2011-03-08 GnuCash IRC logs
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07:10:28 <Jozua_Judah> hi
07:11:16 <Jozua_Judah> I have a quick question about the application
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07:31:23 <warlord> Jozua_Judah: nobody can answer until you ask
07:31:41 <Jozua_Judah> I am currently setting up GnuCash as a first time user for non profit org. Need some general guidance
07:31:58 <Jozua_Judah> good observation bob
07:33:03 <Jozua_Judah> just some quick history before I pop the first question
07:33:52 <Jozua_Judah> I come from ERP background. I was developer for 6 odd ears on Navision
07:34:31 <Jozua_Judah> No in accounting system in general you post your transactions from a journal to a ledger
07:35:29 <Jozua_Judah> from the help files I have gathered Gnucash simply records transactions, there is no actual posting of the transaction?
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07:47:51 <warlord> Well, yes and no. GnuCash is double entry, so it models the movement of money. So when you Credit your checking account you have to debit some (set of) other account(s), e.g. Expenses:Grocery, or Expenses:Dining, or...
07:48:12 <Jozua_Judah> yes that I understand
07:48:16 <warlord> There are multiple ways you can enter that transaction.
07:48:37 <warlord> You *could* enter it on the GL and specify both the credit and debit accounts.
07:48:52 <Jozua_Judah> yes I saw that
07:49:11 <warlord> Or you could enter it from one of the accounts and post it to the other. (E.g., open your Checking Account register and post it to the expense account)
07:49:30 <Jozua_Judah> let me elaborate why I asked question
07:51:53 <warlord> @op jsled
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07:52:52 <Jozua_Judah> I am used to erp systems where you post trough a journal that would be, sales, general, purchase journal etc. Then the accounting system posts records it in the correct ledgers (also using double entry) for you and you view your posted transaction form the transaction registry
07:53:32 <Jozua_Judah> I was when I recorded a transaction for example utilities and expenses that there no "post" button
07:54:09 <warlord> Correct, you dont need to explicitly post it. Just finish it and it gets automatically entered.
07:54:22 <Jozua_Judah> hence my question of asking that you record the transaction in a double entry way as you stated previously....
07:54:30 <Jozua_Judah> aaaah ic
07:54:57 <Jozua_Judah> gr8 that settles that question
07:55:33 <warlord> The only place there is a required "post" is in the business Invoice/Bill feature.. (because there is no way to know when you're "done")
07:55:44 <warlord> But a transaction is small, self-contained, and easily finished.
07:56:08 <Jozua_Judah> yes that makes sense
07:56:36 <Jozua_Judah> I look trough the helps files but couldn't find a suitable explanation on what a certain button does on the toolbar
07:56:59 <warlord> which one?
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07:58:24 <Jozua_Judah> when I am busy in account there is a button which caption reads, "record the current transaction? When I press it seems to do nothing, I am clearly missing something?
07:58:39 <Jozua_Judah> what does it do?
07:58:49 <Jozua_Judah> what its function?
07:59:26 <warlord> It's the equivalent of hitting the "Enter" key.
07:59:47 <warlord> Honestly, I never use it; I see little reason to have that button.
07:59:48 <warlord> ;)
07:59:58 <Jozua_Judah> I agree
08:00:58 <Jozua_Judah> then whenever I record a transaction in an account does it automatically update the general ledger or is that something separate?
08:01:31 <warlord> The GL is just a special view over all accounts.
08:01:40 <Jozua_Judah> ic
08:01:43 <Jozua_Judah> good
08:02:15 <Jozua_Judah> then two more questions then I am done bugging you... :) (thanks 4 the help)
08:02:40 <warlord> heh.
08:02:45 <Jozua_Judah> what does the close book function do and I assume I use it as part of my end of month procedure
08:04:09 <warlord> There's no need to run that, IMHO (even though I wrote that feature).
08:04:26 <warlord> It just rolls up all your Income and Expense balances into Equity.
08:04:47 <warlord> But.... not all reports properly ignore those closing transactions.
