2019-10-23 GnuCash IRC logs
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03:04:58 <fell> Funny: Starting a commit with L12N:de inserts the german flag in github's commit views. :-)
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05:47:31 <pohly> Hello! I am trying to migrate from Gnucash 2.6.15 (from Debian Jessie) to 3.7 (from https://people.debian.org/~micha/PSD2). I'm not on Debian Buster yet, so I run that in a container. I can start gnucash, but loading my current .xac file triggers 10 errors like this:
05:47:31 <pohly> Error parsing SX [Universa] key [sx-debit-formula]=formula [606,56] at [606,56]: Undefined character
05:47:50 <pohly> Searching tells me that this is about a scheduled transaction.
05:49:53 <pohly> Hmm, tried to ignore it. The dialog about creating pending transactions was open. When I okay that, I get a considerable longer error pop-up with the same error also for several (all?) other scheduled transactions.
05:51:06 <pohly> But creating the transactions seems to have worked.
05:59:06 <pohly> Ah, it seems that a change in locale was causing this. I had switched from de_DE.UTF-8 to en_US.UTF-8, setting up de_DE.UTF-8 in the container and using that avoids the issue.
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06:26:49 <gjanssens> pohly: yes the way gnucash stores scheduled transaction formulas is sensitive to locale changes. I believe there's an old outstanding bug report for this.
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06:36:27 <pohly> Yeah, looks like HBCI indeed works with DKB again. Kudos to everyone who made that possible!
06:37:25 <gjanssens> \o/
06:41:16 <warlord> YAY
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06:49:41 <pohly> DKB worked entirely via the Gnucash UI.
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06:52:30 <pohly> ING-DiBa didn't: it rejected the initial access with an error about anonymous access not being supported. I suppose I have to set up manually with the aqbanking CLI? Need to find the instructions again...
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07:08:14 <fell> pohly: A few years ago the german DiBa was acquired by the dutch ING, which are not interested to support national standards.
07:09:04 <fell> There is a long story, I believe in the aqbanking archives.
07:10:08 <fell> At first they said they would shut down their FinTS server after the introduction of PSD2.
07:10:50 <fell> After many protests they keep him alive ...
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07:23:57 <fell> https://www.finanz-szene.de/digital-banking/wie-die-deutsche-ing-mit-ihren-moppernden-psd2-kunden-umgeht/
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07:31:04 <fell> gjanssens: there is still no new log in https://code.gnucash.org/builds/win32/build-logs/maint/2019-10/
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08:54:33 <gjanssens> fell: the build was stuck. I have restarted it. Hopefully this time it completes.
08:55:38 <fell> Yeah, the win users are awaiting since yesterday. ;-)
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09:13:45 <mauritslamers> Hey all, I would like some assistance in fixing a bug in the GNUcash interface, specifically the one referred here: https://github.com/Gnucash/gnucash/blob/maint/gnucash/gnome/gnc-plugin-page-invoice.c#L95
09:16:24 <mauritslamers> in short: when editing a bill, the interface uses "invoice" instead. For the dutch translation specifically this causes confusion. What could I do to help to fix this bug. The Dutch translation files are correct in translating the terms, but as the original string is used incorrectly, that doesn't help. :)
09:17:26 <mauritslamers> If I am not mistaken, the file I refer to is the one for the menu structure. I assume this is also used to generate the toolbar, as the same "translation error" occurs there.
09:18:01 <mauritslamers> And I cannot find other references to the same translation string.
09:18:07 <mauritslamers> Thanks in advance!
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09:50:25 <gjanssens> mauritslamers: there are a couple of directions you can go to handle this
09:51:32 <gjanssens> If you want the names to be very strict (like "Print Bill" vs "Print Invoice" vs "Print Expense Voucher") the only option is to deduplicate all the actions defined at the code location you refer to
09:52:18 <gjanssens> So make 3 separate print actions with different names. They can all use the same callback function as the underlying code knows how to deal with each of the three possibilities
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09:53:09 <gjanssens> Next you will then have to make only these actions visible that are relevant to the currently displayed document type and hide the others.
