2012-11-01 GnuCash IRC logs
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08:48:54 <warlord> Hey mikee, linas__ could either of you op gncbot, please?
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09:18:45 <mikee> warlord: I thought I had.
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09:30:47 <warlord> Oh, maybe you did..
09:30:51 <warlord> Sorry.
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10:55:18 <gjanssens> Hi all
10:55:25 <gjanssens> warlord: ping
10:55:32 <warlord> good morning.
10:55:42 <warlord> Was just getting to responding to emails...
10:55:47 <warlord> Been a busy morning.
10:55:53 <gjanssens> good afternoon here ;)
10:56:01 <gjanssens> How are you ?
10:57:12 <warlord> I am well.. finally caught up on some sleep last night -- the wee one decided to wake up ~ 4-5 times/night the previous few nights. (We changed her sleeping arrangements)
10:57:24 <warlord> I think the Net card in the UPS is bad..
10:57:51 <gjanssens> Strong people, parents...
10:58:21 <gjanssens> Anyways, I was playing bit with the website sources
10:58:40 <gjanssens> And wanted to make use of the http_build_query function
10:59:07 <gjanssens> But then discovered it requires php5, while the webserver still runs on php4
10:59:44 <gjanssens> Any chance we can get Linas to upgrade ? Php4 is more or less deprecated by now...
11:00:27 <warlord> Maybe? I have no idea what OS/Distro he's running. We can email him and ask.
11:01:12 <gjanssens> Server says: PHP Version 4.4.4-8+etch6
11:01:40 <gjanssens> I don't know the debian versioning scheme, so I have no idea if that's recent or old
11:02:03 <warlord> Me either.
11:03:22 <warlord> Looks like 2007?
11:03:57 <gjanssens> Build date is May 2008 it says. That's rather old in my book
11:04:15 <warlord> I'm not sure whether to believe http://wiki.debian.org/DebianEtch or http://www.debian.org/releases/etch/ which says 2010
11:04:25 <warlord> Ah, I see, the final etch was in 2010
11:08:54 <gjanssens> That page says etch is discontinued, so no more security updates. Not good.
11:10:18 <warlord> Yeah..
11:10:43 <warlord> Do you have his gmail email address? (he doesn't read linas.org anymore)
11:11:47 <gjanssens> It is possible to install php5 on etch though: http://archive.debian.net/search?suite=etch&searchon=names&keywords=php5
11:12:06 <gjanssens> No, I don't have his e-mail.
11:13:28 <warlord> sent in PM
11:15:41 <gjanssens> Tx
11:16:11 <warlord> NP! Feel free to CC me
11:22:53 <gjanssens> Mail sent.
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11:25:07 <gjanssens> Further experiments on the website will have to wait for Linas' reply.
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11:36:22 <warlord> There's the beta site you could test with...
11:37:40 <gjanssens> Yes, that's what I have been playing on so far.
11:38:01 <gjanssens> I found some work around code on the net by the way, so for now I can continue
11:42:36 <warlord> Ok
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12:10:47 <gjanssens> warlord: can you give me some info on the nightly doc builds ?
12:11:03 <gjanssens> Is the script publicly available somewhere ?
12:11:31 <gjanssens> I'd like to change the paths where the docs are installed if possible
12:11:54 <gjanssens> To line up with the paths for to the docs on the webserver
12:12:01 <gjanssens> That would simplify some of the scripts
12:12:09 <warlord> No, it's just a shell script that runs locally. It's not anywhere public.
12:12:20 <warlord> I can grab and email it to you.
12:12:53 <gjanssens> That would be great, thanks
12:14:14 <gjanssens> You can obfuscate any sensitive information if you like
12:19:03 <warlord> There's no sensitive data.
12:20:13 <warlord> There are two scripts, one to build the doxygen docs,and one to build the gnucash-docs docs.
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12:31:49 <warlord> gjanssens: sent
12:50:01 <gjanssens> Ok, received
12:50:25 <gjanssens> But the scripts don't contain what I was looking for
12:51:05 <gjanssens> The gnucash-docs are built in a certain directory, and copied to another
12:51:31 <gjanssens> But via the webinterface you need to use other paths to find the docs
12:51:41 <gjanssens> Is this set up with static soft links ?