08:04:50 <warlord> (known issue)
08:05:19 <Jozua_Judah> aaaaah
08:05:28 <Jozua_Judah> k
08:05:32 <Jozua_Judah> right oh
08:05:38 <Jozua_Judah> last question
08:06:05 <Jozua_Judah> from an audit point of view its not good to be able to go back in history and change transaction data
08:06:24 <warlord> Besides, most of the reports already know how to handle periods, so the only thing the close books does for you is make your Chart of Accounts Income/Expense balances show you the 'current period' balance instead of the 'since the beginning of time'
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08:06:55 <Jozua_Judah> aaaaah cool to know
08:06:55 <warlord> Right. Write your data file onto a CD or other write-once media.
08:07:02 <warlord> then you can't modify it.
08:08:02 <Jozua_Judah> I thought so
08:08:24 <Jozua_Judah> The auditors might not like that too much
08:09:12 <warlord> There's no way to enforce the rule. You could open up the data file in an editor and make changes to it if you wanted.
08:09:18 <Jozua_Judah> because it means I might have to separate transaction from a month to month basis which makes reporting harder
08:09:33 <Jozua_Judah> I saw that
08:09:44 <warlord> But that's true of *ANY* program.
08:09:56 <warlord> Any program that says that it prevents changes is lying to you
08:10:09 <Jozua_Judah> yes and no
08:10:10 <warlord> It might make it challenging, but nothing is impossible.
08:10:17 <Jozua_Judah> I agree
08:11:13 <Jozua_Judah> Navision can make changes for you but those changes creates reverse transactions. once a entry is posted its posted...
08:12:09 <Jozua_Judah> thats why there is spilt in ERP packages for business between ledgers and journals
08:12:19 <warlord> Sure, but if someone really wanted they could go in and change the data file under Navision.
08:12:37 <warlord> The split doesn't protect you
08:12:52 <warlord> The split is just an historical artifact due to the way it was done with pencil and paper.
08:13:31 <Jozua_Judah> I like gnucash don't get me wrong
08:15:27 <Jozua_Judah> but I feel it could try and protect the postings form users trying to manipulate previous transactions. There is no way to track....people can cheat in Nav but they get caught out very quickly becaus ethey have to post new entries
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08:15:44 <Jozua_Judah> anyway thanks for the help....
08:16:23 <Jozua_Judah> I will probably be back again
08:17:16 <warlord> We don't do it for the same reason that we don't have passwords.
08:17:25 <warlord> There are other tools that can protect the data much better than we can.
08:17:33 <warlord> So we encourage people to use them.
08:17:46 <warlord> E.g., TrueCrypt for data protection..
08:17:58 <warlord> ... and writing to a CD-ROM for read-only protection.
08:18:17 <warlord> Since GnuCash isn't multi-user it's really not an issue of who made changes.
08:18:40 <Jozua_Judah> aaaaah
08:18:48 <Jozua_Judah> that answer my question
08:19:07 <Jozua_Judah> somewhat
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08:20:29 <warlord> heh
08:21:05 <warlord> when we eventually have multi-user DB support (in about 2 more versions) I suspect we will also have an "audit trail".
08:21:31 <Jozua_Judah> I hear what you are saying
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08:28:09 <sommersohn> Hi there, I cannot save my settings unter MacOS. Might anyone help?
08:28:38 <warlord> hi sommersohn -- that means that gconfd isn't running. What version of GnuCash are you running? And what version of OSX?
08:29:39 <sommersohn> OSX 10.6 (Snow Leopard) and the newest GnuCash version.
08:30:22 <sommersohn> It asked me several things when started first time. I always sayed "yes" or "whatever" ;-)
08:30:52 <sommersohn> Now I think I should better have read all those questions ;-)
08:31:01 <warlord> define "newest gnucash version". Please be explicit
08:31:26 <warlord> Also, it should have asked you for your admin password to install a symlink after you copied the App bundle into your Apps folder.. ??
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08:31:45 <sommersohn> Sorry. It is 2.4.3.
08:31:49 <warlord> Also.... was this an update from an older version?
08:32:08 <sommersohn> No. A completely new install. Never before on the computer.
08:32:38 <warlord> Hmm..
08:33:08 <warlord> I'm afraid our MacOSX guy doesn't hang out here.. He does, however, promptly answer questions on the gnucash-user mailing list.
08:33:09 <sommersohn> It might have asked me for an admin password. What symlink should it have created?
08:33:49 <sommersohn> ok. fine. I will write to the list this evening (dont have the computer here now, anyway.)
