2015-06-06 GnuCash IRC logs

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10:11:10 <candyflip> ledger refugees: how are you dealing with gnucash 2.6.x breaking ledger in debian 8 ("jessie")?
10:16:55 <candyflip> is there a way to convert a data file from 2.6.x to 2.4.x?
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11:25:04 <candyflip> Cannot find SLIB. Are you sure you have it installed?
11:25:23 <candyflip> yes, i do in fact have it installed
11:25:40 <candyflip> why can't ./configure find slib?
11:28:40 <candyflip> configure: WARNING: unrecognized options: --with-slibdir
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12:15:09 <jralls> candyflip: Sounds like you have a Guile mismatch. SLIB isn't needed for Guile2.
12:16:50 <jralls> candyflip: And there's no difference between 2.4 and 2.6 file formats. You can flip back-and-forth between 2.4 and 2.6 as long as you don't use any of the new features from 2.6 like credit memos.
12:25:19 <candyflip> jralls: I have both guile 1.8 and guile 2.0. The gc 2.4.10 ./configure script is automatically finding the 2.0 version, and that's the problem.
12:25:50 <candyflip> i need to make the ./configure script use "/usr/bin/guile-1.8"
12:27:16 <candyflip> i'm struggling to work out from the ./configure code how to do that
12:41:49 <jralls> candyflip: Pass the environment variables GUILE_LIBS and GUILE_INCS with the appropriate values to configure.
12:46:24 <candyflip> jralls: i presume that means i'll need GUILE_LIBS=/usr/share/guile/1.8, but I'm not sure what GUILE_INCS should refer to
12:48:33 <candyflip> GUILE_INCS=/usr/include/libguile?
12:49:06 <candyflip> no
12:49:22 <candyflip> I ran this and got the same problem: GUILE_INCS=/usr/include/libguile GUILE_LIBS=/usr/share/guile/1.8 ./configure
12:49:52 <candyflip> in fact, it still finds guile 2.0: "checking for guile... /usr/bin/guile"
12:53:29 <jralls> candyflip: GUILE_LIBS should point at the appropriate /usr/lib/libguile and GUILE_INCS at the corresponding headers. GnuCash needs to link guile into itself; it doesn't use the guile executable.
12:54:33 <candyflip> jralls: well certainly the ./configure script uses the guile executable, perhaps only to test the configuration
12:55:55 <candyflip> the check it does is => guile -c "(use-modules (ice-9 slib)) (require 'printf)"
12:56:55 <candyflip> maybe I should just delete the check
12:59:39 <jralls> candyflip: Ah, better answer: Geert set this up in 7bbc357: Set GUILE=guile1.8 and GUILE_CONFIG=guile1.8-config. You need GnuCash 2.4.14 or 2.4.15.
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13:22:41 <candyflip> jralls: damn.. those versions were skipped in all debian releases
13:23:42 <candyflip> i might be forced to use a tarball
13:41:04 <candyflip> jralls: where is the guile config normally? your suggestion failed, but I think it's because i need to set the right-hand side of those to something else, not literally "guile1.8-config"
13:45:34 <CDB-Man> got a question guys, for investments, like stocks, is it possible for me to realize a change in price at the end of the year?
13:45:39 <CDB-Man> like record a paper gain?
13:47:30 <CDB-Man> or would i basically have to sell it then re-buy it
13:47:37 <candyflip> jralls: http://sprunge.us/MjAj <= that's what I get when I run ./configure
13:48:46 <candyflip> CDB-Man: not sure what country you're in.. but generally you probably must sell and re-buy
13:49:00 <candyflip> and even sell/rebuy isn't good enough
13:49:20 <CDB-Man> canada
13:49:21 <candyflip> you should wait ~3+ months before rebuying
13:49:30 <CDB-Man> no i mean in gnucash
13:49:31 <candyflip> well, i don't know canada rules
13:49:48 <candyflip> ah, i was thinking it was a tax question
13:49:51 <CDB-Man> if there's any accountants here, im trying to follow ifrs
13:50:02 <CDB-Man> where you ecord paper gains at the end of the year
13:50:04 <CDB-Man> record*
13:50:23 <CDB-Man> i work in accounting and currently specialize in tax lol
13:50:45 <CDB-Man> but yeah, in gnucash, is there a way to record a paper gain, or is the only way to sell and rebuy?
