2012-06-11 GnuCash IRC logs

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00:01:04 * arlie decides everyone's afk
00:02:02 <arlie> suspect these .xac and .log files might be the key to rolling back to a good state then rolling forward correctly - but there's sure no info on things like that in TFM
00:07:08 <arlie> also see it alcks ability to export the data in a human readable form, or even one some other tool can read
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01:31:14 <fell> Good morning, arlie!
01:31:57 <fell> pls read http://wiki.gnucash.org/wiki/FAQ#Q:_What.27s_the_gnucash_file_extension.3F
01:44:00 <fell> BTW you should update to a newer GnuCash version. 2.4.10 is recent.
01:45:47 <fell> Check the date of your system ...
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01:58:53 <arlie> Hiya Fell
01:59:14 <fell> Hiho!
01:59:28 <arlie> rather elderly debian unix; suspect the upgrade could be painful
01:59:49 <arlie> What I really need to do is upgrade the whole system
01:59:51 <arlie> ;-)
02:00:18 <arlie> But for now, I've kind of halfway figured out this problem...
02:00:31 <arlie> I have a .xact file from before the mess
02:00:36 <fell> Probably you can find more recent packages at getdeb or alioth
02:00:45 <arlie> and 43 .log files from after it
02:01:19 <arlie> They may have given up on this elderly deb version even
02:02:14 <arlie> but if I reapply the first of the logs, get a _different_ problem in same area
02:03:01 * arlie beats head on wall
02:03:26 <arlie> don't want to upgrade without first correcting the mess; fear that would make things even worse
02:03:41 <arlie> and what's worse, I think I broke this while trying to fix something else
02:04:10 <fell> You read the FAQ section about file names etc.?
02:04:17 <arlie> do later versions of gnucash have an ability to export one's whole file into a human-readable/editable format?
02:04:45 <fell> I have no problem, to read xml.
02:04:45 <arlie> yes, that's been a great help figuring out how to salvage as much as possible from after I broke my file
02:05:21 <arlie> are you telling me ".xac" are actually xml?
02:05:37 <arlie> and the main data file likewise?
02:05:56 <fell> It might be gziped, dependend from your settings
02:06:13 <arlie> aha - gzipped xml I can fix, if necc with a hammer
02:06:55 <arlie> hadn't figured that out
02:08:05 <arlie> never tried to look inside the black box before - was treating it like quicken or money
02:08:31 <fell> Somewhere in Edit->Preferences is a save file compressed or similar.
02:08:48 <arlie> yes, I see now - edit - preferences - general
02:09:13 <arlie> same place I belatedly found and increased the amount of old logs and backups to keep
02:09:15 <fell> Open source prefers open formats.
02:09:46 <arlie> How sensitive is the format, if I attack the file with a text editor?
02:10:59 <fell> Always make a copy! A basic sematic check is xmllint, probably in your editor.
02:10:59 <arlie> I believe I have multiple bizarrities that have crept into my data.
02:11:23 <arlie> emacs?
02:12:11 <arlie> no obvious xml mode in this emacs installation.. but can search
02:12:19 <arlie> kind of know the basics of xml
02:13:03 <arlie> aha - xmllint - xmlsoft.org - now I know what to look for...
02:13:25 <arlie> rofl - and already on my system ;-)
02:14:15 <arlie> This data started in quicken, moved to a later quicken, got exported as a qif, imported into gnucash, and then the gnucash was upgraded 2 or 3 times
02:14:34 <arlie> and I've had the odd crash along the way as well
02:15:22 <arlie> so I have oddities like a transaction that somehow wasn't marked as reconciled, even though its amount was clearly in the reconciled total for the account
02:18:34 <fell> Then you should probably try to redo the reconcile process. Because manual editing of the file could make the things more worse.
02:18:42 <arlie> Are things like quicken's expectations for the next reconcile date of an account in the file explicitly, or commuted somehow
02:19:48 <arlie> is it possible to redo an old reconcile, especially when there are later reconciles on top?
