes been reading it through.
10:34:57 <gjanssens> And what areas would you like to contribute to ? Code, translations,... ?
10:35:44 <gjanssens> We have a big code base. So if you're not really into front-end stuff, you may be interested in working on the engine part ("backend")
10:36:29 <gjanssens> What are youre skills ? Do you have experience with C++/C/Guile (not all are required, just trying to help you narrow down your possible starting points)
10:37:20 <gjanssens> Did you subscribe to and introduce yourself on gnucash-devel already ?
10:40:25 <andreas^> gjanssens: my interest is in code. I'm probably gonna work on backend. I have skills in C and Javascript. didn't subscribe yet.
10:41:10 <andreas^> I use this program so that's why I'm interested in developing.
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10:44:33 <gjanssens> Good. GnuCash is not using much javascript other than is a few reports. There's lots of C code though. So I would suggest you introduce yourself on the list. Not everybody is on irc all the time.
10:45:04 <gjanssens> Write about what you like to do, what you have experience with.
10:45:26 <gjanssens> Other than that a useful way to get to learn the code base is to try a solve a few bugs.
10:45:39 <gjanssens> There are plenty to choose from in our bugzilla database :)
10:46:21 <gjanssens> The wiki I linked to before will also explain our development process in more detail.
10:46:55 <gjanssens> Oh and perhaps even before all that, make sure you have set up a build environment and manage to build gnucash from source.
10:47:04 <gjanssens> That is also explained in the wiki
10:48:16 <gjanssens> And while much of the gnucash code base is still written in C, we're in the process of migrating to C++. So new code is expected to be written in C++. Bugfixes can still be in C if the code to fix is in C still.
10:48:33 <gjanssens> I have to run now. Good luck and enjoy the experience!
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13:23:36 <jralls> gjanssens, chris, date_reconciled should be set when reconciled is set to something not NREC. The date on the imported transaction would seem to be the right one for CREC, it's the date that the bank booked it and that's what "cleared" means.
13:24:46 <gjanssens> jralls: ok.
13:25:19 <jralls> Remember though that there *is* a use-case for QIF imports setting reconciled=YREC: Imports from other financial software, usually Quicken.
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14:09:05 <gjanssens> jralls: to keep in mind indeed. Can a qif file be considered a "statement" ? If so, each qif import would then need to generate a reconcile object and set the values accordingly.
14:09:30 <gjanssens> Presuming it holds a start and end balance.
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14:51:40 <jralls> gjanssens, I don't think the Quicken user migrating to GnuCash would be too happy about having to import their 10 years of data one bank statement worth at a time, especially if they have more than one financial account to import.
14:53:49 <jralls> I'm not terribly familiar with what QIF supports and what's in a QIF generated by Quicken. warlord, do you know if a Quicken-generated QIF provides any info about reconciliation other than whether a transaction is reconciled?
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14:57:19 <Peter> Hi! Thanks for GnuCash development!
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14:57:40 <jralls> Otherwise I suppose we could treat the whole import as a nominal statement and create a reconciliation object for each asset account with reconciled transactions, dated on the day of the import.
14:58:44 <jralls> In that case we might want to use the FREC flag to indicate that re-reconciliation will be difficult and perhaps prohibit editing those transactions.
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15:06:41 <warlord> jralls, I am pretty sure all it provides is the reconcile status
15:07:30 <warlord> It may or may not actually include account balances (but I don't think it can contain a start and end balance, just one -- probably the start.
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15:09:23 <jralls> Assuming it has an opening balance capability I'd think it would have to export that, and one would sum up the other transactions to get the ending balance.
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15:09:59 <warlord> Correct. But It would be up to the bank to actually include that, and frankly I doubt they do. Most likely they literally just have a list of transactions.
15:12:14 <gjanssens> There's some info on https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quicken_Interchange_Format
15:12:14 <jralls> Sorry, this isn't about banks it's about users moving from Quicken and using QIF import their data into GnuCash.
15:12:43 <gjanssens> It only mentions an opening balance in the example
15:12:57 <gjanssens> And only reconcile status, not date.
15:13:44 <gjanssens> So if a user wants to mark transactions as reconciled we have to fill in some gaps unfortunately.
15:14:10 <gjanssens> Do we invent our own or offer options to the user at that point ?
15:15:36 <gjanssens> For example it may be a convenience to create gnucash reconcile statements per month or week of import data in that case (or even day for that matter) rather than one single big statement.
15:16:52 <gjanssens> As for preventing re-reconciliation on these huge statements, I don't think it's up to us to decide on that. It depends on the user's pain treshold whether s/he is willing to re-reconcile a huge statement or not.
15:17:22 <warlord> There is no reconcile date in QIF
15:17:23 <jralls> The problem with that is that some time later the user unreconciles something and needs to go fix it. Our reconcile objects don't match the user's statements so they're a bit stuck.
15:17:52 <warlord> Then again, if the idea is only for initial import, I think it's safe to mark it all as reconciled as of the import date.
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15:18:15 <gjanssens> Re-reconciling may also not mean start from scratch. It can be: present the current reconcile state (that is all splits marked as reconciled in this statement) and all unreconciled splits.
15:18:36 <jralls> warlord, there's a bit more to the story, see https://github.com/Gnucash/gnucash/pull/667
15:19:56 <gjanssens> But yes, though we don't have to decide on immutability, we can warn the user the limited info provided to us by qif makes it impossible to nicely divide the imported data into actual bank statements, making re-reconciliation difficult.
15:20:00 <jralls> gjanssens, well, yes, but if all reconciled in this statement is thousands of splits over 10 years because of a in import that's going to be pretty daunting.
15:20:41 <jralls> s/a in/an/
15:20:56 <gjanssens> True, which is why I suggested to offer to split the reconciles into smaller bits based on a user-chosen interval.
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15:22:51 <gjanssens> Got to leave...
15:22:53 <jralls> OK. Maybe add a source field to the reconciliation object with values import and dialog and a reconciliation history report.
15:22:58 <jralls> Bye.
15:23:12 <jralls> I'll summarize this on the PR
15:23:59 <gjanssens> Thanks. Bye!
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