09:53:29 <gjanssens> This is a fair amount of work.
09:54:10 <mauritslamers> yes, I gather that. Is there a kind of state chart from which I can read which edit view is being used?
09:54:35 <gjanssens> Another way to deal with this is to go for a more neutral term that can refer to both a bill or an invoice (in Dutch, the word "Factuur" could refer to both a "Verkoopfactuur" or an "Inkoopfactuur" for example)
09:55:10 <gjanssens> In that case it's mostly a matter of adding translator comments and disabiguation prefixes in the right locations.
09:55:42 <mauritslamers> yep, that would be the shortest route, I gathered though that the problem might also exist for other languages
09:56:46 <chris> or both, "Invoice/Bill" but makes it ugly :)
09:57:19 <mauritslamers> Where is it decided which toolbar / menu structure will be shown?
09:57:45 <mauritslamers> Otherwise it could perhaps be as simple as duplicate the file and change the names
09:58:53 <mauritslamers> as far as I know in all the dialogs the correct terms are used, just not in the menu structure and the toolbar
10:00:15 <gjanssens> I would certainly not want you to "simply duplicate the file" !
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10:00:46 <gjanssens> https://github.com/Gnucash/gnucash/blob/maint/gnucash/gnome/gnc-plugin-page-invoice.c#L401
10:01:03 <gjanssens> This function shows/hides menu items (or more generally actions)
10:01:28 <gjanssens> The trick is to figure out whether the current document is an Invoice, Bill or Expense voucher
10:02:19 <mauritslamers> The reason I was suggesting to duplicate the file (and edit references of course) is that the application has more pages.
10:02:22 <gjanssens> And it gets even worse while thinking about it: there's also still credit notes, so that makes 6 possible names for each action
10:03:16 <gjanssens> Duplicating the file would mean duplicating a lot of otherwise identical code. So fixing bugs in one file would require fixing the same bug in all other files as well.
10:03:27 <gjanssens> In practice this doesn't work very well.
10:03:50 <mauritslamers> so, a base class plus subclasses which override the names could work
10:04:13 <mauritslamers> but I have little experience in this kinds of projects so that might be a rather drastic action
10:04:19 <gjanssens> Heh, this is C, not C++ :(
10:04:55 <gjanssens> Anyway, instead of duplicating the actions, yet another option is to define multiple names and select the appropriate one based on the document type.
10:05:23 <gjanssens> You can use https://developer.gnome.org/gtk3/unstable/GtkAction.html#gtk-action-set-label for this
10:05:54 <gjanssens> Early in the file you can set up a list of names.
10:06:27 <gjanssens> In the menu update function, determine the type of document and set all the action names for that document type (for each action that needs unique names based on the type)
10:06:39 <fell> Another pitfall: I open an Invoice in one tab and a credit note in another. Depending of the selected tab, the entreis have to change.
10:07:05 <gjanssens> fell, the menu update function is called when switching tabs
10:07:21 <gjanssens> So this is not an issue.
10:07:45 <mauritslamers> gjanssens: it might have been if using the duplication?
10:08:09 <gjanssens> Note GtkAction is deprecated, but we haven't switched to the replacement GAction bits yet. You can ignore the deprecation messages on the Gtk website for the time being
10:08:18 <mauritslamers> cool
10:08:37 <gjanssens> mauritslamers: what do you mean with "it might have been... ?"
10:08:55 <mauritslamers> fell's response / question about the pitfall
10:09:08 <gjanssens> Ok
10:09:49 <gjanssens> The only trick now is to figure out what the document type is in the menu update function.
10:09:52 <mauritslamers> yes...
