2008-05-02 GnuCash IRC logs

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06:18:04 <Jannick> Hi, the code in http://pastebin.ca/1004798 crashes at line 60. Error message: Can't call method "value" on an undefined value at Gnucash/Business/Invoice.pm l
06:18:05 <Jannick> ine 60.
06:18:07 <Jannick> For the sake of completeness I note that I got it from http://stefans.datenbruch.de/gnucash/gc2latex.shtml.
06:18:08 <Jannick> Do you have any suggestions to repair this? My scheme knowledge is very poor.
06:19:13 <Jannick> I am not sure in which format the invoice number is needed. Like 000014 or like '000014' ... ???
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07:25:05 <Jannick> @tell warlord: In case you have an idea on this, could you please drop me an email? Thanks. Best wishes, J.
07:25:05 <gncbot> Jannick: The operation succeeded.
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08:23:23 <warlord> .
08:23:42 <warlord> @tell Jannick That is perl, not scheme.
08:23:42 <gncbot> warlord: The operation succeeded.
08:24:27 <Jannick> Good morning warlord. :-)
08:24:27 <gncbot> Jannick: Sent just now: <warlord> That is perl, not scheme.
08:24:38 <warlord> Ni
08:24:39 <warlord> Hi
08:25:45 <Jannick> Ok, so I don't know anything of two things at least: Perl *and* scheme - and I cannot separate them from each other. :-(
08:26:29 <Jannick> Do you think that it has anything to do with the XML-structure of the GC-file?
08:26:32 <warlord> I have no idea about that code.
08:27:00 <Jannick> Ok, I understand.
08:27:33 <Jannick> Is there a description of the XML-tree of GC files somewhere?
08:27:35 <warlord> I have no idea what the underlying code does, so.
08:28:46 <Jannick> Oh, this I can tell you: It is part of an interface package GC/LaTeX reading out data of a GC-invoice.
08:30:03 <Jannick> After all some tex-file is populated with the invoice information. Applying LaTeX gives you a nice invoice in pdf-format.
08:30:31 <warlord> As opposed to the Fancy Invoice in GnuCash?
08:33:26 <aum> hi - can anyone help me with QIF and OFX imports?
08:35:07 <Jannick> Well, looks ok, but not in pdf-Format, date (apparently our favourite ;) ) not well formatted. E.g. due date comes like "M?z , 2008", no jpg for the company and and and ...
08:35:36 <warlord> Jannick: fair enough.
08:35:36 <Jannick> Oh, and the invoices can be printed with a batch job.
08:35:43 <warlord> aum: depends on your question
08:35:59 <warlord> Jannick: I suggest you email the author of that package.
08:36:15 <Jannick> Yes I did already.
08:36:21 <Jannick> No reply.
08:36:29 <Jannick> I will retry.
08:37:14 <aum> my question is - is there any way I can write 'filters' to automate the account matching when importing a bank statement?
08:38:05 <warlord> aum: OFX has bayesian-style matching (but you have to turn it on). So it will learn as you match, so future matches will be better.
08:38:08 <aum> seems that QIF import and OFX import have 2 completely different approaches to account matching
08:38:16 <warlord> QIF also remembers the matches.. but QIF only matches on full strings.
08:38:23 <warlord> yes, they do
08:38:36 <warlord> OFX is the "new way", but QIF hasn't been migrated over to the new UI.
08:38:47 <aum> i wish gnucash had a python API
08:39:11 <warlord> Why?
08:39:17 * aum likes python
08:39:41 <aum> and i could write my own filters to translate my bank statements to transactions on my accounts within gnucash
08:39:44 <warlord> http://wiki.gnucash.org/wiki/FAQ#Q:_Why_don.27t_you_rewrite_GnuCash_in_programming_language_xyz_so_that_I_can_contribute_easily.3F
08:40:08 <aum> hey, i'm not asking that gnucash be written in python
08:40:22 <aum> if there was a C or C++ API, I could do a python wrapper
08:40:31 <warlord> There is a C API
08:40:38 <warlord> We already even use swig
08:40:50 <aum> that takes care of a huge part of the job :)
08:41:14 <aum> can the API be used by an external program and act on a running instance of gnucash? or only a gnucash data file?
08:41:15 <warlord> Well, yes.. and no...
08:41:23 <warlord> No. Yes.
08:41:46 <aum> so there's a 'libgnucash' ?
08:41:47 <warlord> GnuCash only has a scheme interpretter built-in.. So you have write scheme to "extend" gnucash.
08:42:05 <warlord> gnucash has about 15 libraries.
08:42:14 <warlord> (none called "libgnucash")
08:42:29 <aum> all i'd want to do is perform transactions
08:42:56 <aum> eg, debtor payment, tax payment, purchase of consumables, interest earned, bank fees, yada yada
08:43:08 <warlord> well, I presume you'd also want to load a data file, save a data file, yada yada..
08:43:18 <aum> i'd be happy with that
08:43:31 <warlord> You can do all that from scheme. ;)
08:43:40 * aum is not a big scheme fan
08:43:41 <warlord> If you know python you can learn scheme in a day.
08:43:51 * warlord isn't a python fan.
08:43:54 <aum> scheme is a lisp derivative, isn't it?
08:44:21 <jsled> There's even other python bindings; see the -devel mailing list archives.
08:44:45 <aum> jsled - you mean, python bindings to various gnucash libs?
08:45:02 <jsled> From … is it really May already? … March? Or maybe even Feb.
08:45:21 <aum> ?
08:45:36 <warlord> Yes, it's already May.
08:45:43 <jsled> That's when I guess a post was made to gnucash-devel with a patch for python bindings.
08:45:55 <jsled> I don't know if the patch was applied; warlord?
08:46:02 <warlord> it was not.
08:46:15 <warlord> they were going to come back with a more integrated solution.
08:47:41 <aum> has any thought gone into making the gnucash app able to run as a 'server', listening on sockets for client connections/commands?
08:47:50 <jsled> yes.
08:51:48 <warlord> "thought"? yes. plans to actually DO it? no.
08:58:09 <aum> well, thx for the info guys, i'll have a look at the C libs - i can write python wrappers pretty fast, so that might be the best solution
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08:58:34 <warlord> I dont get people like that
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09:03:46 <dutch> Gud ev. Problem: Gnucash remembers only old deleted datafiles and not a new one after reboot.