08:33:53 <warlord> I dont remember where it puts it.
08:34:02 <sommersohn> However, thanks for your help!
08:34:14 <warlord> Good luck. Sorry I didn't have the immediate answer.
08:34:36 <sommersohn> no prob. Was my fault (didnt carefully read what it was asking)
08:34:51 <sommersohn> just from interesst: Which country are you from?
08:38:49 <sommersohn> Thanks for your help. Good bye.
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09:36:47 <Antisoche> Reconciliation ... how does this work?
09:37:24 <Antisoche> I've entered all my transaction and 'c'd them from my statements. I have [most] everything balanced so I'm going through one more time.
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09:38:42 <Antisoche> I open a statement and go into reconciliation and say "This is January 31, 2007", but it gives me every transaction until today and I don't see how to 'R' just the January stuff.
09:41:20 <Antisoche> Working backwards (most recent statement first) isn't better...
09:41:41 <Antisoche> I'm back on 2.2.9 ... is this a known issue or am I (still) confused?
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09:44:23 <Antisoche> Okay, I'm just confused. The CheckButton seems to do it's job.
09:44:28 <Antisoche> Thanks for listening. :)
09:46:28 <Antisoche> I think my problem was that I relly said "January 2003" instead of 2007 ...
09:49:32 <warlord> Antisoche: a) you can't work backwards.. reconciliation is always from "the beginning of time" to the reconcile date.
09:49:45 <warlord> b) the fact that you've cleared all your transactions is what's fouling you up.
09:50:19 <warlord> If your balances are all correct then just reconcile to your most recent statement.
09:50:30 <warlord> ... it will cause everything earlier to get reconciled.
09:51:36 <Antisoche> No - I think it's from "the beginning of record". I tried "beginning of time" (4 years prior to the first entry) and that's what got me stuck. Clearing the fields is actually very handy for tracing the money flow.
09:52:23 <warlord> The problem is that you cleared everything and *then* reconciled. That's not how it's designed to work. You're supposed to clear/reconcile/clear/reconcile on a per-statement basis.
09:52:51 <warlord> I.e., you're not supposed to clear things in "next month" before you get "this month's" statement and reconcile... If you do you have to uncheck those items in the reconcile window.
09:53:55 <Antisoche> Maybe not always, but as I'm trying to merge information for over 10 different accounts it was very useful. It may not be designed to be done that way, but it works. Reconciliation works, too - I'm chugging along now. :)
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09:55:45 <warlord> Glad you got it working.
09:59:50 <Antisoche> A bit part of my headache was that my statements all said things like "Deposit" and "Transfer Out". Since this is my trading account, I'd move money from brokerage to bank to CD, and vice-versa. I also funded it from an external account. I don't draft checks so that's fortunate (reconciliation is very easy) but I had to enter all the movements from "<Account>" to "<Imbalance>" and then stitch things together, which cleared the
09:59:50 <Antisoche> flags. I have no records at all of the CD accounts so that was fun. Either way, it's been an adventure.
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10:08:31 <warlord> Why Imbalance?
10:09:40 <Antisoche> I had to put them somewhere before I knew where they came from/went to. I was putting them in Equity:Opening Balances, but that was a bad idea...
10:10:12 <Antisoche> Imbalance was easier because I didn't have to enter it explicitly as well.
10:10:14 <warlord> Ah. gotcha
10:31:03 <Antisoche> Does reconciliation "do" anything special wrt the data? If I reconcile an "Opening Balance" now and later find an earlier statement, would anything untoward happen if I break the reconciled Opening Balance and put in earlier entries, then reconcile again?
10:36:00 <warlord> Well,.....
10:36:03 <warlord> dont do that
10:36:40 <warlord> (it can cause trouble because it will break your startig reconciliation balance.. and you'll have to make sure you fix that all up
10:37:49 * Antisoche now considers himeself something of a financial forensics expert, so no worries. ;-)
10:38:46 <warlord> LOL
10:39:38 <Antisoche> I just noticed that GNC is very good about giving me the next date to reconcile and a closing balance, so I wanted to make sure this did "cement" anything other than changing that 'R' flag.
10:39:50 <Antisoche> didn't cement anything
10:40:08 <warlord> It computes the 'next' date based on the last two reconciliations for the account.