10:10:02 <mauritslamers> looking around for things that help, but not finding yet
10:11:05 <gjanssens> I believe the way to get that is to query the GncInvoiceWindow *iw that's a private member of the GncPluginPageInvoice
10:11:06 <gjanssens> https://github.com/Gnucash/gnucash/blob/maint/gnucash/gnome/gnc-plugin-page-invoice.c#L287
10:11:25 <gjanssens> Sorry, the "InvoiceWindow"
10:11:36 <mauritslamers> it looks like the invoice has a type property
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10:17:09 <fell> I would prefer to have some switch filling N_("_Edit %s")
10:17:47 <fell> to reduce the number of translatable strings.
10:18:45 <mauritslamers> fell: that looks like a clever thing to do, but the word order in languages doesn't always allow this kind of approach
10:19:07 <gjanssens> Word order can be handled via gettext.
10:19:25 <fell> The order is no problem, but other parts of the gramar can.
10:19:28 <mauritslamers> I mean: the word for %s might fall apart in two words which have to be put somewhere
10:19:49 <gjanssens> But aren't there languages in which the command "Edit" has to be translated differently depending on the noun it's combined with ?
10:20:02 <mauritslamers> very likely
10:20:51 <gjanssens> Regardless of this, it will still be necessary to find the invoice being displayed in the pluginpageinvoice widget.
10:20:51 <fell> I am not sure, but think about m,f,d
10:21:12 <fell> m,f,n
10:21:14 <gjanssens> It looks like this is currently not exposed.
10:21:40 <mauritslamers> gjanssens: but dialogs don't have that problem?
10:22:02 <mauritslamers> or is that because the approach customer / vendor is used there?
10:22:30 <gjanssens> The only interface between GncPluginPage and an invoice is the InvoiceWindow. This has the invoice details but no interface to expose it to its callers
10:22:51 <gjanssens> Most dialogs are managed from that InvoiceWindow, which does know about the invoice.
10:24:11 <gjanssens> So I think you'll have to add a getter function to the InvoiceWindow interface to get the invoice, or at least the type.
10:24:55 <gjanssens> With that information you can then go and change the action names.
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10:28:39 <chris> I think scm approach to bug 797326 is better than C approach
10:29:19 <gjanssens> chris: of course you do :p
10:29:32 <chris> :)
10:30:20 <fell> Sure, LISP was a AI language, while C is higher assembler. ;-)
10:31:47 <gjanssens> chris: in this case though I tend to agree with you. The function seems to serve only the budget reports.
10:31:55 <chris> \o/
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10:45:51 <chris> does C has a deprecation function like issue-deprecation-warning?
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10:50:05 <mauritslamers> gjanssens: mmm, just wondering whether this can actually be modelled like the window title
10:50:22 <mauritslamers> The window title has some approach to deal with the window type
10:52:09 <mauritslamers> https://github.com/Gnucash/gnucash/blob/maint/gnucash/gnome/dialog-invoice.c#L1951
10:52:26 <mauritslamers> and that is essentially the same information as needed for bill vs invoice
11:02:06 <gjanssens> mauritslamers: it's similar in concept indeed.
11:02:50 <gjanssens> However the title is shared by an InvoiceWindow and a GncPluginPageInvoice
11:03:03 <gjanssens> The menu items and tool bar buttons are not
11:03:13 <gjanssens> They are only used by a GncPluginPageInvoice
11:03:44 <gjanssens> So the logic to come up with the proper action name should be inside GncPluginPageInvoice, not InvoiceWindow
11:05:02 <gjanssens> As an InvoiceWindow currently doesn't expose an invoice type, nor an invoice, GncPluginPageInvoice currently has no way of doing so.
11:05:18 <gjanssens> It has no information to start from.
11:05:57 <gjanssens> That's why I suggested a getter function be added to InvoiceWindow to get the invoice type (preferably) or the invoice directly
11:06:21 <gjanssens> That way you can mimic the Window title logic for the actions
11:06:34 <gjanssens> in GncPluginPageInvoice
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11:15:03 <chris> jralls off now let me know preferred solution
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11:17:18 <mauritslamers> yep, makes sense... it requires exposure of the GncInvoiceType enum to the GncPluginPageInvoice though
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11:19:51 <gjanssens> Thas seems to be the cleanest indeed
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11:26:53 <gjanssens> mauritslamers: on the other hand when looking closer it seems to me the object separation is not very clear anyway.