09:04:24 <warlord> Did you cleanly shutdown gnucash or did you reboot without exiting?
09:05:16 <dutch> no I cleanly shutdown.
09:06:16 <dutch> also doesnt remember preferences of new datafile. Btw the new datafile was imported
09:07:06 <warlord> Did you save the file first?
09:07:55 <dutch> Yah I did, but if I restart after reboot than it comes up with the old datafile names
09:09:16 <warlord> What version of gnucash?
09:09:32 <dutch> version 2.2.4
09:09:37 <warlord> what OS/Distro?
09:09:57 <dutch> ubuntu heron hardy
09:10:43 <warlord> Is the new file listed in the File menu?
09:10:54 <dutch> no
09:11:08 <dutch> I have to find manually
09:11:28 <warlord> File -> Open / Select file / File -> Quit / Restart GnuCash
09:12:49 <dutch> I did. It is ok as long as I dont reboot.
09:13:13 <warlord> What do you mean "dont reboot"?
09:13:36 <dutch> shut down and restart the computer
09:13:52 <warlord> If it's working without a reboot then it sounds like a GConf problem on your system.
09:14:08 <warlord> That's a bigger problem and not just limited to GnuCash..
09:14:17 <warlord> It means your gconf configuration isn't saving state.
09:14:38 <dutch> all other progs gives no probl
09:15:03 <dutch> how to repair the gconf for gnucash?
09:16:45 <warlord> GConf is a Gnome Service.
09:17:07 <warlord> It's outside the scope of gnucash -- we just use it.
09:17:23 <warlord> How are you rebooting?
09:18:27 <dutch> file>quit in gnucash and after that right-up red shutdown button in ubuntu
09:18:44 <warlord> "red shutdown button"?
09:18:53 <warlord> (I dont use ubuntu)
09:19:34 <dutch> yes I shutdown by the software and not cold with button
09:23:08 <warlord> Just making sure.
09:23:13 <warlord> What desktop do you use?
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09:23:58 <warlord> nbinon1: Hey, are you still doing daily win32 builds?
09:24:17 <dutch> a desktop with a amd64 based motherboard of gigabyte
09:25:28 <warlord> sorry, let me rephrase: which DESKTOP SOFTWARE (ENVIRONEMNT) do you use?
09:26:24 <dutch> Ah ok, only ubuntu latest hardy heron lts release.
09:26:41 <dutch> lts=long term support
09:26:51 <warlord> Dude! Are you using KDE? Gnome? Something else?
09:27:05 <dutch> gnome
09:27:56 <warlord> REALLY? And gconf isn't shutting down correctly?
09:28:21 <warlord> Sounds like a "hardy heron" problem. I suggest you file a bug report with Ubuntu that gconf doesn't save data.
09:28:41 <dutch> I have more progs in gconf and those work perfect
09:29:09 <nbinon1> warlord: yes, though the machine seems to offline atm :(
09:29:41 <warlord> dutch: I dont believe you
09:29:49 <warlord> nbinon1: okay
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09:30:36 <warlord> dutch: if you can File -> Open / select file / File -> Quit / Restart GnuCash and it reopens the file.. And then reboot and it fails.. That's a GCONF problem and not a GnUCash problem. GnUCash has no control over GConf's data storage.
09:31:04 <warlord> What happens if you "log out" and then shutdown/reboot from the login screen?
09:31:56 <dutch> I will try, will take a while and come back. thanks so far
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09:43:10 <dutchie> Good ev. I logged out and shut down from login screen. After reboot Gnucash still asks for old data file and doesnt remember the new one. :-(
09:43:45 <warlord> Then you should file a bug report with ubuntu.
09:43:54 <warlord> ... against gconf
09:44:54 <dutchie> If I delete gnucash from /.gonfig/apps will that be rebuild at start up or reinstall??
09:45:57 <warlord> I dont know.
09:46:35 <dutchie> Ok thanks anyway for spending your time and help. I will backup and try.
09:46:35 <warlord> (not sure what /.gonfig is)
09:47:27 <dutchie> typo /.gconfig
09:47:44 <warlord> no idea what that is, either.
09:48:08 <dutchie> ok thnks
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10:22:12 <warlord> Hahahaha!!! Someone reporting an error in QSF Export! Hahahaha
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10:24:04 <Harfang> hi, is there a way in gnucash to create import filters for imported QIF files ? For example I would like gnucash to automatically put "credit card" as type when the line contains the word "VISA" for instance, things like that
10:24:52 <warlord> The QIF importer will map full strings, not substrings.
10:25:48 <Harfang> so we have to type manually all transactions types ? there is no way for gnucash to recon what is a credit card operation and so on?
10:25:57 <warlord> The newer "generic importer" UI can do tokenized mapping
10:26:26 <Harfang> generic importer? What's this?
10:26:41 <warlord> QIF can only map based on the QIF Account, QIF Category, Payee, or Memo.. The Payee/Memo mapping only works on full strings.
10:26:53 <warlord> It's the newer UI used by AqBanking and OFX.
10:27:03 <warlord> QIF hasn't migrated to it, yet
10:27:45 <Harfang> ok. that is because my bank only allows downloading in QIF or CSV
10:28:08 <jsled> Harfang: the short answer is "no".
10:28:10 <jsled> :)
10:28:28 <Harfang> perhaps I should then parse my qif file into a text parser, to have it the way I want before importing it :)
10:29:05 <jsled> So ... you could normalize all the transaction memos that contain "VISA" to be "Visa Credit Card Transaction" or something.
10:29:08 <jsled> s/So/Sure/
10:30:55 <Harfang> jsled, you mean normalizing this with a text parser, but not into gnucash, right?
10:31:03 <warlord> Harfang: I've certainly written perl scripts to massage QIF files prior to import.
10:31:26 <jsled> yeah. Run the QIF through $your-favorite-language, then import the massaged qif output into gnucash.
10:31:46 <Harfang> yes something fine would be a QIF to OFX converter tool, with filters we can setup :)
10:34:21 <warlord> No, that wouldn't be fine.
10:34:25 <warlord> OFX doesn't support Split Txns
10:35:19 <warlord> All you need to do is something like: s/^P.*VISA.*$/PVisa Credit Card Transaction/
10:35:43 <warlord> This will normalize the transaction, and then the QIF importer will remember the mapping.
