2014-02-02 GnuCash IRC logs

01:21:28 <fell> warlord: the wiki has a higher latency than before.
01:28:24 <fell> The IRC log files have again redundant URLs.
02:17:23 *** fell_ has joined #gnucash
02:17:24 *** gncbot sets mode: +o fell_
02:22:34 *** fell has quit IRC
02:23:52 *** fell_ is now known as fell
02:47:47 *** jmd has joined #gnucash
04:09:06 *** jralls_afk has quit IRC
04:09:56 *** \Mike has joined #gnucash
04:54:51 *** gjanssens has joined #gnucash
04:54:53 *** gncbot sets mode: +o gjanssens
05:02:37 *** gjanssens_ has joined #gnucash
05:02:39 *** gncbot sets mode: +o gjanssens_
05:06:23 *** gjanssens has quit IRC
05:10:35 *** gjanssens_ is now known as gjanssens
05:12:16 <gjanssens> @tell warlorld I saw your message about git issues on new-code. My first attempt today to connect to a git repo failed with Connection closed by 2001:4830:143:ca54::c0de so there's not much I can do from a distance
05:12:16 <gncbot> gjanssens: The operation succeeded.
05:22:21 *** gjanssens has quit IRC
05:32:12 *** gjanssens has joined #gnucash
05:32:13 *** gncbot sets mode: +o gjanssens
05:33:26 *** jmd` has joined #gnucash
05:36:00 *** user has joined #gnucash
05:38:51 *** jmd` has quit IRC
05:42:55 <user> how would one deal with different entry/value dates in a checking account?
05:44:57 *** jmd has quit IRC
05:50:33 *** gjanssens has quit IRC
05:54:24 <user> shadow income/expense accounts for that checking account, i guess
06:31:13 *** gjanssens has joined #gnucash
06:31:13 *** gncbot sets mode: +o gjanssens
06:44:39 *** gjanssens has quit IRC
07:00:44 *** gjanssens has joined #gnucash
07:00:44 *** gncbot sets mode: +o gjanssens
07:06:15 *** jmd has joined #gnucash
07:09:48 *** gjanssens has quit IRC
07:10:28 *** gjanssens has joined #gnucash
07:10:28 *** gncbot sets mode: +o gjanssens
07:31:35 *** gjanssens has quit IRC
07:32:07 <\Mike> "Unable to retrieve quotes for these items: CURRENCY:USD" Hmm...
07:32:23 <\Mike> (Yes, F::Q is installed and works)
07:49:24 <\Mike> echo '(yahoo "CSCO")' | gnc-fq-helper seems to work; corresponding with '(currency "USD" "EUR"))' doesn't (response: (#f) )
07:51:53 *** gjanssens has joined #gnucash
07:51:53 *** gncbot sets mode: +o gjanssens
07:54:04 <warlord> gjanssens: I get "fatal: Could not read from remote repository. Please make sure you have the correct access rights and the repository exists."
07:54:40 <warlord> fell: What do you mean "redundant URLs"?
07:55:09 <warlord> user: What do yo mean "different entry/value dates"?
07:55:18 <gjanssens> warlord: I get that same message after the Connection closed error
07:56:16 <gjanssens> I figure that is just a follow up message from the local git command
07:56:30 <fell> YY/MM/YYYY-MM-DD instead of simply YY/MM/DD as it was until a few years
07:57:27 *** mikee-afk has quit IRC
07:57:39 <gjanssens> fell: I never knew YY/MM/DD was available
07:57:45 <gjanssens> I always used the long format
07:57:51 <warlord> fell: "as it was until a few years" --- right, it's how it was.. I didn't change anything.
07:58:11 <warlord> I.e., it is behaving exactly how it was behaving yesterday.
07:58:29 <fell> the 2. last server had the short form
07:58:31 <gjanssens> warlord: can you clone the gitolite repos directly on code ?
07:58:45 <gjanssens> I mean, just run a git clone command locally
07:59:54 <warlord> gjanssens: yes
08:00:03 <warlord> I just cloned gitolite-admin
08:00:26 <warlord> (just using git clone, not through gitolite)
08:01:08 <gjanssens> Hmm, so git is ok, we'll have to focus on the gitolite layer
08:01:25 *** benoitg has joined #gnucash
08:02:28 <gjanssens> Would a git clone work on code using something like "git clone ssh://git@localhost/gitolite-admin"
08:02:43 <gjanssens> You'd need to have proper ssh keys available on code for this
08:03:31 <warlord> I can ssh into the system, so ssh itself is working. It's just not working when I ssh as GIT. So I think it's a gitolite issue, but I dont think it's necessarily an ssh issue.
08:04:35 <user> warlord: like when money is in transit for a few days and not instant
08:04:53 *** mikee_ has joined #gnucash
08:05:20 <warlord> user: what about it? Record the date you initiate the expenditure (i.e., the date you write the check)..
08:05:53 <warlord> The fact that someone waits a month to cash your check doesn't matter.. You need to think that the funds are already used so you don't over-withdraw
08:07:25 <user> if it's from checking account to savings account it matters
08:09:04 <warlord> If you *NEED* to have them correct then you need to have a "transit" or "suspense" account.. But if you do that you completely lose the fact that you transfered from Checking to Savings. You'll see 1 transaction from Checking to suspense, and a few days later from suspect to Savings... Without any direct means to see the real connection.