11:27:06 <mauritslamers> gjanssens: it looks like the InvoiceWindow does not keep a reference to the invoice struct
11:27:45 <gjanssens> While the actions are defined in GncPluginPageInvoice, the functions actually implementing cut/copy/paste etc are all defined in InvoiceWindow
11:28:12 <mauritslamers> so, either I have to keep a reference to the invoice object on the invoicewindow to create a getter, or I simply add a type field to the invoicewindow
11:28:16 <mauritslamers> and set it directly
11:29:31 <gjanssens> mauritslamers: this is probably because the InvoiceWindow won't always have an invoice. It may simply not exist yet.
11:29:56 <gjanssens> That's probably also why the window title is based on the owner type and is_credit_note
11:31:00 <gjanssens> You can base your getter on that internally: owner type and is_credit_note and then have it return the appropriate GncInvoiceType enum value.
11:31:25 <mauritslamers> yep, sounds like the way to go
11:32:18 <gjanssens> For consistency I'd then use this same invoice type getter in InvoiceWindow's title getter and make the case statement use GncInvoiceTypes
11:32:35 <mauritslamers> yes, I had the same idea
11:32:41 <gjanssens> :)
11:40:14 <mauritslamers> gjanssens: style question: I am now using a return in the case lemma of the switch statement. Is that stylewise ok? Should I then also omit the return statement?
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11:45:45 <gjanssens> mauritslamers: I'm not sure what you mean. Can you post an example on pastebin or something like that ?
11:47:20 <mauritslamers> gjanssens: https://gist.github.com/mauritslamers/0e09322d05fc122f87695456e7a6f8d5
11:47:54 <mauritslamers> I meant to write "should I then also omit the break keyword" :)
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11:48:59 <gjanssens> That makes more sense :)
11:49:25 <gjanssens> I tend to omit it if the case ends in a return statement
11:51:00 <mauritslamers> next thing is that the texts of the menu items seem to be statically defined
11:51:37 <mauritslamers> https://github.com/Gnucash/gnucash/blob/maint/gnucash/gnome/gnc-plugin-page-invoice.c#L96
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12:03:36 <mauritslamers> gjanssens: this one is a bit complex. I don't completely see how I could update the labels correctly
12:04:27 <mauritslamers> trying to update the label of each action could work but that also requires rebuilding the static logic as it is defined on line 96
12:07:19 <gjanssens> Why do you need to rebuild it ? That logic only defines the actions. You can make changes to these actions later on as you see fit.
12:08:13 <gjanssens> Look for example at how a short label is set based on the static array of action_toolbar_labels defined here: https://github.com/Gnucash/gnucash/blob/maint/gnucash/gnome/gnc-plugin-page-invoice.c#L265
12:09:10 <mauritslamers> ah, yes, that makes sense
12:09:12 <gjanssens> You can generate similar static lists for the full names based on invoice type and use similar code to set the appropriate names when it makes sense (ie in the menu update function)
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12:33:36 <mr101freaking> Hi is anybody here who has expierience using gnucash with Deutsche Bank?
12:33:36 <gncbot> mr101freaking: Sent 24 weeks, 2 days, 18 hours, and 36 minutes ago: <fell> For FinTS specific questions you would better ask on https://lists.gnucash.org/mailman/listinfo/gnucash-de or https://lists.aquamaniac.de/listinfo/aqbanking-user
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12:35:26 <fell> Guck z.B. mal in https://lists.gnucash.org/pipermail/gnucash-de/2019-October/thread.html
12:35:57 <mr101freaking> @me?
12:35:57 <gncbot> mr101freaking: Error: "me?" is not a valid command.
12:36:10 <fell> Yep
12:36:15 <mr101freaking> k danke ^^
12:37:20 <fell> oder https://www.aquamaniac.de/rdm/projects/aqbanking/wiki/AqBanking6_Bankentabelle
12:38:30 <fell> Ich habe echt keinen Überblick mehr, wer mit welcher Version bei welcher Bank wie erfolgreich war.
