2020-04-26 GnuCash IRC logs
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06:42:30 <chris> I wonder what the devs here think of the latest 797659 - separate out all account types, and add the 'remainder' total - this way nobody complains
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08:07:32 <chris> jralls: I didn't comment on qif-import in cmake...because I have no idea, and I trust you've fixed it properly
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09:13:29 <warlord> fell, not my problem if he understands or not. It is what it is.
09:16:06 <fell> The difference between a newb and a noob
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09:29:26 <Phi> Hi, does someone know if there is a solution to the missing sumfield in SEPA transactions? HBCI error 9010. I just find an unresolved ticket in the AqBanking issue tracker. Thanks
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09:47:43 <fell> Phi, letzter ir bekannter Stand: https://lists.gnucash.org/pipermail/gnucash-de/2020-April/011551.html
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09:48:42 <Phi> Dank dir, ich schau mal drauf
09:58:39 <Phi> Aber ne richtige Loesung ist das auch nicht, oder?
10:16:35 <fell> Wie gesagt, Martin hat das in Arbeit.
10:17:51 <fell> Und es ist in seinem Git Repositorium https://git.aquamaniac.de/git/aqbanking
10:18:23 <fell> Wenn du selbst baust, kannst du es ja schon verwenden.
10:18:49 <fell> Falls nicht ist das Procedere:
10:20:05 <fell> Martin gibt eine neue Aqbanking Release heraus, siehe https://www.aquamaniac.de/rdm/projects/aqbanking/files
10:20:42 <fell> Ich sehe das, und aktualisiere unsere Bundles,
10:20:53 <Phi> Das hab ich so garnicht aus dem Post gelese, Danke nochmal fuers nachlegen
10:21:39 <fell> Wenn der Build-Server nicht zickt, ist es dann den nächsten Tag in den "Nightles" für Flatpak und Windows.
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10:27:09 <fell> Kein Problem ;-)
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10:33:17 <fell> For the logs: I explained the procedure from an aqbanking bug fix to a gnucash nighly.
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11:51:00 <jralls> chris, I don't see anything in the git log about 786977. Do you remember what commit fixed it?
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12:43:43 <jralls> fell, I'm inclined to not make the pdf/mobi/epub/html docs for 3.901. There's no difference to 3.10. What do you think?
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12:53:50 <Dakk> Hello! Could anyone here walk me through some beginner gnucash things? I'm just getting started with this.
12:54:13 <Dakk> In particular, I've added all my accounts except for two investment accounts i have which contain some funds and stocks
12:54:20 <jralls> Dakk, have you read the Tutorial and Concepts Guide?
12:54:42 <Dakk> I did read them and i tried to follow them by for example my stockexchange that I am trading on is not in the list to get automatic prices ?
12:55:04 <Dakk> Can i add other stockexchanges? It is called spotlight stockexchange
12:55:41 <jralls> gjanssens, GnuCash 3.901 sources are in gnucash (unstable) instead of gnucash (stable). Can I just change that in build_package.sh?
12:56:04 <jralls> Dakk: The namespaces are free text. We just provide a few examples to get you started.
12:56:40 <jralls> They're there only to help you organize the commodities should you have a lot of them; they don't do anything in the program.
12:57:42 <Dakk> Åhå. So is there some guide to add stockexchanges? I have found these IS OR ISInumbers or however they were referred to
12:58:00 <Dakk> I appreciate the help very much :)
12:58:37 <Dakk> I'm new to this book-keeping thing, I've had my excellsheet for a few months now but that is macroscopically per month thing. I'm looking forward to see where my cash actually went at the end of this pay-month.
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13:00:37 <fell> Dakk: A few pointers: https://wiki.gnucash.org/wiki/Online_Quotes
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13:01:15 <fell> https://code.gnucash.org/docs/C/gnucash-help/tips.html
13:01:35 <fell> follow also the links.
13:01:37 <Dakk> Thanks, I'll read that a litte more carefully this time.
13:03:31 <Dakk> Are you guys all finance people? What is the target group of gnucash ?
13:04:08 <fell> and the theoretical part: https://code.gnucash.org/docs/C/gnucash-guide/chapter_invest.html
13:05:21 <fell> There is a difference between a namespace as explained by jralls
13:05:49 <fell> and an onlie quote source.
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13:06:22 <Dakk> Alright, that makes sense. I got life into nothing.
13:06:35 <Dakk> I'll get back to you people when i get more trouble hehe have a good day
13:06:39 <Dakk> thanks for the help
13:06:55 <fell> For the latter google the ISIN and find one on the page which is supported by F::Q.
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13:15:59 <fell> jrall, about docs: I though, gjaanssens had announced a few updates? ;-)
13:18:16 <fell> pdf, mobi, epub make not much sense.