10:36:00 <warlord> So anytime is sees a payee "Visa Credit Card Transaction" it will know to store it account X
10:37:22 <Harfang> and will it know to put the transaction type "credit card" associated with it?
10:38:57 <warlord> What do you mean "transaction type Credit Card"?
10:39:00 <Harfang> and the QIF format in my bank is weird, the P and M lines are the same, except that the P line is truncated, so usually the P line is useless, I cannot see from where it comes if I do not check the M line
10:39:48 <Harfang> I mean the action, where you put if the transaction is a credit card transaction, a cheque, a debit, and so on...
10:40:36 <Harfang> for example I would like gnucash to automatically put "Cheque" if the P or M line starts with "CHEQUE NUMBER"
10:41:06 <warlord> I dont think that the QIF importer will set the action field at all.
10:41:16 <warlord> (except perhaps in some special cases with investment txns)
10:42:31 <Harfang> I guess I'll have to look on the web the QIF datasheet to see what kind of lines are authorized :)
10:42:36 <warlord> No, I see no calls to xacSplitSetAction anywhere in the importer
10:42:53 <Harfang> too bad gnucash do not have import rules actions we can setup as we want at import time
10:42:55 <warlord> huh?
10:43:07 <warlord> Harfang: send in a patch that does it.
10:43:26 <warlord> "it's too bad people come in here complaining about fetures but don't donate the code to implement them"
10:43:30 <Harfang> I'm not a developper, dunno how to do such a patch :)
10:43:53 <warlord> Well, I want a pony but I dont breed horses.
10:43:58 <warlord> :)
10:45:41 <Harfang> before I used a mac software named iBank and when we import any file we can put import rules. It is especially useful for... errr dunno english name, the one in P line, the payee isnt it? My Bank always put there weird things such as : CREDIT CARD LEROY MERLIN 120554, and then CREDIT CARD LEROY MERLIN 200504, so the softwares believes those are two different payees, so when I do graphs I have two payees for the same shop
10:46:13 <Harfang> so for that I think I'll try to parse the QIF file to put what I want to inside
10:47:19 <warlord> The generic importer will deal with that because it tokenizes the strings.
10:47:37 <Harfang> I'm sure my bank does not put all infos they can into the QIF file, if I remember correctly I saw QIF files with better infos inside
10:47:45 <warlord> So eventually (pretty quickly) it learns that "CREDIT" "CARD" "LEROY" "MERLIN" goes to Expenses:Merlin
10:48:38 <Harfang> the generic importer is the one provided with gnucash by default?
10:49:08 <Harfang> how does it know that ? Because last time we imported a file we put this line to "Expensed:Merlin" ?
10:50:00 <warlord> As I already said, the generic importer is the new UI used by OFX, AqBanking, etc.. So once QIF migrates over it'll get it too.
10:50:08 <warlord> and yes, it knows it because you did it once.
10:50:14 <warlord> it performs bayesian style matching
10:53:58 <Harfang> ok. I guess we do not know where the QIF format will migrate to it :) too bad my bank does not allow OFX importing
10:54:48 <warlord> It'll happen when someone gets the time to do it.
10:56:10 <Harfang> btw I have found a software, MT2OFX, which converts a QIF file to an OFX one, but I have yet to test it
10:56:17 <Harfang> http://www.xs4all.nl/~csmale/mt2ofx/en/
10:57:53 <warlord> Note that OFX doesn't support all the features that QIF does.
11:00:28 <Harfang> sure I know :)
11:00:56 <Harfang> the goal is not to have a full featured ofx file, but an ofx file organized with the infos I need
11:02:07 <Harfang> so thanks for the infos, need to go now, farewell
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11:36:40 <quist> I upgraded my ubuntu desktop to 8.04 last evening from 7.10
11:37:18 <quist> gnucash gave some kind of "crash" icon on the upper right part of the desktop.
11:37:38 <quist> It does start fine.... but strangely and sadly....
11:37:51 <quist> It seems as if almost all of my 2008 data is gone!!!
11:38:03 <quist> I checked one active bank account.
11:38:26 <quist> All the data was there... 2005 2006 2007 and only one transaction from 2008
11:39:02 <quist> I tried re-opening some of the saved files... recent ones, all with the same result
11:41:07 <quist> # dpkg --list | grep gnuca
11:41:08 <quist> ii gnucash 2.2.4-1ubuntu1 A personal finance tracking program
11:41:08 <quist> ii gnucash-common 2.2.4-1ubuntu1 A personal finance tracking program
11:42:03 <jsled> Which register are you opening?
11:42:21 <jsled> What data files are you opening?
11:42:27 <jsled> (like, what are the file names)
11:42:32 <quist> Register ?
11:42:35 <quist> Ah...
11:42:40 <quist> Let me see...
11:43:42 <warlord> quist: did you "save" your data file before upgrading?
11:44:29 <quist> I "save" my data many times per session:
11:44:44 <quist> # ls -ltr *xac | tail -5
11:44:45 <quist> -rw-r--r-- 1 russ russ 425164 2008-04-30 18:18 accts.20050813153810.xac.20080430182906.xac
11:44:45 <quist> -rw-r--r-- 1 russ russ 424950 2008-04-30 18:29 accts.20050813153810.xac.20080430183629.xac
11:44:45 <quist> -rw-r--r-- 1 russ russ 425320 2008-04-30 18:36 accts.20050813153810.xac.20080430184141.xac
11:44:45 <quist> -rw-r--r-- 1 russ russ 424930 2008-04-30 18:41 accts.20050813153810.xac.20080430185344.xac
11:44:46 <quist> -rw-r--r-- 1 russ russ 424930 2008-04-30 18:53 accts.20050813153810.xac
11:45:02 <warlord> ls -l accts
11:45:08 <quist> ah...
11:45:29 <warlord> Er, wait...
