2010-09-09 GnuCash IRC logs
00:23:00 <heinrich> Found the answer: it's always accrual and only accrual
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14:41:45 <mintcash> I have two problems . 1- my gnucash 2.2.9 crashed Found Finance::Quote version 1.17 Segmentation fault 2-I have problem with concept of Equity and Liabilities . I read manual for this point. but I don't understand. it said: Equity=Assets - Liabilities . but how this occur . for example I put 1000$ from Opening Balances in my bank account . after that I income 500$ and move it to my bank account and I Expenses 350$ so in my bank account I have 1150 . so I
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14:42:27 <kimmo> mintcash, I can't help with the crash, but I can help with the concepts
14:42:36 <mintcash> kimmo: thanks
14:43:06 <kimmo> Equity accounts, for personal finance, are only used to record the opening balance
14:43:10 <jsled> mintcash: you got cut off at " I have 1150 . so I "
14:43:30 <jsled> think of the Equity account as "Equity Adjustments". Instantaneous Equity is only reflected by running a report.
14:43:36 <mintcash> kimmo: it manually ?
14:44:42 <kimmo> your equity stays the same throughout the bookkeeping year
14:44:59 <jsled> the equity account value, that is.
14:45:07 <kimmo> yeah
14:46:16 <mintcash> kimmo: so it means. each I income or Expens I should record in equity account manually for future I know what I did ?
14:46:36 <kimmo> mintcash, no, you record them in Income and Expense accounts
14:46:46 <kimmo> so a salary is from Income account to bank account
14:47:01 <kimmo> and paying bills is from bank account to Expense account
14:47:43 <kimmo> your "net worth" if you will is the sum of year-start equity plus profit/loss for the bookkeeping period
14:48:08 <mintcash> kimmo: where is that
14:48:09 <mintcash> ?
14:48:44 <kimmo> reports -> income & expense -> income statement
14:50:27 <kimmo> the moment I retire, I'm going to write up a comprehensive beginner's guide to accounting with gnucash
14:51:42 <mintcash> kimmo: I Expense 200$ and 100$ using Opening Balances so my Equity account changes to 300$ . what does it mean ? the positive 300$ value in Equity account when I Expense money ?
14:52:35 <jsled> "Expense $$ using Opening Balances" doesn't make sense.
14:53:03 <jsled> Equity:Opening Balances is used to adjust the value of Asset and Liability accounts to their initial values.
14:53:25 <jsled> Expense accounts are only going to be used in relation to Asset and Liability accounts.
14:53:56 <jsled> {Equity:Opening Balances} -100-> {Assets:Bank}
14:54:03 <jsled> E:OB = 100, A:B = 100
14:54:06 <jsled> then...
14:54:18 <jsled> Assets:Bank -50-> Expenses:Whatever
14:54:24 <jsled> E:OB = 100, A:B = 50, E:W = 50
14:55:12 <mintcash> can you give me a example ? you have 1000$ in your bank . you income 500$ and you expanse 300$ and using Equity connectivity between them so I understand what is Equity use for
14:55:29 <kimmo> there is no connection to Equity
14:55:36 <jsled> I just did
14:55:57 <jsled> Income would look something like…
14:56:06 <jsled> Income:Salary -500-> Assets:Bank
14:56:26 <mintcash> ok
14:56:27 <jsled> building on the previous example, account values would be:
14:56:34 <kimmo> mintcash, Equity account only exists to balance out the initial adjustments as far as you are concerned
14:56:36 <jsled> E:OB = 100. A:B= 550, I:S = 500, E:W = 50
14:57:03 <kimmo> mintcash, since when you begin the bookkeeping, the $1000 you have in your bank is not income, not expense, and you're not borrowing it from any place
14:57:26 <mintcash> kimmo: yes
14:57:41 <kimmo> so _don't_ _touch_ _it_
14:59:08 <mintcash> kimmo: but 1000$ is in my bank and maybe I expanse it. or opposite of it I income money and append to my assets so doesn't it append to Equity ?
14:59:24 <kimmo> no
14:59:51 <kimmo> the Equity account stays at the original sum for the duration of the accounting period
15:00:07 <kimmo> I have one transaction on January 1, and another on December 31
15:00:36 <kimmo> what does change is the profit/loss for the period
15:01:02 <mintcash> hmm
15:01:06 <kimmo> when closing the books, _then_ you append the yearly profit or loss to equity
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15:01:58 <kimmo> brb, have to let the dog out
15:02:04 <mintcash> and how work with it ? means I don't need to remove and add anything to it ? (after my append first 1000$ to it ) ?
15:02:05 <jsled> mintcash: " but 1000$ is in my bank and maybe I expanse it. or opposite of it I income money and append to my assets so doesn't it append to Equity ?"
15:02:16 <jsled> Yes … your *equity* will go up. The Equity account will not change.
15:02:22 <jsled> (for the income case)
15:02:43 <jsled> Again, think of the Equity *account* in the account tree as "Equity Adjustments".
15:03:06 <jsled> Your real, account-equation-defined, equity can only be computed with the profit/loss report.
15:03:59 <mintcash> jsled: so after I put first values on Equity accounts I don't need to change it ? and works only with income and expense and assets accounts ?
15:04:07 <jsled> yes
15:04:14 <mintcash> hmm
15:04:33 <mintcash> jsled: and when I should change something to it and how ?
15:04:42 <jsled> only for opening balances.
15:04:54 <jsled> er … rephrase that last question, perhaps?
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15:05:51 <mintcash> jsled: what does that mean opening balances ? what is work exactly ?