10:41:30 <warlord> The suggested balance is just the account balance on the proposed closing date (which may or may not be correct)
10:43:37 <Antisoche> So it sounds like it's just the flag. It there any concept behind reconciling, say, Income:Interest or does that generally not make sense? Would that be a 1099 (yearly summary issued to the IRS)?
10:44:25 <warlord> It generally only makes sense for acounts that have printed periodic statements.
10:44:42 <warlord> (e.g. assets and liabilities from banks and other instututions)
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10:53:14 <Antisoche> ugh 'Reconcile' needs an accelerator :(
10:53:34 <warlord> Eh, it's something that you only do once a month.
10:53:57 <Antisoche> heh; it's something *you* do once a month. :)
10:54:13 <Antisoche> I'm up to 2008...
10:55:39 <Antisoche> (But on a serious note, it is once per account per month ... which is near a dozen for me...)
10:58:01 <warlord> Fair enough. But you know you COULD add a keyboard shortcut to the menu item!
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10:58:15 <Antisoche> I tried ... is there a pref to allow it?
10:58:31 <warlord> I dont think so. it's a gtk feature.
10:58:38 <warlord> (I've never used it)
10:58:48 <Antisoche> I hovered & hit Ctrl+R but nothing...
10:59:15 <Antisoche> I think they changed it to default to off because it was confusing
10:59:23 <warlord> Dunno.
11:00:39 <Antisoche> I can probably fix it in my .gtkrc, but it's been forever since I looked in there...
11:02:53 <Antisoche> One problem of something that you only do monthly is that you tend to forget the steps ... one upside of entering 7 years' worth of records is that I don't think I'll forget any of this come next month...
11:08:26 <warlord> LOL
11:11:00 <Antisoche> ok, just to ask again: Reconcile only changes the flag, yes? If I have no transactions in an account for the past year, I have no reason to walk to 12 no-op reconciliation steps, true?
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11:14:09 <warlord> It changes the split flags, sets the split ReconcileDate, and updates the 'last recociled date' of the account.
11:15:36 <Antisoche> Okay - so the entirety of the reconciliation history process is a single 'last reconciled' field.
11:15:58 <Antisoche> That's helpful, thanks.
11:16:13 <Antisoche> Wish I'd asked a few hours ago ...
11:19:49 <warlord> Well, that last two.
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15:13:44 <Joc> I'm new to GnuCash, I'm not sure what account type I should setup for each of the partners, each can have a salary and can make expenses for the company (to be reimbursed from the checking account), any suggestion?
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15:26:12 <Joc> that's strange, irc.gnome.org and irc.gimp.org get me to the same IRC channel, how come?
15:28:51 <Joc> I'm talking to myself only, this is not fun. :(
15:29:40 <jsled> they both point ot the same irc network.
15:31:17 <Joc> that's a bit strange, while searching for the gnucash channel I came accross those two servers. Leaving one...
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15:36:58 <Joc> is there a way to change the position of an account? Right now "Pay" appears before "Expense" probably because of the order I created them.
15:38:34 <warlord> Joc: click on the name column header?
15:41:09 <Joc> ?
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15:41:35 <Askarii> something changed as I re-installed windows
15:41:48 <Askarii> when I imported my Gnucash file all $ signs became "CAD"
15:41:55 <Askarii> how can I return it to $ signs
15:42:05 <Askarii> this is for my reports
15:45:22 <warlord> Joc: in the account tree list. Click on the "Account Name" column header.
15:45:48 <warlord> Askarii: Fix your computer locale to be in Canada instead of US (en_CA)
15:46:18 <Joc> I can select ascending (up arrow), descending (down arrow), and a third one (left arrow), it's the third one I would like to fix.
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15:49:14 <warlord> Well, what order do you want it to be in?
15:49:45 <warlord> If you don't want ascending or descending order, what random order DO you want?
15:50:56 <Askarii1> this have antyhing to do with what I asked?
15:51:51 <warlord> Askarii: nope, only me previous comment does.
15:51:57 <warlord> <warlord> Askarii: Fix your computer locale to be in Canada instead of US (en_CA)
15:52:27 <Joc> right now "Pay" appears *after* "Expense" for one of the partner, and the reverse for the second partner, I tried to drag the account to "right" position, but that did't work.
15:53:31 <Joc> Am I right to thing that the left arrow selection will show the accounts in the order they were entered?