11:45:48 <warlord> In 2005 you changed from using "accts" to using "accts.20050813153810.xac"
11:46:01 <quist> # ls -l acc* | tail -10
11:46:02 <quist> -rw-r--r-- 1 russ russ 425320 2008-04-30 18:36 accts.20050813153810.xac.20080430184141.xac
11:46:02 <quist> -rw-r--r-- 1 russ russ 170 2008-04-30 18:53 accts.20050813153810.xac.20080430184142.log
11:46:02 <quist> -rw-r--r-- 1 russ russ 424930 2008-04-30 18:41 accts.20050813153810.xac.20080430185344.xac
11:46:02 <quist> -rw-r--r-- 1 russ russ 192 2008-05-02 07:30 accts.20050813153810.xac.20080430185344.xac.20080502072946.log
11:46:03 <quist> -rw-r--r-- 1 russ russ 192 2008-05-02 07:32 accts.20050813153810.xac.20080430185344.xac.20080502073241.log
11:46:06 <quist> -rw-r--r-- 1 russ russ 192 2008-05-02 07:34 accts.20050813153810.xac.20080430185344.xac.20080502073422.log
11:46:06 <warlord> STOP!
11:46:09 <quist> -rw-r--r-- 1 russ russ 192 2008-05-02 07:35 accts.20050813153810.xac.20080430185344.xac.20080502073536.log
11:46:12 <quist> -rw-r--r-- 1 russ russ 170 2008-04-30 18:53 accts.20050813153810.xac.20080430185345.log
11:46:14 <quist> -rw-r--r-- 1 russ russ 192 2008-05-02 07:28 accts.20050813153810.xac.20080502072808.log
11:46:15 <jsled> Please use pastebin.
11:46:16 <quist> -rw-r--r-- 1 russ russ 214 2008-05-02 07:37 accts.20050813153810.xac.20080502073714.log
11:46:18 <quist> Ok
11:46:26 <warlord> quist: Please use Pastebin for > 1 line.
11:46:39 <quist> Will do... I am new to IRC...
11:46:43 <quist> My apologies
11:46:47 <warlord> (and you still didn't provide the answer to my question)
11:47:16 <quist> The "saving" question?
11:47:35 <warlord> No......
11:47:41 <warlord> <warlord> ls -l accts
11:48:01 <quist> ok...
11:48:25 <quist> # ls -l accts
11:48:26 <quist> ls: cannot access accts: No such file or directory
11:49:11 <warlord> Right....
11:49:13 <warlord> and...
11:49:19 <warlord> ls -l accts.20050813153810.xac
11:49:40 <quist> -rw-r--r-- 1 russ russ 424930 2008-04-30 18:53 accts.20050813153810.xac
11:49:46 <warlord> Heh.
11:50:04 <quist> naming convention mess up on my part?
11:50:24 <warlord> Yep.
11:50:31 <jsled> the filename.{timestamp}.xac are auto-save files.
11:50:31 <warlord> Well, sort of.
11:50:54 <jsled> At some point, you opened accts.20050813153810.xac as you datafile...
11:50:56 <warlord> In August 2005 you "opened" a backup file and then you've been using that as your "main" data file ever since.
11:51:01 <jsled> yup.
11:51:07 <quist> Ah...
11:51:14 <jsled> But that doesn't explain why data appears to be missing.
11:51:22 <quist> What should I do to remedy the situation?
11:51:26 <jsled> Did you fiddle with View > Date Range ?
11:51:49 <quist> Hmmm possibly.. Let me ssh -X into the machine to see..
11:52:14 <quist> Should I simply: mv accts.20050813153810.xac accts ?
11:52:23 <quist> to fix the naming problem?
11:52:37 <warlord> Yes.
11:52:42 <warlord> Or... "cp"
11:52:51 <warlord> then make sure you File -> Open 'accts'
11:52:59 <quist> sure...
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12:00:41 <Ryanag> Hi, I'm new to Gnucash and have a question regarding tracking business expenses (I don't own the business, it's for my expense account at work). Can someone help with this?
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12:02:58 <jsled> bye.
12:08:44 <quist> Well... I've made the changes. And the data still seems missing.
12:09:11 <quist> I can try to move the data to an older version of gnucash to see if it is version related
12:09:39 <jsled> It really shouldn't be.
12:09:51 <warlord> Well, that data file was last updated on April 30th.
12:09:53 <jsled> You could open the datafile in a text/xml editor and see if the dates on the transactions make sense.
12:10:14 <warlord> You could also look in /tmp/gnucash.trace and see if it's outputting any warnings at you
12:10:27 <quist> Ok.. The data files are gzipped?
12:10:55 <jsled> configurably. Try `file $datafile` to see
12:12:06 <quist> <gnc.backend.file> Invalid timestamp in data file.
12:12:12 <warlord> By default, yes.
12:12:23 <warlord> Do you have any SXes?
12:12:35 <quist> In the trace flle?
12:13:22 <warlord> In your data file
12:13:30 <warlord> Did you create any?
12:13:50 <quist> what is an SX ?
12:14:33 <warlord> http://wiki.gnucash.org/wiki/FAQ#Q:_What_is_the_.22SX.22_thing_I_see_on_the_lists_and_IRC_periodically.3F
12:17:02 <quist> Non that I know of...
12:17:27 <quist> There are a few other warnings in the tracefile.
12:18:41 <quist> CRIT <gnc.backend.file> commodity_ref_to_dom_tree: assertion `c' failed
12:19:10 <warlord> Yeah, I've seen that a bit too...
12:19:14 <warlord> Haven't tracked that one down
12:19:46 <quist> Should all the data be owned by "gnucash" user?
12:20:03 <jsled> hmm?
12:20:05 <quist> Or the person who executes gnucash?
12:20:10 <jsled> Gnucash runs as whatever user runs it.
12:22:29 <quist> Well my only course of action is to search for the transactions in the xml file
12:22:41 <quist> and see if indeed they are actually there
12:24:41 <warlord> good idea
12:26:37 <quist> Should I look for the <ts:date> ISO date </ts:date> strings?
12:35:00 <warlord> Sure.
12:35:13 <quist> The 2008 data is there... So I will do some more research
12:35:15 <quist> # zcat accts.20050813153810.xac.20080430181808.xac | grep "<ts:date>" | grep 2008 | wc -l
12:35:16 <quist> 562
12:35:31 <quist> Thanks for all of your help!
12:35:48 <jsled> quist: are you sure you didn't change the View > Date Range options on the register?
12:36:07 <quist> I looked at that. All is well
12:36:24 <quist> Time to research the use of "pastebin" :)
12:40:11 <warlord> http://pastebin.ca/
12:40:22 <quist> Thanks!
12:41:53 <quist> Is there a gnucash "group" that one assigns? pastebin.ca seems generic
12:42:16 <quist> Oh... I understand now..
