2010-12-28 GnuCash IRC logs
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13:13:41 <gour> interesting threads on devel "Future of Gnucash" & "Onwards"...
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13:16:39 <bobs> morning - does anyone else have problem with check printing - super small font, in top left of page - 2 different printer and PDF printer
13:17:46 <bobs> win 7 and 2.4.0 (problem since 2.3.15)
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13:43:56 <warlord> gour: yeah
13:44:11 <warlord> bobs: dunno; I dont use Windows.
13:44:16 <gour> :-)
13:48:43 <warlord> gour: who knows what will come of it.
13:49:11 <gour> warlord: how many 'core' devs are in gnc?
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13:54:03 <warlord> ~10
13:55:04 <kimmo> nice, 2.4.0 .dmg
13:55:15 <lampliter> I need to do some "basic" household accounting.. Tracking incomes, budgets, expenses and report on discrepancies. I will admit that looking at gnucash is a bit overwhelming and I'm not sure how to get started. Are there any really short, quick and dirty paths to learning the basics or, alternatively, a simpler program. I need to make the same program run on Windows and Linux but that should come as no surprise
13:55:36 <lampliter> any enlightenment/education would be most welcome
13:58:53 <lampliter> was that a wrong question?
13:59:49 <gour> lampliter: 'concepts guide' ?
14:00:55 <warlord> lampliter: the GnuCash Concepts & Tutorial is a good read
14:01:36 <lampliter> Okay. My brother-in-law is pushing me to use spreadsheets and I find them fundamentally repugnant. I'm hoping this will be a better experience
14:02:08 <warlord> IMHO GnuCash is >> spreadsheets for much of this.
14:03:10 <kimmo> I can vouch for gnucash for household stuffs
14:03:26 <kimmo> been doing it for some 12 or so years now
14:03:31 <kimmo> when was 1.4 released?
14:03:44 <warlord> a long long time ago.
14:03:53 <lampliter> what? Shift to gnucash right once to get a spreadsheet? :-)
14:04:34 <kimmo> lampliter, if you need a tool to track incomes and expenses, why not use a tool designed for that?
14:04:57 <warlord> 11 years ago
14:05:10 <lampliter> kimmo: that's good to know. Was it horribly difficult to setup? Or was it a gestalt learning process?
14:05:29 <kimmo> it was relatively simple
14:05:37 <lampliter> kimmo: I agree with you. I hate spreadsheets and I think people abuse them horribly so it rather use an appropriate tool but the learning curve needs to be commensurate with what I'm doing
14:05:41 <kimmo> it did help that I had basic accounting knowledge
14:05:46 <warlord> lampliter: IMHO it's pretty simple to get started. The hardest part is learning the basics of double-entry
14:05:59 <lampliter> yeah, the closest I got to accounting knowledge was sharing the same house with my father
14:06:00 <kimmo> Excel is the "magic word" that's been going on for 15 years now
14:06:10 <lampliter> and he's dead
14:06:38 <lampliter> so I guess I have some reading and playing to do
14:06:46 <kimmo> I did 1999 with a "off the top of my head" accounts chart, ditched that in 99/00 to go with a more proper account structure, been happy with it ever since
14:07:19 <kimmo> lampliter, a basic tutorial or a $30 textbook gives you the basic know-how
14:07:23 <warlord> lampliter: As we said, go through the Concepts & Tutorial guide. Then you can "start fresh" once you understand the basics.
14:07:44 <lampliter> okay. So learn double entry then translate to how gnu cash operates etc. Got it on concept and tutorials guide. This time you don't need to tell me twice. :-)
14:08:18 <lampliter> I'm not worried about starting fresh because everyday I wake up with an empty mind. Drives my wife crazy because I keep asking her what her name is
14:08:49 <kimmo> lampliter, I suggest you install it right now. Try it, use it for a year or so. As you're under no legal obligation, you can spend the first year just experimenting just as I did
14:09:24 <kimmo> I immediately found that that separating simple "Groceries" purchases to 10 separate accounts just doesn't pay off :D
14:10:21 <gour> i can recommend http://www.goodreads.com/book/show/1638198.Accounting_Game_2e for getting into accounting (basics)
14:10:24 <lampliter> Not worried about that. I just want to get started on some accounting now because of some crap you don't need to know about and I can refine it as I go along
14:10:58 <lampliter> Let me it's a reading. I appreciate the help. The biggest puzzle for me is why my father wanted to be an accountant.
14:13:07 <kimmo> I'd say because being an accountant _vastly_ increases your financial IQ
14:13:19 <warlord> heh
14:13:50 <kimmo> at this point, I'd like to vouch for www.richdad.com for some easy reading "self help" financial IQ books
14:13:51 <lampliter> Yeah, he only got trouble with the IRS twice. Deeply in trouble for, shall we say, aggressive asset category assignment
14:14:23 <kimmo> yeah well most people these days have trouble with basic concepts such as "Credit", "interest", "per annum" etc
14:14:46 <kimmo> being financially literate these days is like being bilingual in the dark ages
14:14:54 <warlord> @beevis: "He said per annum. heh heh.."
14:14:54 <gncbot> warlord: Error: "beevis:" is not a valid command.
14:15:16 <lampliter> yeah I Got trouble with "IT as a career is not viable beyond the age of 40 especially if you broke your hands working your ass off"
14:16:07 <kimmo> IT as a career is silly
14:16:17 <lampliter> it wasn't when I started
14:16:20 <kimmo> (I should know, I'm on that track)
14:16:36 <kimmo> IT as a career means that you have to _work_ to get _paid_.