12:39:50 <fell> AUf jeden Fall brauchst du eine Testversion. Gnucash 3.7 brachte leider noch nicht alle erforderlichen Merkmale mit.
12:39:57 <mr101freaking> dietabelle ist ja sehr überschaulich
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12:42:04 <fell> Vor einem Monat war es erst ein Bruchteil der jetzigen Einträtge
12:42:13 <mauritslamers> gjanssens: interesting: there is a string which is not translated for the tooltip. "Move to the blank entry at the bottom of the Invoice" has no versions for bill or voucher
12:42:30 <mr101freaking> oh
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12:46:33 <gjanssens> mauritslamers: I'd change that string to become "Move to the blank entry at the bottom of the ledger"
12:46:51 <mauritslamers> will do
12:47:03 <fell> mauritslamers: or ... bottom of the document
12:47:15 <gjanssens> Or even drop the "at the bottom ..." completely
12:47:40 <gjanssens> mauritslamers: I'll note you're effectively solving https://bugs.gnucash.org/show_bug.cgi?id=743943 :)
12:47:54 <gjanssens> Be sure to mention that bug reference somewhere in your commits
12:47:56 <fell> not at bottom, but of ...
12:48:21 <mauritslamers> will do
12:48:51 <mauritslamers> gjanssens: I can change that string, but then it becomes untranslated
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12:49:25 <gjanssens> That's ok. Translators will pick it up in their next translation rounds
12:49:50 <mauritslamers> I am trying to verify with the strings I make that they actually do exist... or should I be free and add new ones?
12:50:27 <mauritslamers> there are more strings that have invoice in them, for which no "bill" or "voucher" version exist
12:50:41 <fell> we have already over 5k strings, so recycling is preferred.
12:51:29 <mauritslamers> fell: Ok, will try then to shorten them and omit these specifics where possible
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12:55:19 <mauritslamers> I will have to add one or two though, as otherwise things are even more confusing: "create a new invoice for the same owner" should also get a create a new bill for the same owner. in the invoice version owner is translated as customer, whereas in the second it would be vendor
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12:59:29 <gjanssens> mauritslamers: ok. Keep in mind there are always 3: bills, invoices and employee vouchers
12:59:47 <mauritslamers> yes, and credit notes for all of them
12:59:49 <mauritslamers> so 6
13:00:57 <gjanssens> So wouldn't it be more useful to refer to documents rather and invoices/bills/... in the tooltip ?
13:02:08 * gjanssens thinks it may have been a mistake to put invoices and credit notes behind the same menu item
13:03:19 <mauritslamers> is it the case that if one presses the "create a new %s for the current owner" there is still a choice afterwards between invoice/credit note and bill /debit note?
13:03:32 <mauritslamers> or is there no translation for debit note as such?
13:04:48 <mauritslamers> (doesn't look like afaics
13:06:44 <fell> Sometimes it is useful to run make pot and the search gnucash.pot for references of strings.
13:07:25 <mauritslamers> fell: I am using the dutch po file to search for strings, I assume that should contain everything, or am I mistaken?
13:07:50 <fell> I fear, it is not recent.
13:08:13 <mauritslamers> ok, np :) Thanks for the tip!
13:09:13 <fell> "POT-Creation-Date: 2018-03-25 12:40-0700\n"
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13:09:52 <fell> It seems, Mark had not much time.
13:10:45 <thoth1> I have an old scheduled transaction that has no templates in it. I am trying to create the template transaction, but I can't seem to get the cursor into any of the dollar fields. Is this a known bug, or is there a button I need to click first?
13:12:19 <thoth1> oh, I had to go to the very bottom to create a new one. The light orange blank stuff was just a confusing decoy.
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14:26:42 <mauritslamers> fell: sorry to bother you, but I have some issues trying to create the gnucash.pot file: none of the instructions of the wiki work
14:26:53 <mauritslamers> make pot doesn't work as it complains there is no make file
14:28:06 <fell> At first are you using make or ninja?