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12:45:12 <quist> http://pastebin.ca/1005144 :)
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12:45:30 <Meiriona> hi, I have a little issue in OFX import in gnucash, I downloaded the OFX file from my bank, I select import, everything seems fine, I mean I see the correct payee and memo in preview windows, but once the import is completed, the memo field in gnucash is weird
12:46:49 <Meiriona> for example, the memo should be "VIR LOGITEL 14.02 SG 01394", instead it is "OFX ext. info: |Trans type:Electronic payment|Memo:VIR LOGITEL 14.02 SG 01394"
12:52:41 <warlord> Are you looking in the Txn desc? Txn Notes? or Split Memos?
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12:54:15 <warlord> the short answer is that OFX is trying hard not to throw data away.. so it merges it all together for you so you dont lose anything important.
12:54:20 <Meiriona> the notes I think
12:54:25 <warlord> (on the theory that too much data is better than not enough)
12:55:16 <Meiriona> if I look at my ofx file, I have a <MEMO> file, that is what is supposed to be in the notes
12:55:26 <Meiriona> memo field I mean
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12:56:11 <warlord> Sorry, by OFX above i meant "OFX Importer"
12:56:29 <Meiriona> oh
12:56:47 <Meiriona> there is no way to have just the infos I need?
12:57:40 <Meiriona> btw, it seems gnucash does nothing with the <TRNTYPE> field
12:57:55 <warlord> The importer doesn't know exactly what you want. so it keeps everything.
12:58:42 <Meiriona> but isnt ofx a normalized format? so it should what info to put where
12:59:12 <Meiriona> payee in description, memo in notes, trntype in action, and cheque number in "num" ?
12:59:38 <warlord> Hahahahahahahaahahahahahaha
12:59:48 <warlord> You actually believe that?!?
13:00:43 <Meiriona> that is what is done with other bank management software, it recon the values in the ofx file and do the translation for the software fields
13:07:26 <warlord> Not all banks follow the spec.
13:12:32 <Meiriona> ok, so this is the bank fault ^ but isnt it possible to tell gnucash to follow the specs ? or is it possible to modify import script to put ofx infos where I want to ?
13:13:49 <warlord> Sure, hack the C code
13:14:08 <warlord> Anything is possible; it's just a simple matter of programming!
13:15:06 <Meiriona> mmm ok, I believed there was just a script in some kind of scripting language to modify ^^
13:15:45 <warlord> What gave you that idea?
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13:16:38 <jsled> most of the OFX importer is in C, not "script".
13:17:00 <warlord> jsled: is ANY of the OFX impoter in "script"?
13:17:03 <jsled> And by "most", I think I mean "all".
13:17:05 <jsled> heh
13:17:15 <warlord> heh
13:17:19 <Meiriona> btw do you have a link to the OFX protocol ?
13:18:03 <Meiriona> yes so hacking the code means taking the source, modifying, then recompiling. sounds too hard for me
13:18:56 <warlord> www.ofx.org?
13:19:07 <warlord> maybe libofx has a link?
13:25:16 <Meiriona> so I guess I'll have to import transactions, and then use memo field to put the infos in the good fields myself at hand? btw is it easy to move transactions from one account to the other? So I can put import transactions in a temporary account, study then modify them, then move them all in the good account ?
13:28:57 <Meiriona> I have found a way, dunno if there is a better one though, import ofx in a new account, then delete this new account and ask to put the transactions in the good account
13:29:45 <warlord> That's one of many ways.
13:37:52 <Meiriona> one of the possible gnucash upgrade, putting the ofx importer in a script file to allow the community to add their own ^
13:39:24 <warlord> That... would be a DOWNGRADE
13:39:39 <warlord> The QIF importer is currently written in scheme.
13:39:42 <warlord> it's IMPOSSIBLE to debug.
13:39:47 <findlay> heh
13:39:49 <warlord> and almost nobody wants to touch it.
13:39:54 <warlord> No... Written in C is the best way.
13:40:07 <Meiriona> I'm talking about the ofx importer, not the qif one
13:40:15 <warlord> Yes, I know...
13:40:30 <warlord> And i'm using QIF as a counter-example of why that wont happen.
13:40:36 <Meiriona> so, what's the future of transaction importer ? :)
13:41:12 <warlord> Hopefully re-writing QIF in C and then migrating it over to the OFX UI.
13:41:28 <warlord> (although, technically, those are separable and non-ordered)
13:41:35 <findlay> what's so bad about scheme?
13:42:29 <warlord> My biggest beef with scheme is the difficulty in debugging it.
13:42:33 <Meiriona> why is it better to have it in C than script?
13:42:41 <warlord> speed.
13:42:43 <warlord> debugability
13:42:56 <warlord> number of potential developers
13:43:02 <warlord> Do you know scheme?
13:43:06 <findlay> I don't
13:43:08 <Meiriona> if banks do not always use a good ofx format, beeing able to modify it is good so it allows to create separate scripts for banks
13:43:31 <warlord> Then modify the OFX..
13:43:38 <jsled> Meiriona: are you a day-to-day programmer?
13:45:27 <Meiriona> no I'm not
13:45:55 <Meiriona> I'm not a dev at all, but I'm able to modify scripts by looking at examples
13:46:01 * jsled nods
13:47:02 <jsled> Apart from the fact that I think all of gnucash should be in a higher level language ... :) It's unclear that the importer should necessarily be in a scripting language, or if the importer just needs to handle these quirks in a better way.
13:47:29 <warlord> jsled: maybe we should go start a side-project to rewrite gnucash from scratch ;)
13:47:37 <jsled> Segmenting the nature of the import based on the bank or OFX source is probably not the right modularity … but maybe a bank- or source-specific "massaging" phase.
13:47:43 <jsled> warlord: I've been thinking about it.
13:47:44 <Meiriona> or perhaps gnucash could add some kind of options to be able to customize the way it imports ofx
13:48:02 <Meiriona> some tag remapping for example
13:48:39 <jsled> I keep coming back to one of Robert Glass' Facts of Software Engineering: if you need to touch more than 25% of the source, it's better to just start from scratch.
13:48:40 <Meiriona> I used iBank for now on the mac, now I'm trying gnucash and it seems to be a real fine software, I'll use it as I'm on a PC now
13:49:51 <Meiriona> but it seems I have no other way but to modify the imported transactions at hand "after" I imported them in gnucash for now
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13:50:23 <warlord> jsled: Yeah, if I had a man-year I'd just start over.