12:54:53 <warlord> yes.
12:55:11 <warlord> There are symlinks from the web site to the docs build tree.
12:55:13 <warlord> (s)
12:56:12 <gjanssens> Ok, can we adapt these links ? (Together with a change in the paths setup on the website)
12:56:42 <gjanssens> I want to come to this layout (as used by the stable docs on www.gnucash.org)
12:57:48 <gjanssens> Scratch the last part.
12:58:10 <gjanssens> I would like to come to the layout as created by a make install in gnucash-docs, which is
12:59:03 <gjanssens> docs/(branch)/(docname)/(language)/
12:59:06 <gjanssens> so for example
12:59:18 <gjanssens> docs/v2.4/guide/C/
12:59:36 <gjanssens> or docs/v2.0/help/de_DE/
12:59:54 <warlord> Sure, changing symlinks is easy.
13:00:14 <warlord> Then periodically I think I take a nightly build and "copy" it into the website.
13:00:49 <gjanssens> I'm not sure, the website refers to code.gnucash.org for the nightly builds
13:01:30 <gjanssens> Only the stable documentation is located on www.gnucash.org
13:02:31 <gjanssens> I'll prepare the htdocs code then and let you know what links should be set up for the new website
13:15:39 <warlord> right.. and the stables are hand-copied
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13:40:24 <ari> warlord: While I'm still learning GnuCash, I'm pretty sure that I need to use the business features. I was planning on entering invoices as they come in and then using the Business -> Vendor -> New Bill feature when the Bill arrives, in theory to close out those invoices by decreasing the AP Liability as well as our checking account Asset.
13:40:43 <ari> But it doesn't seem like Business -> Vendor -> New Bill works that way.
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14:21:22 <gjanssens> Fyi, Linas has updated the server to php5 in the mean time. Fast response, great !
14:22:13 <warlord> Awesome
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14:42:40 <ari> (warlord) does it make sense to input each invoice as it comes in?
14:43:20 <warlord> "invoice" is outgoing.
14:43:25 <warlord> "bill" is incomin
14:43:26 <warlord> g
14:45:08 <warlord> but yes, you sould enter vendor bills when they arive
14:45:12 <ari> Hm. I suppose I mean the incoming invoices.
14:45:27 <ari> The vendor invoices. We get a bunch of invoices and then the vendor sends us a bill.
14:45:42 <ari> And the bill just has a list of referenced invoices.
14:46:07 <ari> I don't use Customer > Invoice to enter invoices..
14:46:08 <warlord> invoice -> bill. bill -> statement
14:46:21 <warlord> restate
14:47:27 <ari> I put the vendor's invoice into the appropriate account. For example, Red Onion (vendor) is our produce supplier. So when we get one of their invoices (4 or 5 times a week) I enter a transaction into Expenses > Food > Produce and put Liabilities:Accounts Payable as the transfer.
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14:49:16 <ari> Each invoice from Red Onion is due 30 days later.
14:49:33 <ari> About every month, they send us a 'bill' reminding us which invoices are due.
14:51:24 <warlord> ari: rephrase into gnucash terminology. each delivery gives you a vendor bill, due 30 days later. Then monthly or so they send you a statement of your bills.
14:51:35 <warlord> You cannot manually enter transactions into A/P.
14:51:48 <warlord> So every delivery when you get your vendor bill you should enter it as such.
14:52:05 <warlord> When you get your monthly statement you can ignore it, or verify it against your already input bills.
14:57:39 <ari> Ah. Rephrasing into GnuCash was the trick. Thanks. You're the tops. The confusion was that the Vendor sends me documents called Invoices with "invoice #s" on the top. But in GnuCash, they're bills.
14:57:51 <warlord> exactly
14:59:30 <ari> Since I need to redo things, is there a way to clear out all of the transactions and bills or should I just make a new file (seems like the latter would be easier)?
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15:26:02 <warlord> ari: new file might be easiest
15:27:53 <ari> warlord: agreed.
15:29:10 <ari> just to recap, the workflow should be: Vendor delivers Goods & Bill. I enter Bill via Business > Vendor > New Bill (assuming Vendor already in GnuCash). When I pay the bill I use Business > Vendor > Process Payment.