08:09:24 <warlord> In general, however, you don't need the dates to match.. These are YOUR books, not the Bank's books..
08:09:28 <gjanssens> warlord: starting with the most obvious: is the git/.ssh/AuthorizedKeys file present and has the proper public keys ?
08:09:31 <warlord> The dates wont always match.
08:09:41 <gjanssens> And proper permissions (sufficiently limited)
08:09:58 <gjanssens> authorizedkeys (lowercase)
08:10:02 <warlord> gjanssens: yes.
08:10:14 <warlord> When I run ssh -v git@code I get:
08:10:21 <warlord> ...
08:10:24 <warlord> debug1: Offering DSA public key: /home/warlord/.ssh/id_dsa
08:10:24 <warlord> debug1: Server accepts key: pkalg ssh-dss blen 433
08:10:24 <warlord> Connection closed by 204.107.200.65
08:10:42 <warlord> So it's being accepted, but then immediately being closed
08:11:04 <gjanssens> Does code run selinux ?
08:11:30 <warlord> no
08:11:46 <gjanssens> ok
08:12:03 *** mikee_ is now known as mikee
08:12:05 <mikee> @op
08:12:05 <gncbot> mikee: Error: You don't have the #gnucash,op capability. If you think that you should have this capability, be sure that you are identified before trying again. The 'whoami' command can tell you if you're identified.
08:12:25 <mikee> identify
08:12:29 <warlord> If I su git on the server I can run: echo info | /usr/share/gitolite3/gitolite-shell warlord and it works fine.
08:12:45 <warlord> so it's something in the ssh -> gitolite linkage
08:12:59 <mikee> @op
08:13:00 *** gncbot sets mode: +o mikee
08:13:09 <gjanssens> ok, is there something in the gitolite logs (to be found in $HOME/.gitolite)
08:13:37 <user> warlord: well, with HBCI i get the bank books directly and that would mean constant date miss-matches
08:15:06 <warlord> user: that's fine. GnuCash gives you wiggle-room in transaction matching.
08:16:09 <warlord> gjanssens: nope... Nothing going into the logs.
08:16:47 <warlord> AHA...
08:18:49 <warlord> There we go.
08:19:11 <warlord> Okay, it's working now :)
08:19:49 <warlord> W00t. I can git pull the admin repo now.
08:20:06 <warlord> gjanssens: would you like to do the honor of flipping that switch and giving devs access?
08:20:36 <warlord> fell: about the wiki delay -- I'm not sure how to optimize that.
08:21:12 <warlord> I suppose I can look at mysql and see about optimizing it some...
08:22:28 <gjanssens> yes, I can clone as well now
08:23:15 <gjanssens> Just curious warlord what was the issue ?
08:23:25 <warlord> I forgot to add 'git' to /etc/shadow
08:23:32 <warlord> so PAM was denying access
08:23:37 <gjanssens> Oops
08:23:41 <warlord> fatal: Access denied for user git by PAM account configuration [preauth]
08:23:44 <warlord> Yeah. Oops.
08:23:50 <gjanssens> I'm looking at the config file now
08:24:06 <gjanssens> Should I add all the devs to the devs line now ?
08:24:34 <gjanssens> Currently there's only you and me in core_devs
08:24:56 <warlord> You should add people to the appropriate lines to give access to gnucash, gnucash-docs, and gnucash-htdocs
08:25:16 <warlord> (and also turn on email for all of them)
08:25:21 <warlord> Please, be my guest!
08:25:28 <gjanssens> gnucash-htdocs is already set up
08:25:50 <gjanssens> I have no history of who had access to what repo in svn though
08:26:01 <gjanssens> I remember this was not fully equal on all
08:27:43 <warlord> gjanssens: did you not have access to the svn configs?
08:28:18 <gjanssens> I did, but I don't have a working copy of that available
08:28:24 <gjanssens> I only looked at it using trac
08:28:26 <warlord> (it's in the commit-access-control.cfg in svn-hooks
08:28:48 <warlord> Hmm.. not sure if the hooks are visible though trac
08:29:09 <gjanssens> In that case I never saw it
08:29:15 <warlord> Okay, give me a sec.
08:30:09 <warlord> gjanssens: check your inbox
08:30:34 *** Jimraehl1 has left #gnucash
08:32:17 <gjanssens> warlord: thanks
08:32:21 *** Jimraehl1 has joined #gnucash
08:38:19 <warlord> I've updated the news file on the website.
08:42:57 <warlord> oops, forgot to push.
08:44:34 <gjanssens> Ok git on code is open for business ;)
08:45:14 <gjanssens> I haven't copied the old access rules for all the old gsoc branches
08:45:32 <gjanssens> Only the main devs and the additions for docs/htdocs
08:45:41 <warlord> gjanssens: that's fine, I think.