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13:21:20 <fell> But depending on the OS without xml/docbook or html context sensitive help will not work, I thought
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13:23:15 <jralls> Announcements notwithstanding there's nothing in the repo.
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13:25:21 <jralls> I made a tarball for the binaries and distros will be able to make packages. It's just about the docs on www.gnucash.org.
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13:38:49 <jralls> fell, What about the flatpak? It looks like flathub has only one release at a time and we don't want to make that an unstable one. Would it work to upload the flatpak I make locally to SourceForge and Github with everything else?
13:39:48 <fell> Flathub would replace 3.10 by the beta AFAIK.
13:40:00 <jralls> Right, don't want to do that.
13:45:58 <fell> in https://www.gnucash.org/docs/ we have only even minors.
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14:24:32 <gjanssens> jralls: there's also a beta branch on flathub, but I don't know how end users can install it.
14:24:41 <gjanssens> It's probably documented somewhere.
14:25:16 <gjanssens> As for the sourceforge location difference, for now just change build-package.sh
14:25:53 <gjanssens> Or perhaps we should also make an unstable branch in gnucash-on-flatpak to go with the unstable builds
14:26:15 <gjanssens> And I don't remember what I had announced for the documentation. Was that about its tool ?
14:27:02 <jralls> I found some instructions here: https://blogs.gnome.org/alexl/2019/02/19/changes-in-flathub-land/
14:28:09 <jralls> Maybe the its-tool work is what fell is thinking of.
14:29:20 <jralls> It looks from Larsson's instructions that a separate branch for gnucash-on-flatpak is what we need. It might have to be named 'beta'.
14:29:47 <fell> No, you talked with David C about CSV-im/eport
14:31:03 <jralls> The changes (i.e. s/stable/unstable) turned out to be in functions.sh, gnucash-source.json.tmpl, and gnucash-docs-source.json.tmpl.
14:32:53 <jralls> Ah, that's flywire's PRs. They're not mergeable.
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14:49:58 <jralls> gjanssens, the boost in flatpak is too old, it still uses auto_ptr in boost::filesystem. It should be at least 1.67, current release is 1.72. Any preference?
14:52:00 <gjanssens> jralls: if it builds, go for most recent
14:52:11 <jralls> OK.
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14:57:25 <codesmythe> gjanssens: When I partially answered your questions about reStructuredText and translations, I meant to also say that we can get good looking, statically hosted docs without changing away from DocBook.
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15:03:39 <jralls> codesmythe, Of course. It just requires tarting up the CSS on www.gnucash.org. But a lot of potential documentation authors are put off by having to deal with Docbook.
15:06:17 <codesmythe> jralls: I was more talking about the idea of pursing my ReadTheDoc experiment (but statically hosted). This uses the "Sphinx" tool, which uses reST as is input format. But 'pandoc' can convert from DocBook to reST, and well.
15:07:06 <codesmythe> jralls: I get the impression that existing doc folks have scaled the DocBook learning curve already, and don't really want to change, unless it is to something full WYSIWYG.
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15:09:25 <codesmythe> jralls: I agree that potiental doc authors are put off by DocBook, but existing ones have learned to cope.
15:09:42 <jralls> Coping doesn't mean like. ;-)
15:12:10 <jralls> IMO a markdown-like system would be a lot more approachable, the problem being picking which one. Everyone who cares seems to have a different favorite.
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15:14:15 <fell> I fear a descriptive Markup is ways harder to maintain than a semantic markup.
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15:16:40 <fell> It is already hard to patch changes, as the authors and they tools over the last twenty years used different indentation, linebreak, ...
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15:18:18 <fell> and I would prefer to keep URLs in Entities, because changed URLs are often forgotten in the other part and the translations.
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15:20:33 <jralls> fell, maybe you should offer to convert authors' word-processing documents to Docbook for them so that the liberal arts types don't have to struggle with XML tags.
15:21:21 <jralls> Because the way it is now the docs aren't keeping up with the code.
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15:24:28 <jralls> gjanssens, the flatpak build failed because no swig. Where's the flag that decides to pull it in?
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15:26:52 <fell> At first I would offer to convert wiki pages.
15:28:14 <jralls> LOL. Which are **markdown**.
15:29:14 <fell> E.g. the german and english AqBanking setup
15:36:54 <fell> gjanssens: https://lists.gnucash.org/logs/2020/04/26.html#T15:24:28
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15:45:45 <gjanssens> Hmm, apologies for the gjanssens-travelling account joining and leaving
15:46:08 <gjanssens> I didn't realize the irc client on my tablet continues connecting in the background
15:46:18 <gjanssens> I have now properly shut it down
15:47:14 <fell> NP.