15:06:13 <jsled> The balance that already exists in an account when you start recording it on the books, in gnucash.
15:06:38 <jsled> you probably already have a checking account or a credit card with an existing balance.
15:06:39 <mintcash> yes . and then
15:06:45 <mintcash> yes
15:06:49 <jsled> and you're not going to go back in time and record every single transaction ever in gnucash?
15:06:50 <mintcash> I have 700$
15:07:03 <kimmo> let me conjure up something
15:07:11 <jsled> So, the starting balance of 700 at the point in time where you *do* start using gnucash is the opening balance,.
15:07:19 <mintcash> yes
15:07:36 <mintcash> I put in Equity account
15:07:50 <mintcash> and start to record my income and expense
15:07:55 <mintcash> then
15:08:03 <jsled> nothing to do with income or expense.
15:08:07 <jsled> just assets and liabilities
15:08:38 <jsled> unless I misread you, there.
15:08:45 <mintcash> jsled: means when I want buy clothes not need to record it in expense account ?
15:09:04 <jsled> no, I think I misread you.
15:09:25 <mintcash> ok . I working with expense and income and assets accounts
15:09:34 <jsled> "I put [the opening balance] in Equity account" … "and start to record my income and expenses [to my Asset account]" … is that correct?
15:09:48 <mintcash> yes
15:09:56 <mintcash> and don't touch equity account
15:10:04 <jsled> buying clothes would be from Assets to Expenses (or Liabilities to Expenses if you're using a credit card)
15:10:10 <jsled> yup
15:11:24 <mintcash> what happens after that . suppose it left 3 month . when I need to change something in equity account and what is that chnages and why ?
15:11:39 <mintcash> and how
15:13:00 <kimmo> why would you need to alter it?
15:13:45 <kimmo> http://www.fairwarning.fi/files/barebones.gnc
15:16:54 <mintcash> kimmo: I don't know . and I would like to know when use it this account and what is use for . what it that file I can not open it
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15:19:36 <kimmo> that is a gnucash file
15:20:54 <kimmo> for personal finance, there's only really one use; To balance out the opening balances
15:22:23 <kimmo> (There are other uses, but they all involve more complicated things)
15:26:42 <mintcash> it open now
15:27:18 <mintcash> I'm reviewing it
15:27:30 <kimmo> in it you'll see how these basic transactions should be done
15:27:47 <kimmo> as you can see, the opening balances account stays unchanged
15:28:37 <kimmo> (The top level Equity account has an _ in front since otherwise "e" autocompletes to equity instead of expense, and I'm lazy)
15:31:38 <mintcash> hmm
15:38:37 <mintcash> kimmo: I understand what's going here . but when you come to Opening Balance or you don't come and it's only for show what do you have at first ?
15:39:08 <kimmo> it's _only_ to show what you have first
15:40:18 <mintcash> kimmo: hmmm. suppose I have a money in bank but only 700$ is for mine and another is for customers and will pay for something in future for them should I include that amount in this account ?
15:41:18 <jsled> you want to read about Accounts Receivable … http://svn.gnucash.org/docs/guide/chapter_bus_ar.html
15:41:21 <jsled> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Accounts_receivable
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15:58:13 <mintcash> is it possible to remove customers and invoices ?
16:03:12 <jsled> http://wiki.gnucash.org/wiki/FAQ#Q:_How_can_I_delete_an_Invoice.2C_Customer.2C_Vendor.2C_or_Employee.3F
16:05:23 <kimmo> if I may suggest, first learn basic accounting principles, and then learn the biz features
16:16:02 <mintcash> ok thanks
16:16:26 <kimmo> where are you from?
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16:18:47 <warlord> @op
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16:54:52 <mintcash> kimmo: IRAN
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20:28:41 <centinul> How's everyone doing tonight?
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20:29:37 <warlord> @op
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20:39:09 <centinul> I'm currently using gnucash 2.2.9 on Windows Vista x64. I'm having a slight problem with the budget display and the width of the Account column. For some reason I can't seem to shrink the width of the account column. It automatically defaults to such a wide value that I have to scroll horizontally for a long time before hte budget periods display
20:43:38 <warlord> centinul: Hm, not sure how to fix that on windows.
20:44:01 <warlord> I think it's a gconf entry; I dont know if you can adjust it from the budget register itself. I dont use that functionality myself.
20:44:49 <warlord> Or you can try what the FAQ says about column widths.
20:48:54 <centinul> can I get a link to the FAQ please?
20:49:09 <centinul> It's really annoying... basically makes budgets unusable
20:49:10 <warlord> wiki.gnucash.org/wiki/FAQ
20:49:30 <warlord> If you have 'gconf-editor' then you can adjust the entry directly.
20:49:38 <warlord> but you're on windows, so... *shrugs*
20:50:05 <centinul> hmmm
20:50:25 <centinul> Unfortunately the program won't let me grab the border between the column headers
20:53:10 <warlord> Try the next column over?
20:53:24 <warlord> Don't try to shrink the column, try expanding the next column first.
21:36:29 <centinul> okay one second
21:38:12 <centinul> The column headings for hte budget periods don't handles either
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21:52:17 <centinul> Is there anyway to repeat budget entries for the entire period?
21:53:33 <warlord> sorry, i dont know.
21:53:44 <warlord> you could try asking on the gnucash-user mailing list
21:58:08 <centinul> Thanks
21:58:17 <warlord> good luck
22:01:40 <centinul> Appreciate it... I'm surprised this channel isn't more active
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