13:51:34 <candyflip> i have no idea
13:52:01 <CDB-Man> also, i ran that price quote install bat (in win7) under admin mode to install it
13:52:03 <candyflip> maybe a split
13:52:07 <CDB-Man> but gnucash doesnt recognize that its there
13:52:12 <CDB-Man> hmm, a split eh
13:52:14 <candyflip> stock splitting seems flexible in the tool
13:52:21 <candyflip> split or merge
13:52:23 <CDB-Man> maybe i can do a 1:1 split
13:52:27 <candyflip> yeah
13:52:33 <candyflip> that's what I was thinking
13:52:43 <candyflip> you would have the experiment
13:52:59 <candyflip> s/the/to
13:53:06 <CDB-Man> yeah
13:53:08 <CDB-Man> hmm
13:53:17 <CDB-Man> okay, then my next question, the finance thing
13:53:20 <CDB-Man> its not picking it up
13:53:39 <CDB-Man> but it's clearly there and works, the test script's able to call it and quote amazon
13:54:50 <CDB-Man> and another question, there's that "R" column in the transactions page, and it toggles N vs C, what does each mean?
13:55:30 <candyflip> r for reconciled
13:55:36 <candyflip> c for cleared
13:55:57 <candyflip> n probably means "new" or "not cleared"
13:56:31 <CDB-Man> hmm
13:56:55 <candyflip> usually they get toggled when you balance an account based on a monthly statement, for example
13:57:32 <candyflip> the N's become C's while you're balancing, and when you've balanced it all the C's become R's
13:57:49 <candyflip> there are some other ways to get R's though
13:58:21 <candyflip> i think if you void something it becomes an R, because it's no longer going to be used for balancing
13:59:06 <CDB-Man> hmm, i havent gotten as far as reconciling yet
13:59:16 <CDB-Man> im still trying to set it up
13:59:34 <CDB-Man> trying to code all my investments in right now, if i ever get past that then ill try to reconcile
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14:00:18 <candyflip> makes sense
14:00:20 <CDB-Man> but hrm that makes sense at least, that everything here is N for not reconciled
14:00:46 <candyflip> i wouldn't wait more than a year though.. that can really pile up
14:01:07 <CDB-Man> im already like 7 years late
14:01:08 <CDB-Man> soooooooo
14:01:14 <candyflip> i have some accounts that got out of balance years back, so they will never be balanced
14:01:17 <CDB-Man> its all just going into "opening balances" :P
14:04:53 <CDB-Man> hmm, im not certain that im using this split thing right
14:08:50 <candyflip> stock splits can be tricky.. and if you mean transaction splits those can be shakey too
14:09:45 <candyflip> transaction splits do some weird things if you have multiple different currencies
14:10:27 <CDB-Man> hmm
14:10:38 <CDB-Man> i think i might be messing with a transaction split then
14:10:44 <CDB-Man> how do i go about doing a stock split?
14:11:40 <candyflip> CDB-Man: i couldn't say.. i'm uninstalling gnucash at the moment
14:12:14 <CDB-Man> eh, reinstalling?
14:12:24 <candyflip> version 2.6.x of gnucash broke the ledger package in debian
14:12:32 <candyflip> so I'm downgrading
14:12:43 <CDB-Man> heh
14:13:10 <candyflip> and i could not have both old and new versions side-by-side because the old version is finding newer versions of libs
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14:13:18 <candyflip> it's very ugly
14:13:38 <candyflip> i really got stung upgrading to debian jessie
14:13:56 <CDB-Man> hmm, it looks like i can't do i 0 share stock split
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14:14:04 <candyflip> killed a day of my time, and i still will have to re-enter all the financial data from weeks back
14:14:18 <CDB-Man> the stock split manager doesnt let you proceed if you enter 0 units changed
14:14:23 <CDB-Man> and damn, that sounds horrible
14:15:18 <candyflip> debian is known for being a stable OS, so I wasn't as cautious as I should have been
14:16:01 <candyflip> i just upgraded the distro without first seeing if any of my tools had new bug reports
14:16:34 <candyflip> configure: error: cannot find GtkHTML >= 3.14
14:16:36 <candyflip> fuck me
14:17:15 <candyflip> i just removed gnucash 2.6.x so the old version could be compiled without interference from guile
14:17:24 <candyflip> now something else is broken
14:17:50 <candyflip> i think i need to build a VM just for debian wheezy just to run gnucash
14:18:04 <candyflip> fuck me
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14:22:22 <CDB-Man> holy crap i think i got a split transaction to work
14:23:18 <CDB-Man> http://i.imgur.com/DFNGh1A.png
14:23:33 <CDB-Man> so what i needed to do was add in more currency it looks
14:23:41 <CDB-Man> convert currency to stock units
14:23:49 <CDB-Man> in order to make the silly thing balance
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14:26:09 <CDB-Man> does that transaction look okay
14:26:10 <CDB-Man> ?