15:53:42 <Joc> err, thing=think
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15:54:42 <jsled> maybe. it's probably best to think of the behavior in that case as "undefined" or "unsorted"
15:54:58 <jsled> but who cares what order the accounts are listed in?
15:55:22 <Joc> I do... :)
15:56:11 <Joc> no big deal, I can erase them and re-create them, they have no transaction at this point of time.
15:57:03 <warlord> Joc: In what way is the Ascending or Descending order not correct?
15:58:01 <jsled> Joc: why does sorting them by name not work, if you do care what order they're in?
15:58:47 <Joc> mmmh, you're probably right, ascending should work.
15:59:29 <Joc> I need to run, but thanks for answering my question. Will be back later.
16:02:15 <warlord> you're welcome.
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17:04:05 <tim_> can gnucash print a profit/loss statement? My accountant wants me to get Quickbooks because he wants this statement.
17:09:34 <Antisoche> tim_: Do you know how that's different from the Balance Sheet report?
17:10:34 <Antisoche> tim_: Sorry, I mean Income Statement
17:10:52 <Antisoche> http://wiki.gnucash.org/wiki/FAQ#Q:_What_happened_to_my_Profit_and_Loss_report_when_I_upgraded_to_2.0.3F
17:15:07 <tim_> It may be the same thing I'm fairly novice at financial statements. Just opened a business and printed him some reports. Under Income & Expense the Income Statement would be equivilant to a Profit & Loss?
17:15:23 <Antisoche> According to the FAQ, yes.
17:16:21 <Antisoche> It should show all your, well, income and expenses. Income = Profit; Expense = Loss. Not sure why the report was renamed from P&L
17:17:02 <tim_> Thanks. He was telling me I needed quickbooks to get a P&L
17:18:03 <Antisoche> Unless P&L means something specific your accountant wants, but I suspect that's not the case. Accountants do love quickbooks though.
17:19:05 <tim_> Thanks
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17:19:21 <Antisoche> Were I you, when you bring him the Income&Expense report, I'd also bring a laptop with your data ....
17:19:24 <Antisoche> ... bye.
17:21:33 <warlord> Yes, P&L == Income Statement. I don't know why it was renamed; apparently someone thought it was more "business-report-naming-like" or something.
17:22:01 <warlord> In 2.4 it was effectively renamed back.. (technically it now has both names)
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17:53:34 <Antisoche> So - it looks like some money just appeared in one of my accounts. Where is the best place to record these unaccounable gains? Should I leave them in Imbalance or move them into ... something under Equity?
17:55:22 <warlord> Well, where did it come from?
17:55:26 <warlord> Income:Gifts?
17:55:58 <Antisoche> Thin Air. Completely unaccountable for.
17:56:13 <jsled> It's not Imbalance, certainly.
17:56:16 <jsled> it's Income of some kind
17:56:41 <warlord> Income:Thin Air ?
17:56:51 <Antisoche> let me recheck the statement for details. :)
17:58:06 <Antisoche> It claims it came from a check. Actually, two checks. On the same day. In an account I don't write checks to. For amounts that make no sense for what the account is ...
18:04:53 <Antisoche> Hmm. It looks like it may have been mis-deposited. I forgot I have another account (or 2) to enter the transactions for ... Maybe in two more days I'll be able to tell if this is the case.
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19:01:53 <Joc> I'm new to gnucash, what would be a good way to add the "partners", both can have a salary and can claim an expense. I'm thinking of creating two new accounts at the top level, with two sub levels called salary and expense. Any suggestions?
19:11:08 <warlord> Joc, I'd ask your accountant. Or to put it back at you: if you were accounting for this on pen/paper, how would you do it? Are these "partners" equity owners?
19:11:25 <warlord> Is their salary an actual salary or a capital withdrawal?
19:11:33 <Joc> I'm the accountant...
19:11:53 <Joc> I'm having lots of hats... :)
19:13:06 <Joc> it's basically when a customer buys something from our company, we get some of the money, which is basically our salary
19:13:27 <Joc> we a have a partnership
19:14:32 <Joc> the money from the customer gets deposited to the banking account, then, and that's the question, we need to transfer some of that money to each of the partners
19:14:40 <warlord> Hmm... You might want to ask on the gnucash-user mailing list -- there are more people there who can help answer your questions like this.
