2010-03-23 GnuCash IRC logs
00:34:19 <warlord> If the system crashed then it shouldn't have written the data file, which means it shouldn't have updated that status.
00:57:46 <ewd> That does make sense, however I had to re-add those transactions to the schedule. Do you know if anyone has done a report to list off the schedule?
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01:23:58 <warlord> ewd: I dont know. You should try asking on the email list.
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01:45:55 <ewd> Ok, thanks
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06:11:13 <gour> afaik, guile is used to customize reports in gnucash. is there any other 'field' in gnucase where guile can be used to customize/extend gnucash?
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07:11:58 <|Hajo|> Moin moin
07:14:46 <|Hajo|> weiß jemand wie man sich bei GnuCash eine Monatliche Übersicht über Einnahmen und Ausgaben anzeigenlassen kann. um herrrauszufinden ob im Monat mehr Ausgegeben wurde als Eeingenommen
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08:53:00 <ChoHag> How scriptable is gnucash? (considering that I don't know scheme and don't know the gnucash internals, so no docs == not scriptable at all)
08:53:26 <ChoHag> Specifically, I'd like to create, expert to latex and print an invoice upon receiving an email.
08:53:35 <ChoHag> As automatically as possible.
08:56:31 <gour> nice idea
09:00:53 <ChoHag> That's not what I want to hear.
09:01:03 <ChoHag> I want to hear "yeah everybody does that. They do it like this:"
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09:37:01 <gour> ChoHag: have you read about eguile and customizing reports?
09:37:14 <jsled> gour: not really. reports are the only place where guile's used. And there'd been consensus that guile use should be reduced, going forward. But I stopped dev'ing around then.
09:37:32 <jsled> it used to be guile controlled startup and some register setup as well.
09:38:22 <gour> jsled: so, guile does not have bright future in gnucash then or it will be retained for customizing reports?
09:39:21 <jsled> I don't think there's momentum to make any drastic change in that area right now.
09:39:33 <jsled> The most change that's happened is the eguile stuff.
09:39:35 <jsled> which is a big win.
09:39:43 <wingo-pi> what is eguile?
09:40:03 <jsled> http://woozle.org/~neale/src/eguile/
09:40:23 <jsled> wingo-pi: reports in gnucash have historically been guile-modules-that-emit-html-as-a-string.
09:40:37 <jsled> It would be much more end-user tractable if they were html-templates-that-had-embedded-guile.
09:40:38 <wingo-pi> reports in gnucash are how i started with scheme, actually ;)
09:40:53 <jsled> It's a simple shift, of course, but I think it'd be dramatically useful for most users.
09:41:00 <gour> wingo-pi: i'm in the same train now
09:41:14 <jsled> (Though the impedence mismatch of guile – especially for non-technical users – is a bigger hurdle)
09:41:27 <gour> wingo-pi: http://wiki.gnucash.org/wiki/Custom_Reports_Using_Eguile
09:41:49 <jsled> The other major report-related change is s/gtkhtml/webkit/
09:42:02 <jsled> which means the reports can emit useful modern html and css and whatnot.
09:42:12 <wingo-pi> eguile looks nice
09:42:21 <jsled> gour: Another way to say it is this: if someone steps up to maintain the (e)guile-based reports, then that's what'll persist going forward. :)
09:42:59 <wingo-pi> guile itself should probably include a module to do that
09:43:14 <wingo-pi> especially now that ssax is in guile itself
09:43:22 <jsled> I thought a good bit about how to overhaul reports more generally, so I'd be happy to brain dump, or try to find my old notes on it.
09:43:36 <gour> jsled: i'll most probably used gnucash for my invoices...in order to customize 'em i need to learn some guile/scheme...that's for now ;)
09:46:30 <wingo-pi> emitting html as strings is pretty backwards, fwiw -- lots of possibilities for problems.
09:46:46 <wingo-pi> escaping-wise.
09:46:56 <wingo-pi> but i understand the weight of history :)
09:47:26 <gour> what would you do?