02:19:49 <fell> I never used quicken. So I don't know how they handle that.
02:20:08 <arlie> sorry - brainfart, I meant gnucash
02:20:41 <arlie> that being the program that thinks my reconcile date is in 2011 - even though it knows about the stuff I reconciled with the 4/30/2012 statement
02:21:23 <arlie> and more importantly, has a _starting balance_ for the statement - which can't be modified within gnucash - which matches no month end balance anywhere in that time period
02:24:15 <fell> IIRC somebody had a similar problem. You could search https://lists.gnucash.org/search/?query=reconcile&submit=%3C%3F%3DT_%28&max=20&result=normal&sort=score&idxname=gnucash-user
02:25:34 <arlie> I've made that mistake too ;-) But always redone the reconcile, when I saw I wasn't gettign a zero balance
02:26:19 <arlie> oh wait - a later one in that search looks like they had my mess...
02:32:03 <arlie> Anyway, think I grok the file format - really simple
02:33:01 <arlie> commodities, accounts, and transactions - preceded by a count of each, so don't blithely delete one or two
02:33:25 <arlie> and more importantly, no last-reconcile date, or-balance-as-of-last-reconcile
02:34:25 <arlie> oh wait, it's lurking in the account record ;-)
02:34:51 <arlie> I figure that once I understand the data the program uses, I understand what the program does/can do
02:35:37 <arlie> Though comprehending the following is a bit difficult
02:36:32 <arlie> Oh never mind - irc client wont let me cut and paste xml as speech
02:36:46 <arlie> <slot>
02:36:47 <arlie> <slot:key>last-date</slot:key>
02:36:49 <arlie> <slot:value type="integer">1326614400</slot:value>
02:36:50 <arlie> </slot>
02:36:53 <arlie> oops yes it would
02:37:05 <arlie> anyway, think you've sensibly switched to other things
02:37:35 <arlie> but would help to know how to translate that date into somethign a tad more meaningful
02:38:20 <fell> It is a unix date ( something counted from 1.1.1970)
02:38:32 <arlie> great, I can translate those
02:38:49 <arlie> I guess you figured out I'm a programmer by now
02:39:25 <fell> at least with some knowledge.
02:39:34 <arlie> can't be days - prob seconds ;-)
02:40:04 <arlie> no obvious last-reconcile value
02:40:22 <arlie> what is: <slot:key>last-num</slot:key>?
02:41:01 <arlie> oj I see - last cheque number used
02:41:08 <arlie> recognized the number
02:45:06 <fell> later in the transactions is the <split:reconciled-state>
02:45:20 <arlie> saw that...
02:48:04 <arlie> Does the following look right? The -105 makes me wonder if this is somehow a sign of the problem:
02:48:10 <arlie> <slot>
02:48:11 <arlie> <slot:key>last-interval</slot:key>
02:48:13 <arlie> <slot:value type="frame">
02:48:14 <arlie> <slot>
02:48:16 <arlie> <slot:key>days</slot:key>
02:48:18 <arlie> <slot:value type="integer">-105</slot:value>
02:48:19 <arlie> </slot>
02:48:20 <arlie> <slot>
02:48:22 <arlie> <slot:key>months</slot:key>
02:48:23 <arlie> <slot:value type="integer">0</slot:value>
02:48:25 <arlie> </slot>
02:48:26 <arlie> </slot:value>
02:48:28 <arlie> </slot>
02:48:40 <arlie> it's in reconcile-info
02:49:05 <fell> did you sometime use a windows machine?
02:49:10 <arlie> In a non-broken account, I see:
02:49:25 <arlie> <slot>
02:49:26 <arlie> <slot:key>last-interval</slot:key>
02:49:28 <arlie> <slot:value type="frame">
02:49:30 <arlie> <slot>
02:49:31 <arlie> <slot:key>days</slot:key>
02:49:32 <arlie> <slot:value type="integer">0</slot:value>
02:49:34 <arlie> </slot>
02:49:35 <arlie> <slot>
02:49:37 <arlie> <slot:key>months</slot:key>
02:49:39 <arlie> <slot:value type="integer">1</slot:value>
02:49:40 <arlie> </slot>
02:49:42 <arlie> </slot:value>
02:49:46 <arlie> The data started life on windows, but never ran gnucash on windows
02:50:49 <fell> With DST enabled there was a impossible date possible.
