2017-07-06 GnuCash IRC logs
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10:18:59 *** ChanServ sets mode: +qo warlord warlord
10:19:02 *** warlord sets mode: +o gncbot
10:19:11 <warlord> @op fell
10:19:12 *** gncbot sets mode: +o fell
10:20:03 <fell> Thanks, warlord! :-)
10:24:48 <fell> Oh, we have https://wiki.gnucash.org/docs/ru/ now!
10:26:15 <warlord> fell: Great.
10:26:27 <kinlo> does gnucash support multiple dates per row?
10:26:35 <fell> Hm, pdf needs cyrilic fonts and mobi improved formatting
10:27:51 <kinlo> when I have money departing one bank, it can arrive multiple days later on the other bank, so entering it in gnucash is always anoying, which date to use as I have 2 banks claiming a different date in the bank statements
10:28:19 <warlord> kinlo: What multiple dates do you want? There ARE multiple dates in a Transaction, specifically the Post Date (which is what you see) and the Entered Date and Reconcile Date (which are internal).
10:28:39 <warlord> You should always use the date that you initiate the transaction (or write the check)
10:28:48 <fell> Kinlo, best practice is, to use an current asset "Money in transfer"
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10:28:51 <warlord> if you MUST have the dates "correct" then you need to use a suspense account.
10:29:11 <kinlo> so use an intermediate account, got it. I'll consider that, thanks
10:29:21 <warlord> fell: do I need to install additional font packages?
10:29:35 <warlord> kinlo: note that if you do that you'll lose information
10:29:53 <fell> Warlord, I don't know in the moment.
10:30:06 <warlord> fell: just let me know ...
10:30:54 <kinlo> it's also a big hassle imho, I'm just having sometimes 15 days between transfers (belgian banks suck) which makes it a hell to match/verify bank statements. But I'll manage
10:31:33 <warlord> Wow! 2 weeks for a transfer to clear?!? That's almost as bad as a US Check!
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10:32:14 <kinlo> it is actually for my credit cards, and in my advantage (15 days I don't have to pay yet) but yes, it is confusing
10:32:17 <fell> Kinlo: That is against EU rules for sepa transactions.
10:33:26 <fell> OK CCs might behave different.
10:33:30 <kinlo> well, it is usually just 1 or 2 workdays, but the credit cards are 15 days
10:33:47 <kinlo> and it is in my advantage
10:34:49 <fell> Credit cards are a current liability. Often they charge you one month later.
10:36:24 <warlord> Is this a transaction that you expect to fire in the future? Or does it Credit your bank now and then Debit the CC 15 days later?
10:38:32 <kinlo> The credit card account has all the charges, at a given time it goes to 0 by a big deposit on the credit card account, which is always near the end of the month. The money is then deducted from my regular account weeks later
10:40:33 <kinlo> but it's okay, I'll manage. it's just one specific bank and always with the same transaction, so I know to expect it to be out of order
10:40:38 <fell> Then you might use under liabilities the equivalent for "Money in transfer"
10:40:57 <kinlo> yeah exactly, just for that one account I could do so
10:41:55 <kinlo> I still hope the banks wake up to 2017 and start doing transactions in realtime
10:42:29 <kinlo> I know they can do it, certain payments are visible in webbanking within an hour or 2, other payments still take days
10:43:35 <fell> You could see it also as if they invoice you at ultimo with 2 weeks time to pay.
10:44:07 <kinlo> well, days - it's always next businessday, but that can be 2-3-4 days with a few holidays in between
10:44:37 <kinlo> yeah, exactly, but I;ll just get an intermediate account for that bank :)
10:46:08 <warlord> For example, when I use my bank's web-pay form to pay a transaction at a future date, I enter the transaction at that future "when it fires" date.
10:46:39 <kinlo> yeah, but in that case the transaction happened on that future date
10:47:58 <warlord> correct.