15:48:35 <gjanssens> jralls: swig gets included via gnucash-extra-modules.json
15:49:03 <gjanssens> But for the unstable builds it can instead be included directly in org.gnucash.GnuCash.json
15:49:15 <gjanssens> It's no longer an optional build requirement there.
15:50:01 <gjanssens> The gnucash-extra-modules.json is generated from a template in templates
15:50:25 <gjanssens> It's included for git builds and omitted for tar builds atm
15:50:38 <jralls> Yeah, found the template and copied the swig line from the git one as a stop-gap.
15:51:19 <jralls> The list of modules in org.gnucash.GnuCash.json was what grep wasn't finding for me.
15:51:54 <jralls> It's no longer extra except for the last few maint builds.
15:52:02 <gjanssens> codesmythe: I had the same thought that we could use the rest version as a build output initially.
15:53:35 <gjanssens> Do you know if reST supports something like DocBook's entities, that is some kind of macro or variable one can set and reuse further in the document
15:54:42 <gjanssens> And when you write a flow like itstool is possible, do you mean you have found ways to include or omit sections based on language ?
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15:56:11 <gjanssens> I haven't read any documentation on reST or its tooling yet
15:56:16 <codesmythe> gjanssens: Yes, reST does support something like entities. It calls them substitutions.
15:56:28 <gjanssens> Cool, one more checkbox ticked
15:58:22 <gjanssens> codesmythe: out of curiosity, have you ever tried a loop conversion ? That is from docbook to reST and back ? Curious how much difference that would show (other than whitespace)
15:58:56 <codesmythe> The 'sphinx' tool extends reST in a few ways. One extention is called 'ifconfig' which lets you made simple config decisions based on values you put in a python dictionary in the config file.
15:59:22 <pohly1> I'm currently trying to import bookings via HBCI. I had gotten that sorted out beginning of this year, but haven't used it since then. Now I have one issue: I can download bookings and Gnucash tentatively imports them into the right account. But it doesn't let me reconcile any of them with existing bookings. I remember that beginning of this year there was an additional question about the mapping between the "origin account" and a Gnuca
15:59:23 <pohly1> sh account for the imported data, but I am not getting that anymore.
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15:59:56 <pohly1> Is that mapping stored in the Gnucash file or somewhere else (dconf?)
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16:03:29 <pohly1> Hmm, it looks like the bookings get imported as originating in my "Ausgaben" account instead of the account that I created for the bank.
16:04:09 <gjanssens> codesmythe: could you set up a small experiment with that ?
16:04:27 <gjanssens> And also one regarding translatations in general ?
16:04:43 <jralls> polhyl, that suggests that the online account mapping is still set to the Ausgaben account in Online Banking Setup.
16:04:54 <gjanssens> I don't expect a fully translated document, just an idea of what to expect.
16:05:32 <codesmythe> gjanssens: OK.
16:06:40 <jralls> polhyl, If you don't set up the association in the setup assistant then the first time you import with a particular online id it asks you what account goes with it and stores that.
16:07:01 <gjanssens> It's good we can self-host. One thing is still slightly bothering me (though it bothers me with the current documentation hosting as well): integration into our existing gnucash website.
16:07:27 <gjanssens> The current documentation is presented in an iframe.
16:07:55 * jralls wonders how many people actually download the pdf/epub/mobi files.
16:07:56 <gjanssens> It's a hack to be able to present the main website's menus and language selectors.
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16:08:49 <gjanssens> I have long played with the idea of changing our xslt to output html (or php) files that integrate better.
16:09:15 <gjanssens> That should not be too hard though I always had more pressing matters for my limited time.
16:09:37 <gjanssens> What options do we have with the static site generated by sphinx ?
16:10:20 <gjanssens> Can we also tweak the result to have it decorated with our current website's layout ?
16:11:01 <codesmythe> The website languages selectors don't really work for the docs though, right?
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16:11:10 <gjanssens> They do
16:11:35 <gjanssens> There's php code behind it that will select the doc in the proper language if it exists. If not it will default to English
16:12:14 <gjanssens> On a related note, I think our website itself is also in need of some attention.
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16:12:40 <gjanssens> These days it doesn't make sense any more to write hand-crafted php files.
16:12:42 <codesmythe> When I click on any language other than English, I get a red message (sometimes translated) the "document requested is not available in the requested language")
16:13:17 <gjanssens> There are static site generators now like jekyll or hugo that start from something markdown like and output a static site.
16:13:34 <gjanssens> codesmythe: hmm, that used to work in the past though
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16:14:00 <jralls> There have always been static website generators. They've mostly produced sucky html.