08:45:51 <gjanssens> I think so too
08:45:57 <warlord> If one of those GSoC guys comes back we can add them back in
08:46:06 <gjanssens> New work should not happen on branches directly on code anyway
08:46:08 <warlord> (I have no idea how to set up access just to a git branch)
08:46:16 <gjanssens> But in a cloned repository
08:46:31 <gjanssens> We'd just merge their work in as soon as it's stable enough
08:46:34 <warlord> True... Perhaps we should do that via github
08:46:41 <gjanssens> I think so
08:47:52 <warlord> Sweet. So any bugs so far (other than wiki being more lagged?)
08:48:02 <warlord> fell: I plan to turn on "image upload" in the wiki.
08:48:16 <warlord> I just need to figure out how to limit that to only a few (admin) users
08:50:04 <warlord> Also, one new feature of the new server: it's running fail2ban.. So login failures automatically unban after 10 minutes. This means: if you lock yourself out you don't need to contact me; it will unban after 10 minutes! :)
08:50:30 <gjanssens> Heh, that will save you some admin time :)
08:50:38 <warlord> Yep
08:51:15 <warlord> I have it set up to ban after 2 failed attempts.. I may change that
08:51:38 <gjanssens> fell how do you experience the latency issue on wiki ?
08:51:46 <gjanssens> From here it seems to work ok
08:51:54 <gjanssens> Or did you measure it ?
08:52:00 <warlord> Er, I take that back -- I set it to 1
08:52:15 <gjanssens> That should be ok as well
08:52:33 <gjanssens> Does fail2ban return an informative message or do you just have to know ?
08:53:00 <warlord> It gives me a log message; to the user it looks like it did before, you wont be able to connect
08:53:21 <gjanssens> Without a message you will still be spending your time informing the users it will auto reset in 10 minutes
08:53:29 <warlord> (it can also block access based on http attacks)
08:53:32 <gjanssens> But I can understand you don't want to inform spammers
08:53:58 <gjanssens> Got to go again
08:54:00 <warlord> Right. I think that most devs know when they've made a mistake.
08:54:04 <warlord> Okay, thanks geert
08:54:09 <gjanssens> I'm @fossdem
08:54:13 <warlord> FUN!
08:54:15 <gjanssens> Hopping from session to session
08:54:24 <gjanssens> Yeah!
08:54:31 <gjanssens> See you later
08:54:33 <warlord> Yep. FYI, I'll be in London in 4 weeks...
08:54:48 <gjanssens> Cool. For your ietf work ?
08:54:51 <warlord> mikee: FYI... see above
08:54:52 <warlord> yes
09:01:18 *** gjanssens has quit IRC
09:01:52 *** gjanssens has joined #gnucash
09:01:52 *** gncbot sets mode: +o gjanssens
09:08:36 <warlord> fell: okay, I've optizimed mysql behind the wiki. Let me know if you see other latency issues.
09:08:53 <gjanssens> warlord: congrats with the migration
09:08:58 <gjanssens> It's pretty smooth
09:09:01 <warlord> gjanssens: thanks!
09:09:13 <warlord> I'm sorry it took me until this morning to get git working.
09:09:34 <warlord> at around 11pm I was told "you are coming to bed"
09:09:47 <gjanssens> Very understandable :)
09:10:16 <warlord> fell, fwiw, right now the only delays I'm seeing with the wiki are my client firefox delays. The website itself seems to be responding pretty quickly.,
09:16:46 <warlord> BIAB -- breakfast
09:18:31 *** uXus has joined #gnucash
09:30:02 *** gjanssens has quit IRC
09:35:17 *** gjanssens has joined #gnucash
09:35:18 *** gncbot sets mode: +o gjanssens
09:38:04 *** uXus has quit IRC
09:40:28 *** uXus has joined #gnucash
09:57:33 *** gjanssens has quit IRC
10:16:22 *** gjanssens has joined #gnucash
10:16:23 *** gncbot sets mode: +o gjanssens
10:27:52 *** gjanssens has quit IRC
10:34:56 *** gjanssens has joined #gnucash
10:34:56 *** gncbot sets mode: +o gjanssens
10:39:56 *** purestrain has joined #gnucash
10:54:06 <purestrain> hi; i've got some scheduled transactions which i thought would not automatically created but they do
10:55:39 <purestrain> so; i prepared some monthly payments and unchecky 'autotamic creation' - do i need to do something else?
10:56:00 <warlord> purestrain: I believe "automatic creation" is the flag to control that.
10:56:18 <warlord> but why have an SX if you dont want it to be created?
10:57:16 <purestrain> i thought i could setup my monthly payments and after they really happened i just have to click 'ok, create it now wtih this date'
10:58:53 <\Mike> I'm trying to wrap my head around the concept of trading accounts, and why mutual funds and stock always are listed with a negative number in the "Accounts" list, under "Trading Accounts" while positive under "Investments". Should I think of funds in the Trading Accounts as somehow being removed from the pool of (other people's) shares?
10:59:09 <\Mike> Somehow it feels backwards, but I'm likely missing something.
11:01:13 *** TradeBorG113 has joined #gnucash
11:17:39 *** aqua___ has joined #gnucash
11:19:01 <warlord> \Mike: Double Entry Accounting.
11:19:12 <warlord> Go search for Peter Selinger's document on it
11:19:36 <warlord> purestrain: at that point why not just use register auto-complete?