10:48:09 <warlord> (sorry, I had typed that a while ago but didn't send it)
10:48:58 <kinlo> anyone here knows more details about the new eu rules concerning fintech?
10:49:24 <kinlo> is it correct to assume that all banks will be required to provide an universal API to the bank for free?
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11:06:08 <kinlo> hmmmz, it doesnt say free, but PSD2 does seem to imply that third parties could get access to the banking data of endusers, given permission...
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11:52:33 <fell> kinlo, perhaps the aqbanking-user mailinglist is a better place for that theme?
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13:16:52 <fell> Warlord, I just see DiMang asked for a gnucash-ru mailing list.
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13:46:54 <warlord> Did he?
13:47:27 <fell> yep, his last mail in "Russian translation - need help placing"
13:47:30 <warlord> I'm happy to create one if 1) there's actually a group of people who want one (I'd like to see more than one person), and 2) someone offering to moderate.
13:47:59 <warlord> What's the timestamp on that message? I don't see it at the top of my inbox.
13:48:46 <fell> 03.07.2017 20:35 (CEST)
13:49:36 <fell> Mon, 3 Jul 2017 20:35:00 +0200
13:50:26 <fell> There seem to be at least 3 people involved in the translation
13:50:29 <warlord> Oh. Days ago.
13:50:50 <fell> You have been long away ;-=
13:50:51 <warlord> I've got ~4000 messages in my inbox I need to go through. I was on holiday and it... accumulated.
13:51:20 <jralls> It does that. :-/
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13:57:04 <fell> Hi jralls!
13:57:30 <jralls> Hullo, fell.
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14:02:07 <mlt-> hi
14:02:33 <mlt-> Any1 on Windows with 2.6.17? I have problem importing everything resulting in crash... ofx, qfx, qif, csv
14:02:52 <mlt-> I thought to ask around before submitting a bug report
14:05:55 <mlt-> Anyhow... here is the file with numbers changed https://www.dropbox.com/s/h2eb01clmbkxupv/gnucash_windows_ofx_import_crash.ofx?dl=0
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14:07:58 <fell> mlt, I am no Windows expert. Can you follow https://wiki.gnucash.org/wiki/FAQ#Troubleshooting_and_Improvements and put it all in bugzilla?
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14:11:12 <mlt-> fell: I think it is windows specific. Gut feeling is that underlying libraries were changed. I tried within a brand new xml storage. I just feel uncomfortable submitting bug report without stack trace :-) Oh well
14:13:16 <fell> Sometimes the tracefile gives a good hint.
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14:14:05 <mlt-> fell: It is somewhat a pita to build on windows with all dependencies....*sighs*
14:14:49 <mlt-> here it is https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=784632
14:16:58 * mlt- about to try with 2.6.16
14:17:14 <fell> Oh, Windows 10 Pro Insider Preview might be problematic.
14:17:56 <mlt-> I doubt... I use lots of other software alright. I'm in Emacs ERC right now for example
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14:19:59 <warlord> fell: FYI, the docs need to be manually copied to www
14:20:07 <warlord> (your #3 issue in the email)
14:20:56 <fell> We have no script in the release process?
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14:22:37 * fell reads https://wiki.gnucash.org/wiki/Documentation_Release_Process
14:22:47 <warlord> We probably do, but I think it was added after .17 was tagged
14:24:22 <fell> I merged the first ru branch on 2017-06-30
14:26:25 <warlord> But when did jralls branch .17?
14:26:49 <fell> up to PR#97 is everything in .17
14:27:37 <fell> Oops, wrong view
14:28:35 <fell> jralls updated ru.omf before the release
14:30:10 <jralls> There's no such thing a s "branch .17" in git. I tagged .17 last friday and pushed the built docs to gnucash-htdocs-docs on Sunday. Three's a receive hook in code that transfers that repo to www. It always hangs on my end but also always gets the updates over.
14:31:15 <jralls> However I didn't update it to include the russian translation. That's nowhere near complete enough to be useful, and Dmitri has asked only for it to be in the nightlies while they work on it.