13:50:55 <warlord> Meiriona: either that or write a script to pre-process the OFX..
13:52:00 <warlord> Although I still dont know why you want gnucash to throw data away.
13:52:06 <warlord> but eh, to each his own.
13:52:39 <Meiriona> even if I preprocess the ofx, as gnucash merge all fields into one single field and put it in notes, and do not handle transaction type or cheque number at all, I'll have to modify this IN gnucash, right?
13:53:01 <warlord> Um, it should definitely handle the check number.
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13:53:07 <warlord> not sure what you mean by "type"
13:53:17 <Meiriona> I don't want it to throw data, I want the transaction type to be in action, for example :)
13:53:44 <Meiriona> the transaction type is : DEBIT, DEP, CREDIT CARD, such things, the things that are in "action" in gnucash
13:54:54 <Meiriona> or CHECK for instance when it is a check
13:55:13 <Meiriona> or a chzeque, dunno th
13:55:20 <Meiriona> or a cheque, dunno the english word
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13:56:15 <findlay> Česky :)
13:58:08 <Meiriona> btw what is the tag in the ofx file for the cheque number? is it checknum? chequenum? just NUM? other tag? thanks
13:58:49 <Meiriona> my ofx file does not handle it, my banque does not handle it, so I will parse the memo to find the cheque number
13:59:16 <warlord> Huh.. As far as I can tell, only the csv and log-replay importers will set the Action.
13:59:30 <warlord> No clue. I'm no OFX guru.
14:00:02 <warlord> I think there are multiple choices.. Check Number or Reference Number
14:00:04 <warlord> REF ?
14:01:44 <Meiriona> I will try thanks
14:02:43 <Meiriona> so it is better to import from csv?
14:03:31 <warlord> Hahahah... Um, no.
14:03:37 <findlay> is there an QIF/OFX spec somewhere?
14:03:42 <warlord> In fact I've had lots of problems with the csv importer
14:03:45 <warlord> findlay: read the logs
14:04:16 <findlay> which logs?
14:04:21 <findlay> the channel?
14:05:13 * findlay finds http://www.ofx.net/
14:05:54 <warlord> see! I knew you could do it.
14:05:59 <findlay> heh
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14:13:18 <messy_2008> Anyone else having trouble getting http://www.gnucash.org/pub/gnucash/sources/stable/gnucash-docs-2.2.0.tar.gz.sig ?
14:14:10 <jsled> `curl --head $url` seems fine. What sort of trouble?
14:17:43 <warlord> Also, why would you want 2.2.0 when 2.2.5 is current?
14:18:28 <jsled> it's the docs file
14:18:45 <warlord> Oh, oops. missed the "docs". Sorry
14:18:50 <warlord> ignore me
14:21:24 <Meiriona> is there a way to move accounts in the list of accounts?
14:22:01 <warlord> Move in what way? You can reparent them through the "edit account" dialog.
14:22:25 <warlord> note that it's a TREE, not a list.
14:23:06 <Meiriona> I know, I mean I want the account X to appear before the account Y for example
14:24:49 <warlord> It's alphabetic.
14:25:07 <warlord> X will be before Y
14:25:16 <warlord> (unless you clicked on a different column header)
14:26:24 <Meiriona> ok
14:27:17 <Meiriona> btw according to OFX ref file we can use REFNUM or CHECKNUM for cheque number. I tried both, but gnucash hangs when I use either one in my ofx file and try to import the file
14:28:06 <warlord> hangs where? gdb attach + backtrace?
14:28:34 <messy_2008> jsled, the trouble is Firefox 2.0.0.14 errors out with tar could not be saved, because the source file could not be read. will try wget/curl instead.
14:29:10 <Meiriona> ok it works, just because this CHECKNUM should be after all other tags in the transaction
14:29:21 <Meiriona> if I put checknum too high, it hangs
14:29:28 <jsled> messy_2008: Oh, nevermind. Sure enough, it's saying it's only 65 bytes long.
14:29:43 <Meiriona> now it works and gnucash handles this fine
14:29:57 <jsled> er. But it's just the .sig. So, 65 bytes might not be wrong.
14:30:15 <jsled> Yeah, gpg seems to think it's a valid signature.
14:30:37 <jsled> messy_2008: If you want the docs *tarball*, remove the ".sig" from the end.
14:31:50 <messy_2008> jsled: ok i used wget instead and the .sig appears to verify now. looks like downloading the .sig with Firefox is not working somehow.
14:34:08 <Meiriona> btw what prevents gnucash to use the TRNTYPE to setup the "action" field with an ofx file? did it cause problems?
14:35:39 <Meiriona> and btw is there any use of setting this field in gnucash or not?
14:36:56 <Meiriona> I know that gnucash recon this tag, as it changes TRNTYPE to "Trans type" when putting it in notes
14:38:25 <messy_2008> on a related note, are gpg .sig files for 2.2.5 tarballs not available or are they just stored in a new place since 2.2.0?
14:39:29 <warlord> Meiriona: I have no idea. You'd have to ask the author of the ofx importer, but benoit hasn't been here in a while.
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14:50:44 <Meiriona> benoit? is he french? sounds like a french first name
14:51:18 <warlord> french canadian
14:51:35 <Meiriona> quebec then
14:51:47 <Meiriona> is there a way to reach him by mail ? ^^
14:52:15 <warlord> I dont know. I haven't tried.
14:57:15 <Meiriona> seems there is no "staff" page on the website ;)
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14:59:17 <warlord> of course not. gnucash is purely volunteer.
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15:14:52 <findlay> must not be 'enterprise' then :)
15:15:33 <warlord> No, it's not.
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15:15:53 <warlord> That's why it's a "Quicken/Quickbooks"-like program.. Not SAP or Peachtree.
15:16:30 <findlay> quickbooks is a little to enterprise for me :/
15:16:37 * findlay has to deal with it at work
15:16:40 <warlord> hahaha
15:16:47 <warlord> anyways, gotta run. TTYL
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15:23:52 <Meiriona> imagine using SAP to manage personal accounts lol :)
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18:51:02 <JoeyJoeJo> how do I make custom reports?
18:59:57 <jsled> JoeyJoeJo: http://wiki.gnucash.org/wiki/Custom_Reports
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19:37:38 <JoeyJoeJo> is there an easy way to find out how much income I had in a certain month?