19:15:49 <warlord> Well, you only need to "transfer" it to the partners when they withdraw it. Perhaps you could have a subaccount of your bank for each partner which is "partner profit". So when you deposit a payment it goes into the bank, and then the partner profit splits into the subaccounts. I'm assuming you don't take 100%, but only some off the top?
19:16:05 <Joc> "equity owners" is that something that exist in gnucash? I was wondering if should be an employee.
19:17:24 <Joc> that's right, about 50% for each of the two partners, minus the expanses.
19:17:35 <warlord> Business -> Employee is for reimbursible expenses. not for salaries, etc.
19:18:26 <warlord> Perhaps you should consider allocating the profits on a periodic basis.. It sounds more like a capital withdrawal than a salary, per se.
19:19:16 <Joc> oh, "reimbursible expenses", that looks very, very interesting, that's the other side of the partners, the expenses. I'm not sure how to setup that.
19:19:17 <warlord> So I'd create Equity:Parters:... and then periodically (when you write your partner profit checks) xfer from Checking -> Eq:P:...
19:20:23 <warlord> Well, it's for *reimbursible* expenses.. I.e., when an employee uses their own personal funds for the business and expects to get a check back for it.
19:20:25 <Joc> the payments are not regular, it depends when the customer buy something.
19:20:49 <warlord> That's okay, "periodic" does not imply "regular".
19:21:29 <Joc> oh?
19:22:41 <Joc> when the customer buy something, that's when we get paid. I'm not sure what would be the "right" way to set that up.
19:23:14 <Joc> I don't understand how that could be "periodic"
19:24:02 <warlord> What I mean is: don't tie your payment directly to the customer payment.
19:24:15 <Joc> agreed
19:27:20 <Joc> as I said, I was thinking of creating a placeholder account for each of the partners, with a sub folder for the "salary" and reimbursible expense. But after reading what you said, I'm not sure at all that's a good way now.
19:28:00 <Joc> ok, maybe we can start with the reimbursible* expenses, how do I go in seting that up?
19:30:17 <warlord> Business -> Employee
19:31:04 <Joc> ok
19:31:41 <Joc> do you mean the "expense voucher"?
19:31:52 <warlord> yes
19:32:00 <warlord> But you need to set up the employees first.
19:32:59 <Joc> ok, I'm seeing that now.
19:36:22 <Joc> mmh, there's got to be a way to see a list of all the employees I created, right?
19:37:42 <warlord> Business -> Employee -> Find name [matches regex] .
19:37:47 <warlord> (that's a period by itself)
19:38:29 <Joc> super!
19:38:43 <Joc> ok, I got the employees created.
19:40:05 <Joc> oops, created a duplicate. not sure how to delete it.
19:42:33 <warlord> there is no delete. only "make inactive".. or re-use for the next oe
19:42:34 <warlord> one
19:43:27 <Joc> that's not very good. :(
19:47:59 <Joc> oh, I found out how to delete an employee, select the "delete results from the current search". Just make sure that only name that you want to delete are there... :(
19:48:48 <warlord> that doesn't delete it from the datafile
19:49:35 <Joc> that find is pretty powerful, but that takes some getting use to.
19:51:56 <Joc> ah, ok, I find that's a bit silly not to be able to delete.
19:55:01 <Joc> it's becoming obvious that I will need to do some more reading
19:55:19 <Joc> I've to rush, thanks for you help.
19:57:56 <warlord> Good luck.
19:58:06 <warlord> And it may be silly, but ... it is what it is.
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20:29:46 <liria> hi to all
20:30:00 <liria> is there anyone
20:30:06 <liria> i have a question
20:30:47 <warlord> just ask
20:30:48 <liria> i have to translate gnucash for my father but i dont know how
20:31:07 <liria> what file have the words that i have to translate
20:31:27 <warlord> into what language?
20:31:37 <liria> albanian
20:31:51 <warlord> see http://wiki.gnucash.org/wiki/Translation
20:32:04 <liria> i think that dont have in albanian so i have to translate it by myself
20:33:26 <liria> yes but if is possible to tell me the file that i have to translate
20:33:36 <liria> please help me
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20:34:06 <warlord> did you read that web page?