15:29:38 <warlord> Exactly.
15:30:03 <warlord> ANd if the vendor isn't already in the system you can add them via the "Select" in New Bill -- there's a "New Vendor" button in there.
15:34:25 <ari> Am I understanding correctly that I don't need to enter anything for Job because I'm getting material (Action > Material in the bill window)?
15:34:46 <ari> That "job" would be used for a service, like when our stoves get fixed?
15:35:20 <warlord> a 'job' is a way to link multiple invoices ... sort of like a 'contract' where you have multiple invoices involved. But there is no need to use it
15:37:41 <ari> Hmm. I've been reading through both the Tutorials and Help but nothing is at the level of what you're describing. Any suggestions on how to learn more? I'm pretty set on using GnuCash, both because I want to help the project (when time frees up and after I learn it) and because after research I think it's better than other choices (at least in my case).
15:49:53 <warlord> There are a few Business HowTos out there..
15:49:55 <warlord> Check the Wiki?
15:50:17 <ari> I'm looking at the book by http://www.packtpub.com/authors/profiles/ramachandran-asokan tho there's not enough of it online to let me know if it's for small business (ie that whole Bills > AP workflow you wrote about) or just for home use.
16:10:04 <warlord> I dont know..
16:10:22 <warlord> But the Bill -> AP workflow is extremely common, and is effectively the same as Invoice -> AR workflow.
16:20:31 <gjanssens> ari: I have the book you link to here at home. There is one chapter explaining how customers/vendors and invoices/bills are used
16:22:40 <gjanssens> I quickly glanced over this chapter, there's no mention of the job field, it's simply ignored.
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16:53:35 <ari> gjanssens: do you like the book? That is, would you recommend it for a business (restaurant) user?
17:12:47 <warlord> It seems to be pretty popular.
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17:33:50 <ari> Thanks. I'll just get it then.
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17:51:18 <gjanssens> ari: tbh, I have yet to read it fully (I don't have much time to read). At first sight it seems well structured and builds up slowly
17:51:39 <gjanssens> warlord: do you have access to the website's logfiles ?
17:52:08 <gjanssens> My last 3 commits to the beta site result in a totally blank page, but I have no clue why
17:52:41 <gjanssens> The changes in those commits are pretty basic, so I must be missing something obvious.
17:52:59 <gjanssens> A php error message from the logs would be very helpful
17:53:17 <warlord> i do.. give me a min?
17:54:34 <gjanssens> sure
17:55:55 <gjanssens> btw, did you install the new nightly docs build script already ?
17:56:23 <warlord> no, not yet..
17:57:10 <gjanssens> No problem, but be sure to do it today. If not the docs will end up in the wrong spot.
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18:07:09 <warlord> Yeah, I'll go do it now -- had baby again.
18:07:43 <gjanssens> Ok
18:08:39 <gjanssens> Regarding the server logs, would you mind sending them by email ? It's getting late here and I need to finish up for today. I can look at the errors tomorrow
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18:11:51 <warlord> Which logs do you need/want?
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18:14:13 <warlord> (copied)
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18:16:32 <warlord> gjanssens: I'm not seeing anything in the logs..
18:17:36 <gjanssens> error log ? I'm looking for php errors
18:17:48 <gjanssens> I'm talking about www.gnucash.org
18:17:56 <gjanssens> httpd error log that is
18:20:33 <warlord> Oh, I dont have access to the logs there, only on code..
18:20:44 <warlord> I thought you were testing against the beta website
18:21:37 <gjanssens> Isn't the beta website running on www.gnucash.org as well ? I'm looking at it via www.gnucash.org/beta
18:22:56 <gjanssens> Or is there a way to see it on code.gnucash.org as well ?
18:23:42 <gjanssens> Anyway, I've got to go now. The rest will be for tomorrow. I'll check the public log for your answer or you can mail me.
18:23:45 <gjanssens> Good night
18:23:52 <warlord> there should be a way to see it at code.gnucash.org
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18:25:43 <warlord> @tell gjanssens Sorry, no, I'm wrong. There is no beta site on code. And unfortunately I do not have access to www to grab the logs. I think you'll need to email Linas. :(
18:25:43 <gncbot> warlord: The operation succeeded.
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