09:47:41 <wingo-pi> output sxml of course
09:48:38 <gour> i've never worked with sxml
09:48:44 <wingo-pi> http://okmij.org/ftp/Scheme/SXML.html
09:49:45 <wingo-pi> my web page is written in sxml as well -- the dynamic parts and the static parts.
09:51:24 <wingo-pi> or http://okmij.org/ftp/Scheme/xml.html, more generally
09:51:48 <gour> what is used for parsing? dom? sax?
09:52:14 <wingo-pi> sax, sorta -- see the papers on that site.
09:52:49 <wingo-pi> http://okmij.org/ftp/Scheme/xml.html#XML-parser
09:53:27 <gour> i'm not sure how do i like it...but i'm not fan of xml as well
09:54:58 <wingo-pi> that parser really blew my mind.
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10:00:19 <gour> well, it looks better than dom/sax...but still the important question is to make it easy for end-users to customize report
10:01:05 <wingo-pi> that is an important question yes :)
10:01:21 <kimmo> no no no
10:01:28 <kimmo> that would mean a drop in consulting revenue
10:01:37 <wingo-pi> hehe
10:04:53 <gour> kimmo: lucky you. making fortune on GNUCash ;)
10:05:31 <kimmo> rather, saving a fortune using gnucash instead of outsourced accountant ;)
10:06:06 <kimmo> (But truth be told, obscure integration APIs are my cash cow)
10:06:32 <wingo-pi> my start with scheme: http://lists.gnucash.org/pipermail/gnucash-devel/2003-March/008796.html
10:08:17 <kimmo> namibia? you still there?
10:08:20 <gour> wingo-pi: cute ;)
10:08:46 <wingo-pi> nope, left namibia for spain in 2005
10:09:09 <kimmo> you gotta love those 'SUPER UGLY HACK THIS SHOULD GO AWAY' comments
10:09:16 <kimmo> I can't think of any software that doesn't have those
10:09:35 <wingo-pi> hehe
10:10:39 <wingo-pi> unfortunately i understand that the guile part of gnucash has been bitrotting for a while, perhaps those notes are still in..
10:13:25 <gour> wingo-pi: now you do C in gnucash?
10:14:01 <gour> s/gnucash/guile
10:17:29 <wingo-pi> hm? now i co-maintain guile, which is written half in scheme and half in c
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11:12:56 <gour> wingo-pi: is that C/scheme ratio tend to be constant?
11:13:43 <wingo-pi> gour: no, over time there is more and more scheme
11:13:47 <wingo-pi> and less c.
11:14:33 <gour> ohh, that's nice to hear...hopefully there will be more guile-2.0 users
11:18:40 <warlord> Gee, and in GnuCash it's been the opposite -- less scheme and more C.
11:19:27 <wingo-pi> to each his/her own :)
11:21:21 <warlord> historically C has been significantly easier to debug and much faster in its execution, and there are many more people who know how to code it. Getting compile-time errors when you mess something up is a big-win
11:21:58 <wingo-pi> all good points.
11:22:38 <wingo-pi> guile has gotten better with regards to these though -- you have optional debuggers, always-on backtraces, compile-time warnings, and big speed improvements
11:22:44 <warlord> I lost count of how many times a dev has made a change to the code, checked it in, and then we hear from a user that is crashes in the scheme code in some place.. All due to, e.g. an added or removed or changed parameter
11:23:20 <warlord> compile-time warnings would be a big win (assuming, of course, scheme had typing)
11:23:29 <wingo-pi> scheme can warn at compile time
11:23:40 <wingo-pi> we have a compiler now, you know :)
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11:24:37 <wingo-pi> it's proved quite useful -- unexpected numbers of arguments, and unbound variables, mostly
11:24:51 <wingo-pi> still, the possibilities are more limited compared to a typed language
11:24:53 <warlord> Yes, that's certainly useful!