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20:29:56 <andi5> Jannick: did you file a bug about the reconciliation window?
20:30:26 <Jannick> Hi no I did not.
20:30:41 <Jannick> If you want me, no problem.
20:31:12 <andi5> hiho :-) ... or just give me a link to a good description of the problem... i tend to get tired pretty fast by reading mail threads :-)
20:31:14 <Jannick> Did you read the email in the listmailing to get that fixed?
20:32:20 <Jannick> It works at my WinXP machine.
20:32:29 <Jannick> and on Win Vista as well.
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20:32:48 <Jannick> ... getting you the link in a minute.
20:32:52 <andi5> ot: does gnucash look reasonable on windows xp?
20:33:00 <andi5> i mean vista, i am sorry
20:33:33 <andi5> thanks
20:35:27 <Jannick> ... here we go: http://lists.gnucash.org/pipermail/gnucash-user/2008-May/025060.html
20:36:10 <andi5> oh, and another question, if you are interested :) .... regarding http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=520570 , does ftp://ftp.gnome.org/pub/GNOME/binaries/win32/gtk+/2.12/gtk+-dev-2.12.9.zip fix the gtk+ bug again? (it was introduced by 2.12.7, i think)
20:36:23 <Jannick> If you think that a bug report is to be filed I can do that tomorrow.
20:36:54 <andi5> oh, i was not talking about that bug, btw :)
20:37:51 <Jannick> Ouups you are right there are two thing I have risen today. :-)
20:38:38 <Jannick> The issue of the date drop down window can be fixed by the work around.
20:38:51 <Jannick> This is the link I sent - and so did you.
20:38:55 <Jannick> :-)
20:39:13 <andi5> yep :) ... somehow i forgot about it for 2.2.5, so it is retargetted now
20:39:42 <Jannick> does that mean that it got some higher priority now?
20:39:57 <andi5> well, it will be fixed or worked-around in 2.2.6, definitely
20:40:09 <andi5> but that does not mean that i will reboot now (i do not like rebooting)
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20:40:55 <Jannick> it was weird that the drop down window bug didnt popped in every dialogue.
20:41:25 <Jannick> I haven't checked yet whether the work around is ok in other dialogues.
20:41:45 <Jannick> Regarding the other bug: it is not a bug, rather an enhancement
20:42:27 <andi5> yes, i did not really understand that as well... but all those widgets are packed up a little different each time
20:43:16 <Jannick> ok here it comes: I try my very best. :-)
20:43:21 <andi5> ah, ok... i was just reading "reconciliation window" and "liability account", so i somehow thought i trashed that case with a recent change
20:43:47 <Jannick> nonono!
20:43:54 <andi5> that is not enough, you know that ;-)
20:44:10 <Jannick> everything is just fine - but: ...
20:44:19 <andi5> BUT??? ;-)
20:46:37 <Jannick> The default value of the balancing amount in the reconciliation window is the total value (German: "Gesamt").
20:47:25 <Jannick> If it is replaced by the actual (?) value (German "Aktuell"), then everything is just fine:
20:48:41 <andi5> hm? the only difference between "gesamt" and "aktuell" seems to be whether balances of subaccounts are included in the balance... and that is what the checkbox on the initial reconciliation information dialog is for...
20:48:52 <Jannick> If there are no (!) reconciled transactions with transaction date after the reconciliation date, then it the change of the default values should not produce any differences
20:49:17 <andi5> or is it too late for me?
20:49:26 <Jannick> if there are such transactions then they are taking into account.
20:49:30 <Jannick> no problem
20:49:38 <andi5> let me reread :)
20:49:49 <Jannick> do you think that it is worth filing a bug?
20:51:53 <Jannick> last phrase one more time: If there are reconciled transactions with transaction date after (!) reconciliation date, then these are taken into the balancing amount. This means that the reconciliation difference can never be 0.
20:52:04 <andi5> with "Gesamt", did you mean the "Saldo"?
20:52:15 <andi5> let me check
20:52:41 <Jannick> "Gesamt" as "Gesamt" in the window "Konten" - top row
20:53:11 <andi5> but that includes subaccounts, right
20:53:43 <Jannick> dont know
20:58:34 <andi5> ok, i see
20:58:45 <andi5> Jannick: do you build from sources already?
20:59:25 <Jannick> nonono - just a real newbie ;)
20:59:52 <Jannick> What I can is replacing files. Nothing more I suspect.
20:59:56 <andi5> but at least one who can come up with sensible gdb output :)
21:00:11 <Jannick> :-) :-)
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21:00:30 <Ryanag> anybody there?
21:00:36 <andi5> nope
21:01:06 <Ryanag> Ok, I logged on earlier, but IT closed my IRC access down.
21:01:22 <Ryanag> My question was regarding expense accounts (for work) and how to properly account for them in gnucash.
21:01:22 <Jannick> andi5: Do you need some more information on this?
21:01:38 <andi5> Ryanag: meaning you are fighting business questions?
21:01:47 <andi5> i cannot help you there, that is for sure :(
21:01:55 <Ryanag> it's not really for a business, it's just for my personal expense account
21:02:15 <andi5> then go on :)
21:02:21 <Ryanag> basically, I use my personal credit card to buy something and then need to track it as a reimbursible expense
21:02:30 <Ryanag> I know how to do it, but I want to get more detail out of the process.
21:02:37 <andi5> Jannick: hm... i guess no... if i have further questions, i will ask them on the ml
21:02:46 <Ryanag> Basically, say I spend $5 on a latte at Starbucks using my credit card.
21:03:07 <Ryanag> Let's say I want to track everything I spend at Starbucks, so I created an expense account for Starbucks.
21:03:12 <Jannick> Sounds good.
21:03:18 <cortana> Ryanag: i'd use an asset account for that
21:03:39 <andi5> cortana: starbucks is an asset for you? ;-)
21:03:39 <Ryanag> But I also want that expense to appear under an asset account for money that the company I work for owes me
21:03:47 <Ryanag> no, it's an expense
21:03:47 <cortana> when you spend $5, you are really transferring $5 from money in wallet -> money owed by your company
21:04:17 <Ryanag> so there is no way I can account for the money I spent at the merchant as well using an account for the merchant?
21:04:42 <Ryanag> I'm aware that I can transfer it directly to an asset account for money my company owes me.