14:16:49 <lampliter> unfortunately, I'm seeing the same kind of lying about career opportunities as we move into the cloud
14:16:58 <kimmo> the cloud is a hoax
14:17:14 <lampliter> working to get paid? Dammit, I've been doing that all my life which is why my hands get broken. I started three companies, one of which was moderately successful
14:17:22 <kimmo> it's no wonder in Finnish, the translation for "could" is the same as for "weed"
14:17:50 <lampliter> and still, I'm seen as not being an asset in part because my hands are broken even though I'm a top level designer/analyst.
14:17:51 <kimmo> I've so far started 5
14:18:05 <lampliter> hey great. It is a rush isn't it?
14:18:11 <kimmo> one of the is still in IT, trying very very hard to get rid of that
14:18:15 <kimmo> yeah
14:18:35 <kimmo> I found that the size of your employer correlates with unhappiness
14:18:50 <kimmo> so I'm self-employed for 3 years now
14:19:03 <kimmo> doing my own accounting, I might add!
14:19:14 <kimmo> my auditor was impressed by gnucash, too
14:19:19 <lampliter> I've been self-employed for 16 years
14:19:21 <kimmo> "so this software os free?"
14:19:54 <lampliter> I love being self-employed when things go well and even when things don't go quite so well but right now, it's not good unless you're a coder
14:20:26 <kimmo> it can get quite stressful, especially during these days when your clients don't yet have approved budget for next year
14:21:03 <kimmo> but other than that, I figure it's no more stressful than being an employed salesguy on a commission
14:21:10 <lampliter> I'm looking forward to learning how this works then I get to teach my wife how to run gnucash on her Facebook station
14:21:30 <lampliter> I mean ubuntu workstation
14:22:07 <kimmo> hehe
14:22:20 <kimmo> where do you live btw?
14:23:06 <lampliter> Boston area
14:23:17 <lampliter> Northeast US
14:23:49 <lampliter> lots of snow recently with hundred kilometer per hour winds
14:25:02 <warlord> Heh. I used to live in Somerville
14:25:28 <lampliter> Where street lights grace every hill
14:25:43 <warlord> heh
14:25:45 * gour is from cold (-3C atm) Croatia
14:26:12 <warlord> It was about -3C this morning; but it's now up to about 6C
14:26:15 <warlord> (maybe 7)
14:26:21 <lampliter> we're only minus 1C and 25 kilometers per hour out of the west northwest
14:26:34 <lampliter> I love weather bug
14:26:54 <warlord> Our wind here is NW at 10kts
14:30:10 <gour> i'm going to continue reading 'accounting lemonade' book to grasp those (strange) principles a bit...then we'll appreciate gnc more...and probably going to customize it :-)
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14:37:26 <gour> g'night folks
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14:40:21 <lampliter> I really like the concept document.
14:40:33 <lampliter> Right to the point and clear.
14:40:39 <kimmo> warlord, in ATL ?
14:41:28 <warlord> yeah
14:42:42 <kimmo> wow, 27 F, really?
14:45:33 <lampliter> summertime can be really unpleasant down there
14:45:43 <warlord> This morning (around 7:30-8am), yes. It's up for 45 now.
14:45:47 <warlord> er, up to
14:46:01 <warlord> and yes, summer can be unpleasant.
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16:06:09 <mishehu> pssh
16:06:15 <mishehu> atlanta schmatlanta
16:06:26 <mishehu> I'm deep in o/` the heaaaaaaart of texas o/`
16:06:34 <mishehu> where we're further south than Arizona
16:06:46 <warlord> Ah, but not as far south as Florida
16:06:58 <mishehu> as parts of florida yes, but not miami
16:07:30 <mishehu> but once you get past a certain point, it just isn't able to get any hotter
16:07:53 <mishehu> and I'm crazy - I drive around in the summer with my windows in my car open - when it's 110 deg F out
16:14:35 <warlord> definitely makes you sound crazy
16:15:03 <mishehu> yeah I only put on the a/c if I run out of water to drink or I have a chick in the car with me
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16:15:27 <lampliter> gnucash made my head explode.. not in a good way
16:16:15 <mishehu> and why did it do that to your head?
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16:16:43 <lampliter> cramming too mucch in a shortr time
16:18:01 <lampliter> I'm stuck a bit on account (category) creation and when to use subaccounts
16:18:34 <lampliter> in general, I'm also stuck on the concept of expense tracking versus budget
16:20:58 <warlord> Ignore budgeting for now.
16:21:04 <warlord> Just think about tracking your expenses.
16:21:17 <lampliter> k
16:21:17 <warlord> As for when to use a subaccount, well, that's all about how you want to group your expenses togetehr.
16:21:41 <lampliter> So for example, under medical I would have, co-pay, pharmacy, junk
16:21:54 <mishehu> whatever fits your needs man
16:21:59 <warlord> For example, you may want to combine all your Utility expenses.
16:22:37 <lampliter> actually, wouldn't you want to group them in part by tax ductility? Or is that a different slice of the data?
16:22:44 <lampliter> Tax deductibility
16:23:26 <lampliter> I'm kind of trying to read your mind a bit. And utility example would have water, electricity, gas but then they would be summed up as one total expense in the parent account???
16:23:27 <warlord> Different slice, IMHO
16:24:28 <lampliter> How do you deal with a payment that should be sliced into multiple parts for accounting purposes?
16:24:42 <lampliter> Or is that the wrong way to look at
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16:32:18 <lampliter> Rough net tonight. Keep getting dropped
16:33:38 <warlord> No worries.
16:33:55 <warlord> Payments that should get split can just be split.
16:34:08 <warlord> Read the docs on Split Transactions
16:38:44 <lampliter> ok
16:39:05 <lampliter> man it is really tough installing gnucash on a facebook station..
16:39:24 <lampliter> keeps wanting to friend every dollar it sees
16:40:55 <warlord> heh
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