11:20:43 <purestrain> could do that; but i used the schedules transactions to get some sort of forecast for the whole year
11:21:05 <purestrain> maybe i'm missusing it
11:21:27 <warlord> There is no report that will forecast using SXes
11:21:48 <warlord> (unless you wrote one and didn't donate it)
11:23:30 *** TradeBorG113 has quit IRC
11:24:00 <purestrain> uh; 'report -> future scheduled bookings (transactions)" ?
11:24:14 <purestrain> ( i'm in german so i don't know the proper translation )
11:24:22 <purestrain> -in
11:27:06 <warlord> purestrain: what's the name in german? I can possibly back-translate it
11:27:42 <\Mike> Yes, the trading account needs to be credited, but as that I've read the Selinger document - unfortunately he stops before getting to the GnuCash implementation. As far as I understand it, that means that gnucash is using the trading accounts as were they assets. Hm, I guess it makes sense, as long as I don't immediately think of them as "my" assets.
11:27:46 <purestrain> Zuk�nftige Terminierte Buchungen - it's not a real forecast, just a report about scheduled booking for this year
11:29:05 <warlord> \Mike: yes. mta wrote that code, but he's not here right now. But yes, don't think of them as your assets.. Think of it as recording unrealized gains/losses due to currency/commodity transfers
11:29:44 <warlord> purestrain: Huh! I didn't know about that report. "Future Scheduled Transactions Summary"
11:35:13 *** mikee has quit IRC
11:35:52 <warlord> (serves me right for staying with 2.4 and not running 2.6 yet)
11:39:52 *** kpreid has quit IRC
11:40:17 *** kpreid has joined #gnucash
11:57:30 <gjanssens> gnucash was mentioned @FOSDEM in a talk about gnome outreach
11:58:01 <gjanssens> The phrase was: "gnucash took 5 years to migrate from gnome 1 to gnome 2"
11:58:23 <gjanssens> As an illustration how poorly the gtk migration path was planned
11:58:50 <gjanssens> I hesitated to reply we may never get to gtk3 ;)
11:59:04 <gjanssens> Since we're still undecided there
12:02:48 <jmd> gjanssens: IMO gnucash has too many dependant libraries for no good reason.
12:03:59 <gjanssens> jmd: perhaps no good reason, but a real reason nonetheless: legacy
12:04:21 <gjanssens> I have been removing some here and there where feasible
12:06:10 <jmd> libwebkit would be a good one to do next!
12:07:25 <gjanssens> :)
12:07:26 <warlord> jmd: uhhh... webkit is how we display reports.. what HTML renderer would you consider better?
12:08:21 <jmd> why HTML ?
12:08:31 <yuriks> TeX is the answer
12:08:46 <gjanssens> Patches welcome :)
12:09:07 <gjanssens> But honestly, I prefer html as it's more universal
12:09:33 <warlord> jmd: because it's the most-used display format in the world?
12:09:48 <warlord> yuriks: perhaps, but I don't know the question....
12:09:52 <warlord> ;)
12:10:02 <yuriks> warlord: :)
12:10:47 <yuriks> and I've been meaning to ask, but does GnuCash have some issues with handling splits in multiple currencies?
12:10:47 <warlord> jmd: assume HTML is a given.. can you point to a better renderer than webkit that's supported on Linux, Mac, and Windows?
12:11:00 <warlord> define "issues"
12:11:02 <warlord> It should work
12:11:32 <yuriks> most of my accounts are in BRL, but I receive payments in USD. So I have an USD income account I pull them from to my bank account in BRL
12:11:36 <jmd> i think that it a fallicious assumption
12:12:00 <gjanssens> Fosdem's over, I'm going offline again to go home...
12:12:21 <yuriks> that itself works fine, I get the exchange rate dialog. But then I want to add some splits to the transaction, that discount the transaction fees and taxes my bank charges to another Bank Fees account in BRL
12:12:58 <yuriks> gnucash seems to get confused and tries to convert the values in BRL to USD or do something weird like that. I eventually gave up and just recorded those as a separate transaction, but it's been bugging me
12:13:47 <warlord> gjanssens: enjoy! TTYL
12:14:34 <warlord> jmd: Well, GnuCash reports currently generate HTML, so it's not a flawed assumption, but patches are welcome if you want to swap out to some other display format. But I don't know what you would use.
12:14:43 <yuriks> I'm probably just doing it wrong, but I couldn't figure out how
12:15:39 <warlord> yuriks: you might be entering it from the "wrong side". Or you might have the wrong Transaction Currency -- it uses the currency of the Stock's parent account.
12:15:51 <warlord> So it assumes the stock is "transacted" in that currency.
12:16:36 <yuriks> how can I check that?
12:17:32 *** gjanssens has quit IRC
12:18:19 <warlord> yuriks: well, check the currency of the stock's parent account.
12:18:25 <warlord> (how did you create this transaction?)
12:19:20 <yuriks> what would be the "stock" in this case?
12:19:43 <yuriks> I created the transaction by going to the Salary income account, clicking transfer and sending it to my bank account
12:19:49 <yuriks> then I edited the splits
12:21:53 <warlord> Oh, sorry, you truly are talking about multiple currencies...