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20:51:46 <liria> yes but may be that it works on linux i can not understand
20:51:56 <liria> someone can tell me what to do
20:52:42 <Antisoche> Where are you getting stuck?
20:53:05 <liria> what
20:53:22 <liria> i dont know what file i have to change
20:53:27 <liria> to change the words
20:53:33 <Antisoche> If you are following the instuctions in the wiki, what part are you haveing trouble with?
20:53:49 <liria> i want to translate all
20:53:55 <liria> menu ect all
20:54:14 <liria> but there is not explained how to do from windows
20:54:28 <liria> can you explain the steps
20:54:42 <warlord> it's all the same
20:55:18 <liria> how ????
20:55:23 <Antisoche> The translations aren't just stored in a text file, they have to be built with the compiler (IIUC)
20:56:16 <warlord> liria: follow the instructions on the website
20:56:51 <liria> yes but is for linux
20:57:01 <liria> or a shell that i dont know
20:57:06 <liria> what shell i have to use
20:57:17 <liria> and where i can find po/gnucash.pot ?
20:57:46 <Antisoche> You have to download the source first. Have you done that?
20:57:51 <warlord> you have to generate it from a build tree
20:58:23 <warlord> or look at the translation project
20:58:49 <liria> no
20:58:53 <Antisoche> liria: Under Windows, you can use this program to get the source: http://tortoisesvn.tigris.org/
20:58:57 <liria> where to find the source
20:59:32 <Antisoche> Then - I've never done translations, myself - it looks like you can use this to edit the translations: http://www.poedit.net/
21:00:38 <Antisoche> Here's the SVN URL: http://wiki.gnucash.org/wiki/Subversion
21:00:45 <liria> thanks a lot i am taking note
21:01:00 <liria> but i have to do it step by strep
21:01:07 <warlord> liria: it's a huge job..
21:01:10 <liria> is it dificult?
21:01:32 <warlord> http://wiki.gnucash.org/wiki/Windows
21:01:42 <warlord> apparently... ;)
21:02:39 <Antisoche> If you follow the first page warlord mentioned, it suggests you get in touch with the GNOME translation project. They may be able to help once you've gotten the strings translated.
21:03:37 <liria> yes but i thought it was easy just as changing words
21:04:04 <Antisoche> Well, the translations are OS independent, no? So once the text is there the translators should be able to tell if they work under Linux. From there, someone else can get a Windows build...ya?
21:04:27 <liria> ya man
21:04:51 <warlord> liria: it's a little more than that,. but you need to be able to build to test the translation
21:05:11 <liria> ok so i have to compile all the program
21:05:38 <Antisoche> liria: Do you know *nix at all?
21:05:56 <liria> could you suggest me any similar software that works online and is in php so i can change the words simply
21:05:59 <warlord> yes.
21:06:07 <warlord> nope
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21:09:18 <Antisoche> liria: Do you know *nix at all?
21:10:03 <Antisoche> I'm so glad I pay attention
21:17:57 <warlord> Antisoche: I think liria needed a LOT of hand-holding..
21:20:18 <Antisoche> Yes, I expect so.
21:20:58 <Antisoche> I think they could have gotten started relatively quickly though.
21:22:06 <warlord> the hardest part is generating gnucash.pot
21:22:15 <warlord> The most amount of work happens after that.
21:22:32 <Antisoche> If they took the path: Install VirtualBox -> Install Ubuntu -> sudo apt-get build-dep gnucash -> sudo apt-get install poedit, and then it's just a 'make' (I expect; maybe edit a Makefile...)
21:23:06 <warlord> sorta, yeah.
21:23:23 <Antisoche> I've never been in a position to do i18n/l10n so I really can't comment too much.
21:23:51 <Antisoche> Oh, there's an 'svn co' in there somewhere ..
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21:24:52 <Antisoche> In my prodigious free time I should do a pig-latin translation just for the experience.
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21:25:08 <Antisoche> Of course, I'd probably just write a script to do it...
21:27:00 <Antisoche> er...
21:29:17 <Antisoche> Okay - entries for an employer-sponsored pre-tax retirement account ... that money comes from where?
21:30:10 <Antisoche> Income:Tax-Deferred maybe?
21:30:58 <Antisoche> Or just Income:Deferred ...?
21:39:39 <warlord> sure
21:44:58 <Antisoche> I like it
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