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14:34:25 <candyflip> looks very complex.. i have no idea
14:34:59 <candyflip> but with the double-accounting design, money can never get lost
14:35:19 <candyflip> just check each of the accounts involved in the split, and make sure it's correct from the standpoint of each account
14:35:35 <CDB-Man> the thing new to me here is the whole concept of share units vs currency units
14:35:43 <CDB-Man> the balances _look_ okay
14:37:16 <CDB-Man> i may just say screw it, get rid of the stock units, and just track purely "in currency"
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14:42:30 <CDB-Man> hmm, currency means its tracked as cash...
14:44:51 <kimmo2> that's what I do
14:45:16 <kimmo2> forces me to keep track of purchase prices in a separate book, but my accounts must reflect the acquisition price
14:46:02 <CDB-Man> yeah it looks like how i did it, while it works in the sense that my account has recorded the paper gain
14:46:13 <CDB-Man> i would have to track the purchase price separately like you said
14:46:44 <CDB-Man> and it looks like since its gotta get extra share units, it will come from currency which plugs into cash flow
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14:50:50 <CDB-Man> hmm maybe i can just limit the scope of the cash flow report
14:52:44 <CDB-Man> hmm, i cant get canadian shares to show up in the stock quote thing
14:57:52 <CDB-Man> hmm, finance::quote where does it send the pricing info to?
14:58:43 <jralls> candyflip: According to https://packages.debian.org/search?keywords=guile&searchon=names&suite=stable§ion=all, both guile-1.8-dev and guile-2.0-dev install /usr/bin/guile-config. So to make Geert's hack work you'll need to uninstall both, install guile-1.8-dev, rename guile-config to guile1.8-config, and then reinstall guile-2.0-dev.
15:02:04 <candyflip> jralls: thanks for the tip. I ended up removing guile 2.0 and gnucash 2.6.x, and then gc 2.4.10 was able to compile
15:02:32 <candyflip> (i had to install gtkhtml 3.14 as well)
15:03:02 <jralls> candyflip: No, you didn't. GC 2.4 works with WebKit.
15:03:22 <jralls> candyflip: But the default was gtkhtml.
15:03:49 <candyflip> ./configure was broken without gtkhtml 3.14. perhaps i could have overrode that
15:05:41 <candyflip> i have gir1.2-webkit-3.0 installed.. not sure if that could have worked
15:06:32 <jralls> candyflip: Nope. GnuCash is in C, doesn't need gobject-introspection. Besides, it uses Gtk2 so GI wouldn't do it any good anyway.
15:07:58 <jralls> candyflip: It needs the -dev packages for all of its dependencies, including WebKit, and it needs the WebKit1 API, which isn't in the latest releases of WebKit.
15:09:52 <candyflip> jralls: are you talking about compilation, or execution? I've got 2.4.10 compiled, but i've not run it yet
15:11:17 <candyflip> i have this package installed as well: libqtwebkit-dev
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15:38:36 <CDB-Man> hmm, if i want my retained earnings to reflect closed prior year entries, i assume that the close books function should work
15:39:56 <kimmo2> close books simply totals income and expense accounts into an equity account
15:40:19 <CDB-Man> hmm, so if I want to close into more than 1 equity account
15:40:30 <CDB-Man> it looks like I'll have to be doing that manually
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16:32:27 <CDB-Man> candyflip: i decided to give up on properly tracking the paper gains
16:32:41 <CDB-Man> also decided to give up tracking it in stock/commodity units
16:33:09 <CDB-Man> instead, gonna record it all in currency. going to break each stock into 2 sub accounts: cost + unrealized
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17:02:46 <candyflip> segmentation fault-- after compiling gnucash 2.4.10, and reinstalling version 2.6.4 next to it, both of them get an instant segfault
17:03:28 <candyflip> so i removed gnucash 2.4.10, all its dependancies, and also removed gnucash 2.6.4
17:03:50 <candyflip> then I reinstalled gnucash 2.6.4 from scratch, and it still gets an instant segmentation fault
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17:07:24 <candyflip> nevermind.. looks like there was still some trash laying around
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19:31:56 <CDB-Man> hmm this exchange rate thing is really annoying to use
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19:32:15 <CDB-Man> i have to enter my primary currency first, and go from there to get the foreign currency
19:32:28 <CDB-Man> aka, i cant enter the foreign currency to get the primary currency it seems...