12:22:31 <warlord> The transaction currency will be the currency of the account in which you created the transaction. The fact that you created it from the Salary Income account is, most likely, your problem.
12:22:51 <warlord> IMHO I find it much easier (and more clear) to create transactions from the appropriate Asset or Liability, not the Income/Expense
12:23:08 <warlord> Also, that will generally give it the correct underlying currency to handle most cases.
12:23:17 <yuriks> ah. Is there a way to change that after the fact? Or should I just try re-cerating the transaction?
12:23:33 <jmd> warlord: we're thinking of making pspp's rendering into a library for use in ... whatever.
12:24:49 <warlord> ppsp?
12:25:07 <warlord> yuriks: nope, once it's set it's set. You need to create a completely new transaction.
12:27:19 *** ErKa has joined #gnucash
12:27:43 <yuriks> warlord: hmm, it still pops up the currency conversion dialog everytime I change a split, but other than that it's almost working
12:27:49 <yuriks> it's resulting in some odd rounding erros though
12:28:28 <yuriks> when I added a split the original amount I entered went from 500 to 500.01 and I can't change it back]
12:28:50 <warlord> Yes, it will do that, if the currencies are different.
12:29:17 <warlord> Did you create a new transaction or did it autofill an old one?
12:29:31 <yuriks> brand new transaction, I created a new checkbook to test
12:30:14 <warlord> And what are the various currencies of the various account/splits you're creating?
12:31:16 <yuriks> https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/1990844/2014-02/gnucash_splits.png
12:31:32 <yuriks> this is what the transaction looks like. Everything is BRL except the Salary USD account
12:31:53 <yuriks> the amounts don't add up, which is disconcerting...
12:33:01 <warlord> IIRC the amounts are shown in the "account" currency, which is why you need to use the exchange rate dialog. However you should only need to use it for the Income split. If it's popping up for others then the txn currency is wrong.
12:33:12 *** jralls has joined #gnucash
12:35:03 <warlord> the .01 is clearly due to a rounding error.
12:35:30 <yuriks> the numbers add up if I go to the income account (where the values are shown in USD), so it seems the transaction currency is still USD
12:35:36 <warlord> To fix that you will need to both touch the amount *and* edit the exchange rate. However you shouldn't get an exch rate dialog for the taxes or bank fees splits
12:36:01 <warlord> Could be.. It should be the currency of the account in which you created it.
12:36:28 <yuriks> went to the Checkin Account account and clicked transfer
12:36:33 <yuriks> I'll try just creating the splits manually
12:37:53 <warlord> yuriks: what do you mean "clicked transfer"?
12:37:53 <yuriks> imbalances are going to Imbalance-USD so yeah, it was probably in the wrong currency
12:38:01 <yuriks> warlord: Transfer button in the toolbar
12:38:06 <warlord> OH! Don't do that. Actually enter it into the register!
12:38:45 <warlord> I don't know how the transfer dialog chooses its currency
12:41:18 *** aqua___ has quit IRC
12:41:55 <yuriks> warlord: ok, yeah, that worked much better :)
12:42:12 <warlord> yeah, the documentation really should discourage use of the transfer dialog
12:42:43 <yuriks> I think the issues is that I had always tried to specify I "received 500 dollars" first and then convert that to local currency, because it is what seemed to make most sense to me
12:42:58 <yuriks> I manually typed in the splits now, leaving the USD part last and it worked fine
12:43:14 <yuriks> thanks for the handholding :)
12:45:40 *** jralls has quit IRC
12:47:37 <warlord> yuriks: glad it worked
12:56:40 <yuriks> I was also having an issue where I was unabled to enter the date 2014-02-01 (adjacent dates worked, but this one was simply skipped over), but that was fixed in the last point update
13:06:04 <warlord> bugs happen ;)
13:06:12 <warlord> (2.6.0 had a bunch of them. 2.6.1 seems much better)
13:06:29 <yuriks> always beware major versions :)
13:09:05 <yuriks> registering savings interest income is a pain, so many entries... my bank used to offer OXF files for download but that stopped working some time ago and now I have to input them manually
13:09:47 <warlord> ?? it's only 1 txn a month
13:16:56 <yuriks> warlord: mine does interest separately for each day of the month when you made a deposit
13:17:39 <warlord> wow. weird.
13:17:50 <yuriks> so I have some 7 transaction on random days of the month
13:18:05 <yuriks> I usually just wait until the end of the month and input them all at once and live with the wrong balance in the meantime
13:19:36 <warlord> it's safer to delay entering in debits. It's credits you need to enter ASAP
13:19:47 <warlord> (so you don't over-withdraw)
13:20:21 *** Yawar has joined #gnucash
13:21:00 <yuriks> yeah, I do those whenever I get home usually. (Keep receipts stashed in my wallet where possible so I don't forget)
13:21:26 <yuriks> one thing I gave up on tracking is wallet money. I just sent withdrawals to a black hole now :P
13:21:59 <warlord> yuriks: I still try to keep track of that, but periodically I'll just create a txn to Expenses:Misc to balance out my pocket
13:22:11 <warlord> (I also round cash to the nearest $)
13:23:39 <yuriks> where are you? How does your bank treat international credit card transactions?