14:31:37 <fell> There is no need to create /ru manually?
14:33:18 <jralls> There is, in gnucash-htdocs-docs, and also to add it to copy-docs.sh in that repo. Just not until they have enough translated to show to users.
14:34:36 <jralls> I had to fix the omf filename to get it to pass make check, and the russian translation work-in-progress is in the tarballs.
14:35:00 <fell> That is fine. I was not shure I had something forgotten
14:35:44 <jralls> Well, you forgot to make sure that make check passed before you pushed... ;-)
14:36:44 <jralls> (Is "shure" the German spelling of "sure"? Over here "Shure" is a brand of microphones.)
14:38:06 <fell> "Sicher" in english I speak "Schuhr" and "Sch" in most cases is written "Sh" in english ;-)
14:39:51 <warlord> Sure. :)
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14:59:12 <mlt-> fell: You might be right on Win 10 Insider. I tried back till 2.6.10 ... still result is the same :( Haven't used manual import in a while. Wil try another OS..... got to go though
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16:00:55 <fell> warlord, how do you think about copying /gnucash-htdocs/images/icons/epub_logo.png and mobipocket_logo.png onto code?
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16:34:38 <warlord> fell: copy it where onto code?
16:35:08 <fell> I don't know your directory structure there.
16:35:56 <fell> that are the logos of epub and mobi files.
16:36:38 <fell> Code shows currently docs with question marks as icons.
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16:41:56 <warlord> I don't see any requests for those URLs in the HTTP logs on code.
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16:45:19 <fell> Ah, in docs.phtml they are explicitly added:
16:45:20 <fell> <a href="<?=$top_dir;?>/docs/v<?=$major_stable;?>/C/gnucash-help.epub">
16:45:23 <fell> <img class="docicon" alt="epub" title="<?php echo T_($epub);?>" src="<?=$top_dir;?>/images/icons/epub_logo.png" /></a>
16:46:21 <fell> So, I think it is too much work.
16:47:43 <fell> But for the pdfs you got icons
16:48:57 <warlord> fell: this sounds like an issue on www, not on code.
16:50:14 <fell> OK, it is not so important.
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16:52:06 <warlord> If it's an issue on code I can fix it.
16:53:22 <fell> I believe, pdf is a known document type, while epub and mobi are unknown.
16:53:57 <fell> So pdfs get an document icon and the other Question marks.
16:57:14 <fell> Because we are both here today: once we talked about I18n of the wiki ...
16:59:19 <warlord> A long time ago, I barely remember the disucssion.
17:01:39 <fell> we found 2 modules: one used the form <lang>.wiki ..., the other ...&lang=
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17:04:25 <fell> https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Manual:Wiki_family
17:06:21 <warlord> Right, one required DNS changes..
17:16:05 <fell> The qesten: a) do we want to do it, b) when will we have the time?
17:16:25 <fell> question
17:17:29 <warlord> Do we have interest in wiki translations other than de?
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17:18:00 <warlord> Also, do we really have enough people interested, and able, to keep the various localizations up to date?
17:20:08 <fell> Seeing the new start page, it came up to my mind again (reading 1 screen english text before German appears could distract readers)
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17:23:15 <fell> Category: De 35, NO 2, Es and Pt 1 each
17:27:52 <warlord> I'm happy either way..
17:28:42 <warlord> Dealing with *.wiki in DNS might be interesting in terms of SNI, but if I know a priori I can set it up. Of course Linas needs to deal with the DNS.
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17:39:49 <fell> we could start with de and add others on demand.
17:46:37 <warlord> Fair enough. Would you prefer de.wiki or &lang= ?
17:46:50 <fell> de.wiki
17:53:50 <warlord> okay. I need to step away for a while. We'll need to get Linas involved to set up the DNS and then I can configure the server. I suppose I can configure the server first, except I wont be able to get a certificate until DNS is in place.
17:54:30 <fell> OK, until ...?
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