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20:17:33 <warlord> CDB-Man: you need to be cognizant of the "transaction currency" which will affect how you need to enter it.
20:17:49 <warlord> the transaction currency comes from the register in which the transaction is first created.
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21:59:34 <CDB-Man> 8[20:17:33] @warlord: CDB-Man: you need to be cognizant of the "transaction currency" which will affect how you need to enter it. <--- hmm, well, in my case, the main currency is set to CAD, and the foreign account is set to USD
21:59:57 <CDB-Man> oh wait a second, I see what you're saying
22:00:30 <CDB-Man> that FX will always be done in the perspective of the register currency which is my default global currency
22:02:52 <CDB-Man> well, what would be great is that if there was an option, for foreign currency transactions, to allow the input in either the default register currency or the foreign currency; right now i'm manually converting my USDs into CAD and entering the CAD into the transaction, so that the program will back-translate it intot he original USD that I want
22:04:09 <CDB-Man> or at least, default to the currency of the account that I'm working with?
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22:10:02 <CDB-Man> another workaround I guess, would be to swap the debits and credits around, and enter my foreign (USD) number as a negative
22:10:24 <CDB-Man> since the fx tool only works 1 direction, so ill reverse my inputs
22:23:49 <warlord> It should default to the current of the current open register.
22:23:59 <warlord> If you have a USD register open then transactions should be in USD
22:26:55 <warlord> (granted, this code has changed so I'm not 100% sure what the current behavior is)
22:39:06 <CDB-Man> by register, you mean...
22:39:26 <CDB-Man> as in a specific .gnucash db file?
22:39:35 <warlord> No, register... as in open account register
22:40:02 <CDB-Man> ah, as in when I double click and opan an account's transaction details
22:40:29 <CDB-Man> well, right now, if I open the register for lets say "USD Investment Account"
22:40:44 <CDB-Man> and I enter a debit to reflect a purchased USD stock, then that's entered int USd
22:40:59 <CDB-Man> then when I enter the corresponding credit into CAD Cash,
22:41:10 <CDB-Man> it requests the amount to be entered there in CAD
22:43:00 <CDB-Man> in my case, I have an "unrealized gains" account where I want to record paper gains
22:43:27 <CDB-Man> so I would debit unrealized gains in USD, and want to credit an equity and/or revenue account, all of which are in CAD
22:43:46 <warlord> right....
22:43:53 <CDB-Man> so, it would make sense if I could enter the USD value into the revenue/equity, and do the forward conversion there to CAD
22:43:55 <warlord> it sounds like you want the transaction to be in CAD..
22:44:05 <warlord> ... so you need to enter it from a CAD account register.
22:44:12 <CDB-Man> as opposed to having to do the FX backwards
22:44:22 <warlord> FX?
22:44:31 <CDB-Man> Foreign eXchange
22:45:13 <warlord> Ah, never seen that shorthand before.
22:45:44 <warlord> But like I just said; it sounds like you want the txn in CAD, which means you need to create it from a CAD register.
22:45:52 <CDB-Man> hmm
22:46:13 <CDB-Man> okay, so you're saying to start from the renenue account instead, since that's CAD
22:47:22 <CDB-Man> let's see how this works
22:47:56 <warlord> Well, I'd work it from an asset or liability account instead of an expense or income account..
22:51:56 <CDB-Man> well, what I meant is that in my example, as the asset is the USD account, then I would want ot go to the balancing account, which was a revenue
22:52:37 <CDB-Man> and I'm using a revenue account to record unrealized paper gains at the end of the accounting period
22:52:54 <CDB-Man> increase in fair value of the asset during the reporting period
22:53:36 <CDB-Man> and yeah, your tip to start from the CAD register works; the translation sheet how lets me input the USD to be converted
22:53:37 <CDB-Man> thanks
22:53:55 <warlord> You're welcome.
22:55:50 <CDB-Man> how -> now
23:10:28 <CDB-Man> hmm, another question
23:10:44 <CDB-Man> since USD is my foreign currency, and all i've entered so far are purchases of USD stocks,
23:11:10 <CDB-Man> the trading > currency > USD account now has a huge negative balance... is that how it's supposed to work?