13:24:41 <yuriks> mine's weird. Immediatelly after a purchase I get an SMS with the value in my local currency (BRL), but then on the online statement all international currencies are converted to dollar immediatelly
13:24:57 <warlord> US. And it depends on which card I use. Some cards add a fee, others dont.
13:24:59 <yuriks> then they're only converted to the real BRL value on the day of the payment
13:25:14 <Yawar> hi folks: i'm seeing that the gnucash website lists the github repo as the canonical gnucash repo. is this temporary? or are we going to use code.gnucash.org as canonical?
13:25:30 <yuriks> it's confusing as hell
13:25:49 <warlord> Yawar: github is the 'anonymous pull' site. code is the 'push' site
13:26:22 <yuriks> so github is a svn-git mirror?
13:26:23 <warlord> yuriks: For me, the cc converts the expense to USD..
13:26:52 <warlord> yuriks: just git. but yes, github is a mirror. We sync our repos to github
13:27:13 <yuriks> warlord: I was wondering if they did that or if they listed all the international currencies on the statement
13:27:43 <yuriks> (I can still see the original amount in mine, but it's just a memo on the transaction entry)
13:27:44 <warlord> yuriks: for me I see both the amount in the int'l currency, the fee (if any), and the amount in USD
13:28:05 <warlord> But in GnuCash I only enter it in USD, regardless of the source. I keep track of the foreign currency only in the description.
13:28:36 <warlord> Yawar: you should have write access to code
13:29:19 <yuriks> warlord: huh, I only see SVN stuff in code.gnucash.org
13:29:34 <Yawar> thanks warlord. i haven't kept up with the recent changes, i'm seeing a url for code anywhere on the git wiki page....
13:29:34 <warlord> yuriks: where are you looking?
13:29:46 <yuriks> http://code.gnucash.org/
13:29:58 <warlord> yuriks: Ah, that page hasn't been updated
13:30:10 <warlord> Yawar: Hmm... fell?
13:30:31 <Yawar> sorry, i mean i'm *not* seeing a code url....
13:31:02 <Yawar> ok hang on, i think i see something, testing....
13:31:25 <warlord> Yawar: ssh://git@code.gnucash.org:<repo>.git
13:32:16 <warlord> That info SHOULD be on the wiki, somewhere...
13:32:26 <warlord> (probably on http://wiki.gnucash.org/wiki/Git
13:32:28 <yuriks> it is with a typo :)
13:32:32 <yuriks> git remote add upstream ssh://4code.gnucash.org/gnucash-htdocs
13:33:30 <warlord> That definitely looks like a typo ;)
13:33:43 <warlord> (and it's possible you don't need the .git at the end of the url)
13:38:13 <warlord> Yawar: maybe you could update the wiki once you figure out exactly what you need?
13:44:39 <yuriks> Oh, another question: How do you handle credit card payments? I create a future txn that transfers from my checking account to the credit card liability account. That works but I have to keep manually adjusting its value when I make a new CC purchase. Any way to automate that?
13:45:07 <warlord> yuriks: umm... enter it when you actually schedule the payment?
13:45:19 <yuriks> (To make sure that I'll always be able to pay the full CC amount)
13:45:45 <warlord> There is no way to automate that.. Just make sure your bank balance > cc balance
13:46:16 <yuriks> hm, ok
13:51:51 *** gjanssens has joined #gnucash
13:51:51 *** gncbot sets mode: +o gjanssens
13:52:02 <Yawar> warlord: thanks, testing the url now....
13:57:05 *** gncbot has joined #gnucash
13:57:42 <Yawar> woof, i'm getting a network error:
13:57:43 <Yawar> Cloning into 'gnucash-docs'...
13:57:45 <Yawar> ssh: connect to host code.gnucash.org port 22: Network is unreachable
13:57:46 <Yawar> fatal: The remote end hung up unexpectedly
13:59:51 <gjanssens> I have updated the url on the git wiki page
14:01:14 <gjanssens> I'm still using another incantation actually: git clone git@code.gnucash.org:gnucash-docs.git
14:01:57 <gjanssens> If you add ssh:// in front of it, it will assume whatever is after the colon as a port number
14:02:03 <gjanssens> Which is obviously not what you want
14:02:31 <gjanssens> Without the ssh prefix, it works
14:03:19 <gjanssens> Yawar: do you have set up ssh on your system to use public key authentication for code.gnucash.org ?
14:03:45 <Yawar> geert, am checking now....
14:12:03 <Yawar> ok i managed to clone gnucash-docs successfully, will assume for the time being that i have push access
14:13:06 <Yawar> so what's the general consensus: for committers do we want to encourage git clones via the ssh protocol or the git protocol? whichever it is i can update the git wiki page to reflect that uniformly for all the repos....