16:14:06 <pohly1> jralls: I went back to the online banking setup assistant and associated the online account again with the Gnucash account, but that hasn't helped and when I start the assistant another time, none of the online accounts is listed with any Gnucash account. So it looks like this setting doesn't get stored. Where should it be stored (which file)?
16:14:44 <jralls> pohyl1 are you using GnuCash 3.10?
16:15:12 <gjanssens> codesmythe: yep, a bug. The language directories on the server have changed, but the php code wasn't updated accordingly.
16:15:16 <pohly1> I am running a slightly odd setup here (gnucash in a Docker image) because my main Linux didn't have a recent enough Gnucash and I didn't want to build from source. I'm still on 3.7.
16:16:04 <jralls> pohly1, You really must use 3.10 and AQBanking 6.1.4. Pretty much everything else is broken.
16:16:05 <gjanssens> jralls: perhaps. The modern ones are becoming increasingly popular again.
16:16:21 <gjanssens> I see mention of them a lot.
16:16:26 <pohly1> Well, it worked beginning of this year ;-}
16:16:35 <gjanssens> But it's not important. I won't work on that any time soon :)
16:16:49 <pohly1> But I see that 1:3.10-1~bpo10+1 is now in buster-backports. I can switch to that.
16:17:13 <jralls> Make sure that they've got AQBanking up to date as well.
16:18:12 <pohly1> Hmm, that's only at 6.1.3.
16:18:31 <jralls> That's OK for you. 6.1.4 was an OFX fix.
16:19:54 <codesmythe> gjanssens: OK. To answer the original question, I haven't really looked at the styling options for sphinx.
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16:31:21 <fell> Pohly, du kannst auch ein Flatpak nehmen: https://wiki.gnucash.org/wiki/De/Flatpak
16:33:41 <pohly1> fell: the packages from Debian backports worked. Thanks everyone!
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16:46:46 <gjanssens> Ok got the documentation selection fixed.
16:46:51 <gjanssens> Time for bed.
16:46:53 <gjanssens> Bye all!
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16:48:51 <fell> codesmythe: While young people find dark background "cool", ergonomy says it is more stress for your eyes. And some of us had to work with phosphor green, later amber, on black for years without choice and got tired of it..
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16:56:07 <codesmythe> fell: Are you referring to the dark sidebar on the docs on ReadTheDocs? I lived through those same green-and-amber times. :-) Didn't get tried of it. Loved it when macOS got a dark mode.
16:56:42 <fell> yep
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17:08:36 <codesmythe> fell: Well, these are a ton of themes available for sphinx: https://sphinx-themes.org. We could perhaps make a handful available and let the user choose. The default would be the www.gnucash.org theme, which I think I can make work.
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17:17:49 <fell> That is a ice idea.
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17:26:22 <fell> nice
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18:18:01 <fell> jralls: did you forget to update uk.po in maint?
18:19:20 <fell> If iit is not in your queue, I can do it now.
18:19:23 <jralls> fell: Crud, did I do that in master?
18:19:53 <fell> yyep
18:27:15 <jralls> OK, I cherry-picked it back to maint and re-merged maint->master.
18:29:43 <jralls> Meanwhile the flathub build found another qif-imp missing dependency from the one that made distcheck fail yesterday. It shows that they've got 48 cores to throw at builds. Yow!
18:30:54 <jralls> Anyway, I wonder if it's worth fixing it, given how thoroughly the hide betas.
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18:34:26 <jralls> By that I mean I wonder if it's worth making a new tag and tarball for it.
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18:35:33 <fell> like the rare case, where the NASA lost a satelite. ;-)
18:36:11 <jralls> I hope nobody's using GnuCash to steer satellites!
18:38:31 <jralls> I suppose I could tag 3.901a and make a gnucash-3.901a.tar.bz2 just for flathub.
18:42:32 <chris> jralls: 786977 - PR #565 around 574d1a9
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19:12:03 <jralls> chris, the closest to 786977 in that PR is "Change the import-main-matcher tree view to use a tree store and add the matched information as a child row." (161bb5f) Is that what you mean?
19:15:34 <chris> jralls, I guess so...
19:18:28 <jralls> So that explains why it's not got its own line in the release notes. That's a pretty anodyne commit message, I figured it was part of ellipsizing the fields in the matcher. The bug isn't mentioned so it didn't get flagged as fixed.
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19:56:53 <jralls> No release today, i'm out of time and there's a circular dependency between aging.scm and receivables.scm, or at least between the scm-reports-standard-with-exposed-generators of which receivables is a part and scm-reports-common of which aging.scm is the only member.
19:57:45 <jralls> Oddly only the Windows build cares.
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