11:25:19 * warlord first learned scheme in 6.001/SICP in 1989-90
11:25:32 <wingo-pi> neat :)
11:26:46 <warlord> Still, I'm glad to hear about the improvements!
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11:27:46 <gjanssens> Hi all
11:28:01 <gjanssens> I have a question about the default currency for a gnucash book
11:28:12 <gjanssens> is this explicitly stored somewhere ?
11:28:32 <gjanssens> I mean the currency you enter when creating a new book.
11:29:22 <gjanssens> At first sight, it's just used to create the initial accounts but there's no proper function to query for it after the druid has finished.
11:35:56 <warlord> I do not believe that it is properly stored anywhere
11:39:09 <gour> warlord: we hope gnucash won't abandon guile :-)
11:39:47 <gjanssens> Warlord: Rats, that makes fixing bug #613502 more complicated than I hoped
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11:41:45 <gjanssens> A related question: the root account doesn't have a commodity set. Would older versions of GnuCash have trouble with the data files if the rood account did have a commodity set ?
11:42:05 <gjanssens> It would be a good place to store the default currency...
11:42:18 <warlord> possibly. possibly not. really older versions dont even use root accounts. (those were introduced in 2.2)
11:42:29 <warlord> gour: I doubt guile will go away
11:42:52 <gour> warlord: good. we want to capitalize our learning ;)
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11:43:46 * warlord needs to disappear for a bit. I'll be back shortly.
11:44:25 <gjanssens> Ok, I'll look into the root account and default currency thing and see if it would create issues.
11:45:13 <gjanssens> Obviously, the interface function to get a default currency should be aware that older data files may not have a root account.
11:46:01 <gjanssens> And fall back nicely if it can't get a default currency from there.
12:03:54 <warlord> gjanssens: part of the update is to create a root account, so I think it's safe to assume that every file has a root account (although it may be created on the fly)
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12:22:25 <jonez> greetings
12:23:08 <jonez> I've got myself into a bit of a bind importing bank records into gnucash-- each file is 1 month, and in gnucash I now have one account per month.
12:23:41 <jonez> is there a straight-forward way to merge accounts?
12:26:09 <jonez> I think I found an answer in the faq.
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12:29:41 <gjanssens> warlord: good to know. Of course this doesn't mean I can also assume the root account always has a default commodity set, so I'll still have to create a fallback
12:30:05 <warlord> gjanssens: yep.
12:30:15 <warlord> jonez: which importer are you using?
12:30:25 <jonez> qif
12:30:52 <jonez> what I am doing is reparenting each of the imported qif files, then deleting the subaccount and telling it to move all the transactions.
12:31:02 <warlord> Note that qif takes the filename as the "Qif Account" you are importing. You need to make sure you map that account to the proper GnuCash Account.
12:31:19 <warlord> Yeah, that will work for the already-imported data
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13:07:36 <jonez> is there a way I can set the parent of an account before importing it?
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13:10:58 <warlord> jonez: are you creating the account during the import?
13:11:11 <jonez> not on purpose :)
13:11:43 <jonez> I'm ok with merging... what I need is a way to transfer to different accounts with a python script.
13:12:08 <warlord> During the import just make sure you map the qif account to the correct gnucash account.
13:12:09 <jonez> for example, the description for my rent check always starts with a string.. I have to manually transfer each transaction to the right place.
13:12:22 <jonez> ok.. I might have missed that when I was doing it.
13:13:36 <warlord> the QIF importer only matches on full strings. Not substrings.
13:14:11 <jonez> what about after import?
13:14:27 <jonez> could I use the python binding and do it?
13:15:30 <warlord> to do what? modify the imported transactions?
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13:18:14 <jonez> warlord, ya
13:18:35 <jonez> I want to make sure all the transactions that have a certain substring are assigned to, for example, "expenses:rent"
13:18:46 <warlord> Um, I would expect that it would let you, assuming you can get te python bindings to work at all
13:18:48 <jonez> this way I do not have to spend several hours doing it manually :)
13:19:07 <warlord> Yeah, the QIF importer doesn't map on substrings. (The OFX importer can)
13:19:20 <jonez> I don't think the bank can do OFX
13:24:49 <warlord> ok
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14:01:11 <jonez> is there a way, perhaps with scm, to modify existing transactions based on a substring?