14:13:10 <gjanssens> Yawar: you should have push access to gnucash-docs and gnucash-htdocs
14:13:19 <gjanssens> That is how you were set up on svn as well
14:14:00 <Yawar> ok, will assume that for now, since i don't have any commits to push right now :-)
14:14:51 <gjanssens> It's only a notational difference. In both cases you are connecting in exactly the same way
14:15:45 <gjanssens> In both cases an ssh connection is set up and git will use that connection to communicate with the server
14:16:47 <gjanssens> Personally I prefer the notation without the ssh prefix because that's shorter and looks more like a typical ssh host:path string
14:17:09 <gjanssens> But both are fine really
14:21:24 <Yawar> ok. i'll shelve the wiki update for now :-) btw gjanssens one more thing: in the last part of the http://wiki.gnucash.org/wiki/Git#Set_up section, the url is 'git@code.gnucash.orggnucash-htdocs'
14:21:45 <Yawar> there should be either a slash or a colon before the repo name, not sure which...
14:26:00 <gjanssens> Oops: typed too fast... fixed, thanks
14:26:00 <gjanssens> It should have been a :
14:26:00 <Yawar> thanks, i am off to lunch....
14:26:20 <warlord> @op gncbot
14:26:20 <gncbot> warlord: Error: You don't have the #gnucash,op capability. If you think that you should have this capability, be sure that you are identified before trying again. The 'whoami' command can tell you if you're identified.
14:28:04 *** warlord sets mode: +o gncbot
14:49:21 *** jralls has joined #gnucash
14:50:09 *** gncbot sets mode: +o jralls
14:56:52 *** purestrain has quit IRC
15:00:04 *** ErKa has quit IRC
15:02:41 *** vantage has joined #gnucash
15:08:27 <gjanssens> warlord: the git wiki page also says
15:08:29 <gjanssens> Once you have the key configured correctly and have provided it to the GnuCash repository administrator, try to ssh to svn.gnucash.org. If everything is set up correctly, you'll get a message <tt>Shell login to CVS server not permitted</tt> and the connection will drop.
15:08:39 <gjanssens> Would this still be valid ?
15:09:02 <gjanssens> Are you setting up the ssh keys for ssh per user still ?
15:09:06 <gjanssens> Or only in gitolite ?
15:09:35 <gjanssens> It looks to me it would be more correct to say:
15:09:52 *** jmd has quit IRC
15:09:54 <gjanssens> ... try to run "ssh git@code.gnucash.org"
15:10:18 <gjanssens> If you get a list of repos in return you're ready to work with git
15:10:29 <gjanssens> (or something similar for the second sentence)
15:13:50 <gjanssens> jralls: it seems you have written this part ^
15:14:19 <gjanssens> I'm guessing it's not valid anymore now svn acces has been removed
15:15:06 <gjanssens> Anyway, I've got to leave
15:15:09 <gjanssens> See you later
15:15:46 *** gjanssens has quit IRC
15:31:03 <jralls> @tell gjanssens Ssh keys are handled at connection time, obviously. Derek said the other day that he hadn't enabled anonymous connections; that's what the github mirrors are for. Your git check is preferable, I think, so I've changed the wiki accordingly (after testing to make sure it worked, of course).
15:31:03 <gncbot> jralls: The operation succeeded.
15:32:20 <warlord> @tell gjanssens I am still setting up individual accounts for devs so they could rsync, and so email works properly. So yes, I still need username, full name, and email forwarding address for valid developers..
15:32:20 <gncbot> warlord: The operation succeeded.
15:47:47 *** MechtiIde has joined #gnucash
16:12:45 *** aqua___ has joined #gnucash
16:32:08 *** aqua___ has quit IRC
16:37:23 *** LiamH has joined #gnucash
16:37:58 <LiamH> Is it possible to move a split from one transaction to another?
16:44:01 <Yawar> LiamH: not in the user interface. you'll have to manually remove the split from one transaction and add it into another.
16:44:38 <LiamH> Yawar: You mean in the gnucash file directly?
16:45:22 <Yawar> sorry, i meant that _in the user interface,_ you'll have to manually remove the split from one transaction and add it to another
16:45:40 <Yawar> it won't let you just 'drag and drop' splits among transactions
16:48:34 <LiamH> How do you specify the new transaction? All I see as options are accounts, which makes it a new transaction in the account selected.
16:51:50 <Yawar> let me clarify. you _can't_ specify something like 'this split should move from _this_ transaction into _that_ transaction'. you have to _delete_ the split from the original transaction, then find or create a new (destination) transaction, then _manually type in the split_ in the destination transaction
16:53:47 <LiamH> Yawar: Oh, OK, sure. I guess it's a question of terminology - I think of that as deleting and recreating rather than moving. The problem was the split was reconciled, and I wanted to keep that, but it's no big deal if all I can do is delete and recreate, then reconcile again.
16:54:27 <Yawar> ah yes. to be more accurate, you will be deleting and re-creating (or re-entering)
16:54:47 <LiamH> Thanks.
16:55:10 <Yawar> of course--in traditional accounting you wouldn't be doing this--you'd be entering an adjusting entry in the ledger
16:56:43 <LiamH> These are just home accounts, I'm not an accountant.
16:58:20 <jralls> Actually, you should be able to cut the split using either the Edit menu, the Context menu, or the ctrl-x keybinding and paste it into the other transaction. *However*, you'll also need to edit the other splits in each transaction so that they each balance, and you should do that in the source transaction before moving to the destination transaction.