02:51:45 <fell> 1.1.1970 -1h
02:52:00 <arlie> fun ;-)
02:52:36 <arlie> I edited just the last-interval, loaded the result into gc - now it expects the statement date to be 2/15/12
02:53:11 <arlie> I conclude the date of last statement is wrong too, but will have to write a little c routine to translate
02:53:33 <arlie> there's a library function, no convenient wrapper tool
02:54:06 <arlie> And this is why i love open source
02:54:20 <arlie> if I'm willing to put time into things, I can disentangle anything
02:54:22 <arlie> ;-)
02:54:37 <fell> or use the gnucash api: http://cvs.gnucash.org/docs/HEAD/
02:54:37 <arlie> often without ever needing to look at anyone's source code
02:54:49 <arlie> oh? had no idea there was one...
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02:57:00 <arlie> I'm blind? not seeing api or api link at that url
02:58:17 <fell> Start here: http://wiki.gnucash.org/wiki/C_API
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03:01:40 <arlie> it doesn't even demand C++
03:02:56 <arlie> OK, I think you've set me on the path to fixing my mess, as well as becoming rather less of a naive gnucash user
03:03:33 <fell> http://wiki.gnucash.org/wiki/FAQ#Q:_Why_is_GnuCash_written_in_C.3F
03:03:53 <arlie> very tempting to actually fix the file tonight
03:04:10 <arlie> ah - the docs speak in terms of classes etc so I just assumed C++
03:05:08 <arlie> personally I'm rather more comfortable in C
03:05:16 <fell> Yes, we know OOP and use it, but different.
03:05:25 <arlie> probably because 90+% of the code I work on is C
03:05:50 <arlie> ditto, in some of our code anyway
03:07:27 <arlie> nice meeting you, and many thanks for your help
03:08:12 <arlie> if I were on a current release, I'd be trying to figure out how I convinced your UI to let me make this mess
03:08:41 <arlie> because that's arguably a bug. But it's like as not an already fixed bug
03:09:34 <arlie> and whatever I did, was done on may 13th - so not exactly clear in my memory
03:09:42 <fell> You can search bugzilla: https://bugzilla.gnome.org/browse.cgi?product=GnuCash
03:10:00 <fell> was it a friday?
03:10:41 <arlie> Only in a virtual sense
03:12:12 <fell> So, I wish you good luck, but for me it is now bed time.
03:12:22 <arlie> me too
03:12:25 <arlie> thanks again
03:12:37 <fell> No, you are not finished!
03:13:10 <arlie> hmm - yeah, arguing with self - want to fix it all, now - also want to be awake at work tomorrow
03:13:11 <fell> ;-) Good night!
03:13:35 <arlie> good night
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04:43:12 <Menuhin> hi
04:44:24 <Menuhin> i have question about gnucash , i have sold something on ebay so i wanted to notice that
04:44:54 <Menuhin> i set 10 Euro but i got 23,50
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08:26:40 <oiaohm> This looks like no one is in.
08:26:40 <gncbot> oiaohm: Sent 2 years, 3 weeks, 2 days, 21 hours, and 32 minutes ago: <fell> you should wait somewhat longer than 3 minutes, to get an answer.
08:27:41 <oiaohm> I was just going to ask http://softwaredevelopers.ato.gov.au/testscenarios are these used with gnucash at all.
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10:56:12 <Lid> Is there documentation on using budgets somewhere?
10:56:27 <Lid> I'm a bit confused and the manual isn't very helpfull
10:57:05 <Lid> I'm trying to create an income statement but the real expenses do not show up
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