14:01:31 <jonez> for example, I need every transaction that says "PAYPAL INST XFER" to be assigned to a certain account.
14:04:18 <warlord> jonez: do the transaction ONLY say "PAYPAL INST XFER"? Or is there more? Why don't you pre-process the transactions and then you can map them during the import?
14:04:32 <warlord> During import just map "PAYPAL INST XFER" to the proper account
14:04:50 <jonez> hmm.. clearly my brain is drained and I missed that :)
14:05:05 <jonez> my trouble is that I already have the transactions imported to gnucash
14:07:39 <warlord> Start over
14:07:46 <warlord> it'll be faster.
14:07:55 <warlord> and this time, during the import, map them properly.
14:08:02 <warlord> seriously. it'll be faster than trying to fix it.
14:08:25 <jonez> ok
14:08:41 <jonez> ty for your help
14:18:58 <warlord> you're welcome.
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14:51:42 <mint> hey
14:52:06 <mint> im trying to get gnucash to connect to bank of america can anyone help me?
14:55:35 <warlord> have you looked at the wiki? or the gnucash-user archives?
15:07:18 <mint> yes, aparently i need to active the service with my bank, thanks for your response though
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18:41:09 <roe_> can I define if an income statement is done on a cash or accrual basis?
18:41:32 <warlord> No
18:41:52 <roe_> ok, how is the income statement run then?
18:42:41 <JesseW> roe_: accrual, I think.
18:42:41 <gncbot> JesseW: Sent 3 days, 8 hours, and 43 minutes ago: <warlord> um, go through the open bugs and try to triage/reproduce them? Go through all the features in the UI and try to use them and report bugs when they don't work?
18:42:43 <warlord> It's run based on the transactions in your account, using those dates. It doesn't understand the concept of accrual accounting.
18:42:55 <warlord> or rather, doesn't understand how to convert accrual into cash.
18:43:06 <roe_> right, but how are open invoices handled?
18:43:32 <warlord> roe_: define "open"? Do you mean un-posted, or un-paid?
18:43:44 <roe_> posted but un-paid
18:43:48 <warlord> The I.S. includes the income based on the invoice post date.
18:44:14 <warlord> To convert to cash-basis you need to manually (read: outside the report) remove any outstanding (unpaid) invoices.
18:44:46 <roe_> garg, ok thanks for the clarification
18:45:02 <warlord> basically, when you use the biz features, you're doing accrual-based accounting.
18:45:12 <warlord> ... and the reports will report on it as if it's accrual-based.
18:45:22 <roe_> right, but as far as the IRS is concerned they care about cash, thus so do my accountants
18:45:30 <warlord> Yes.
18:45:51 <warlord> I just send the Income Statement, Balance Sheet, and Transaction Report to my accountant and they handle it all
18:45:52 <roe_> is there a way of giving to my accountants a report similar to an I.S. that is cash centric?
18:46:01 <warlord> No
18:46:04 <warlord> There is no such report
18:46:09 <roe_> ok, thanks for the help
18:46:17 <warlord> See bug #...
18:46:47 <warlord> https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=95700
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19:17:57 <roe_> just checked the website, I see you guys made another release last week (2.3.11) congrats. I can't wait for 2.4, it is gonna be very nice
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19:33:05 <bgeron> hi
19:34:07 <bgeron> I see on the home page that 2.3.11 is released, but the downloads page says 2.3.10 is the latest unstable version
19:35:21 <bgeron> just a nitpick :)
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23:36:17 <Carlyyy> http://i909.photobucket.ath.cx/albums/ac255/blonde241/DSC93258432.jpg?t=1269401343 do my breasts look to big?
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