16:58:23 <Yawar> i figured--an accountant would abhor the idea of modifying reconciled transactions :-)
17:03:26 *** Jimraehl1 has quit IRC
17:04:59 <LiamH> jralls: Thanks, I'll keep that in mind for the future.
17:05:28 <LiamH> Yawar: heh, indeed. More like: an accountant wouldn't have screwed that up in the first place.
17:44:48 *** benoitg has quit IRC
17:56:13 *** benoitg has joined #gnucash
18:32:59 *** MechtiIde has quit IRC
18:34:36 *** \Mike has quit IRC
18:56:21 *** Yawar has quit IRC
18:56:33 *** LiamH has quit IRC
19:27:38 *** wizkid238 has quit IRC
19:27:49 *** Ahmuck has joined #gnucash
19:27:53 <Ahmuck> Bueno
19:28:27 <Ahmuck> i need to set my gnucash to english. my computer is in spanish. is there a preference setting i can set to set gnucash in english without setting my computer in english
19:28:29 <Ahmuck> ?
19:34:50 *** yuriks has quit IRC
19:35:39 *** yuriks has joined #gnucash
19:36:31 <jralls> Ahmuck: http://wiki.gnucash.org/wiki/Locale_Settings
19:49:01 *** wizkid238 has joined #gnucash
20:15:04 *** Ahmuck has quit IRC
20:35:19 *** wizkid238 has quit IRC
20:35:19 *** kpreid has quit IRC
20:35:19 *** warlord has quit IRC
20:35:19 *** linas has quit IRC
20:35:19 *** reaper has quit IRC
20:35:22 *** warlord has joined #gnucash
20:35:22 *** wizkid238 has joined #gnucash
20:35:22 *** kpreid has joined #gnucash
20:35:22 *** linas has joined #gnucash
20:35:22 *** reaper has joined #gnucash
20:51:12 *** kpreid has quit IRC
20:51:12 *** wizkid238 has quit IRC
20:51:12 *** reaper has quit IRC
20:51:12 *** linas has quit IRC
20:51:12 *** warlord has quit IRC
21:01:38 *** warlord has joined #gnucash
21:01:38 *** linas has joined #gnucash
21:01:38 *** reaper has joined #gnucash
21:02:44 *** wizkid238 has joined #gnucash
21:02:44 *** kpreid has joined #gnucash
21:04:51 *** reaper has quit IRC
21:04:51 *** linas has quit IRC
21:04:51 *** warlord has quit IRC
21:07:34 *** warlord has joined #gnucash
21:07:34 *** linas has joined #gnucash
21:07:34 *** reaper has joined #gnucash
21:29:48 <warlord> @op
21:29:48 <gncbot> warlord: Error: You don't have the #gnucash,op capability. If you think that you should have this capability, be sure that you are identified before trying again. The 'whoami' command can tell you if you're identified.
21:38:54 <warlord> @op
21:38:54 <warlord> What's up with gncbot? Or is it me?
21:38:54 <gncbot> warlord: Error: You don't have the #gnucash,op capability. If you think that you should have this capability, be sure that you are identified before trying again. The 'whoami' command can tell you if you're identified.
21:39:35 *** reaper has quit IRC
21:39:35 *** linas has quit IRC
21:39:35 *** warlord has quit IRC
21:39:53 *** warlord has joined #gnucash
21:39:53 *** linas has joined #gnucash
21:39:53 *** reaper has joined #gnucash
21:40:58 <warlord> @op
21:40:58 <gncbot> warlord: Error: You don't have the #gnucash,op capability. If you think that you should have this capability, be sure that you are identified before trying again. The 'whoami' command can tell you if you're identified.
21:41:22 <warlord> @op
21:41:22 *** gncbot sets mode: +o warlord
21:45:12 *** linas has quit IRC
21:47:32 *** linas has joined #gnucash
22:26:02 <warlord> @tell fell I have made a few changes to the wiki: I've enabled uploads; there is a group who have the permissions to do it. I've also changed it so that only people with confirmed email can edit.
22:26:02 <gncbot> warlord: The operation succeeded.
22:26:47 <fell> Nice, warlord!
22:26:47 <gncbot> fell: Sent just now: <warlord> I have made a few changes to the wiki: I've enabled uploads; there is a group who have the permissions to do it. I've also changed it so that only people with confirmed email can edit.
22:27:16 <warlord> ah, you are here still
22:27:29 <warlord> anyways, hopefully this all works. I haven't actually *tested* it ;)
22:27:51 <warlord> The next thing I want to do is figure out how to bulk-remove the accounts of users that never email-confirmed..
22:30:16 <warlord> But that's for another day... it's bedtime here
22:37:09 <fell> Gnight!
22:41:47 *** reaper has quit IRC
22:41:47 *** warlord has quit IRC
22:46:49 *** warlord has joined #gnucash
22:46:49 *** reaper has joined #gnucash
22:46:49 *** irc.acc.umu.se sets mode: +o warlord
22:46:49 *** gncbot sets mode: +o warlord
23:21:32 *** ErKa has joined #gnucash