14:28:59 <fell> Then you have to call it in your build directory
14:29:31 <fell> You configured CMake?
14:31:10 <mauritslamers> I tried to run cmake but it failed, I will first try to see it through... just for my clarity: cmake is to create the Makefile?
14:32:18 <fell> mauritslamers: https://wiki.gnucash.org/wiki/Translation#Get_a_fresh_template
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14:32:47 <mauritslamers> if you start from there, cmake is never mentioned :)
14:33:04 <fell> See Building to set up your build environment depending on your OS.
14:36:04 <fell> https://wiki.gnucash.org/wiki/Building
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20:01:07 <tortoise> Hi all, I'm trying to get my own accounts in gnucash. I'd like to be able to set the destination account for a group of transactions all at once, probably through a filter view. Is there a way to do this?
20:01:48 <tortoise> "get my own accounts" should probably read "set up my own accounts". I want to get historical data so I can view where I have been spending my money and use it to make a budget going forwards.
20:02:45 <tortoise> but it's quite tedious to manually edit all of the monthly transactions with a title of "VISA PAYMENT" or so.
20:07:54 <warlord> tortoise, no, there is no way to modify multiple transactions at once...
20:08:22 <warlord> Unless you want to move *all* the transactions from one account into another account, in which case you can delete the first account and GnuCash will ask where to move them, and you can select the new one.
20:10:03 <tortoise> Thanks, warlord. If I added a feature like this, would it be accepted? Any pointers as to where to start?
20:10:46 <tortoise> I expect it would be generally useful for setting up accounts or importing (though the Bayesian inference might work well later on)
20:11:48 <warlord> tortoise, honestly, I have no idea where you would start. The infrastructure just isn't set up to let you modify multiple transactions at once.
20:12:09 <warlord> you *can* manipulate multiple txns at once during an import session.
20:12:16 <warlord> That and deleting are pretty much it.
20:12:37 <tortoise> I didn't see how you would select multiple transactions during an import session.
20:12:53 <warlord> Depends on which import method.
20:13:02 <tortoise> This data is all coming from imports, so that might be a way to go.
20:13:10 <warlord> QIF maps accounts and transactions with common Payee/Memo entries.
20:13:47 <warlord> So you can say map Category X -> GnuCash Expense account Expenses:Y
20:14:09 <tortoise> That's exactly what I want. It looks like I can get QFX, OFX or CSV, not QIF, though.
20:14:35 <tortoise> and it might be a memo matching some exact string or pattern rather than a category in the data file
20:15:00 <tortoise> I'll have a look at CSV import, I didn't see it for QFX
20:15:15 <warlord> Well, in QIF you can only match on full strings.
20:15:27 <warlord> For the "generic" importer you can match on tokens
20:15:45 <warlord> Let me guess -- you have tons of transactions in "Imbalance" and want to move them?
20:17:52 <tortoise> yeah, to various different accounts
20:18:56 <warlord> If you have txns in imbalance, it means you didn't import them correctly.. namely, you should be setting the accounts during import.
20:19:06 <warlord> The importer only learns when you assign them during import.
20:19:11 <warlord> If you don't, the importer wont learn.
20:21:02 <tortoise> okay, but that means I either have to do all (thousands of) transactions from history or do them in smaller batches. I was hoping to get the data in and fix it up according to categories. It sounds like the importer could do that if I train it.
20:21:52 <warlord> Yep
20:22:17 <warlord> SOP is to import in small batches to train, then load in larger and verify the mappings.
20:22:34 <tortoise> okay, thanks.
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20:23:25 <tortoise> Did I miss this in the online docs, or is there somewhere I can put it to save you answering questions directly in the future?
20:24:09 <warlord> You can try the FAQ?
20:24:37 <tortoise> Okay, I'll see if I can find somewhere to give back. Thanks a lot, warlord.
20:25:01 <warlord> you're welcome. Happy GnuCashing.
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