21:05:04 <Ryanag> I just wanted to be able to drill down to see how many business expenses are spent in various areas.
21:05:32 <andi5> can you use informative subaccounts? ... (not an accountant, obviously)
21:06:05 <cortana> indeed... 'receivables:mycompany:client lunches' or similar
21:07:21 <Ryanag> I can do that, but then I would have more than one account per merchant, and it does not seem to match the actual flow of money. For instance, if I buy the latte, the credit card company pays the merchant against my transaction. I want to be able to look at one account for a particular payee and see all expenditures against that account.
21:07:32 <Ryanag> It matches the system we have at work (Lawson, a Unix ERP system).
21:08:07 <Ryanag> So I would be able to pull up Starbucks and see all Personal and reimbursible expenses.
21:08:48 <Ryanag> I'm not sure if this is possible in gnucash, or if this even makes sense, but wanted to see if there was a more detailed process. It's almost as if I'm asking for one transaction to affect more than one account.
21:08:58 <Ryanag> ...but without a split
21:09:01 <cortana> yeah, i can't quite imagine how to do it
21:09:05 <cortana> might be one for the mailing list!
21:09:36 <andi5> warlord will know
21:09:56 <andi5> our answering machine
21:10:44 <Ryanag> It's kind of like tagging versus filing stuff into folders. I want the transaction to be tracked through Liabilities:Credit_Card, Expenses:Starbucks (for example), and also in Assets:Money_Owed_to_Me
21:11:23 <andi5> Ryanag: do searches work for you?
21:11:38 <Ryanag> of course, it's not for lattes, but say that I purchase a lot of industrial equipment in the field for projects and want to be able to see what I spent at a particular supplier, such as Grainger
21:11:51 <Ryanag> yes, that works as well
21:12:14 <Ryanag> but, it's just not as nice as being able to go directly to a vendor/merchant account and seeing all transactions against it (personal and business)
21:12:41 <andi5> sure... but honestly, would not that confuse the user even more?
21:13:03 <Ryanag> I suppose it could. It's how we do it at work, more or less, in our ERP system.
21:13:38 <Ryanag> I can pull up a vendor's account and see all projects accounts that have transacted against it.
21:14:30 <Ryanag> I just switched to Gnucash by the way, loving it.
21:14:32 <Jannick> ryanag: Charge the latte on an employee's bill, then pay it with a credit card charging the amount on a receivable account of your company.
21:15:11 <Ryanag> Jannick, I think that makes sense (still thinking).
21:15:19 <Jannick> when the credit card bill is paid, this goes against your personal bank account
21:15:56 <Jannick> when the company reimburses you, then this is simply a transfer receivable -> bank.
21:16:49 <Ryanag> okay, so what type of account are you talking about for my employer (it's for the company I work for, which I do not own or run)?
21:17:04 <Ryanag> (I apologize that I'm not an accounting expert...I'm a software engineer)
21:18:39 <Jannick> ahhh. Who pays for your credit card? Your company or is it you?
21:19:14 <Jannick> I thought that you pay your credit card bill.
21:20:55 <Jannick> ryanag: You were talking of the money your company owes you, so it is YOUR credit card. Is that right?
21:22:19 <Jannick> I think the transactions should read like this
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21:23:06 <Jannick> expense/bill/credit card/receivable against company/personal bank account.
21:24:31 <Jannick> ryanag: does it make sense?
21:27:04 <andi5> Jannick: does it make sense to show splits happening after the reconciliation date in the recnwindow at all?
21:27:46 <andi5> i think about hiding them and not including the reconciled one in the reconciled balance
21:28:09 <Jannick> good point. :-) Do you mean by split transaction?
21:28:41 <Jannick> YEAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAH! Good idea!
21:29:09 <andi5> ahm... "split transaction" is just a way to show the real identity of simple transactions, namely the two splits involved :)
21:29:30 <Jannick> Ok. I see.
21:29:38 <Jannick> So when can that happen:
21:30:44 <Jannick> E.g. the date of a transaction you have imported from your bank account (with the online banking module) has value date AFTER the transaction date.
21:31:12 <andi5> after the transaction date of _what_?
21:31:30 <Ryanag> Jannick, sorry, I do pay my credit card bill :)
21:31:36 <andi5> ah, value date
21:31:54 <Jannick> Yep . Wertstellung in German.
21:32:42 <Ryanag> okay, let's say I'm in Toronto on business, just like last week.
21:33:04 <Ryanag> I'm on a job site and use my personal Visa card to pay for a transmitter, $1250.00
21:33:10 <Ryanag> I purchase it from a vendor, Rosemount
21:33:11 <Jannick> If you get a big amount the bank likes to delay assigning the value date. They make a lot of money with that. ;)
21:33:18 <Ryanag> yes
21:34:12 <Ryanag> so, I do a transfer: Expenses:Vendors:Rosemount $1250.00 from Liabilities:Credit Card
21:34:16 <andi5> hm... as far as i understand, you are not supposed to differ between "value date" and "transaction date" as there is only one "posted date", but please prove me wrong
21:34:26 <Ryanag> after that, I'm not sure what to do to indicate that my company actually owes me this money
21:36:13 <Jannick> andi5: there is a difference. Just try how you can sort the transactions in the "Journal" which I would translate general ledger.
21:37:15 <Jannick> I got a transaction from my personal bank account the other day with value date NEXT week.
21:39:39 <Jannick> 2nd example: This refers to a transfer of liabilities. Say you know today that in 7 days some amount becomes due. Then I book that today with transaction date in 7 days. This should be reconciled today for me since reconciliation closing bookings after several checks.
21:40:21 <Jannick> And I do prefer handling a transaction just once, not twice - for the reasons of streamlining processes.
21:43:45 <Jannick> ryanag: Does the chain help you? expense/bill/credit card/receivable against company/personal bank account.
21:44:07 <andi5> excuse me, i am a bit confused.... your valuta date is the posted date of the txn then, right? ... and the reconciled-date (which you can sort by in registers, as it seems) is the the same as the date entered is the same as the statement date? ... please correct me :)
21:46:28 <Jannick> andi5: dont think so: valuta is transaction date. entry date is import date. reconciled date is different.
21:46:56 <Jannick> I think it is set by exactly the date you have chosen in the recon dialogue.
21:47:10 <Jannick> makes 3 dates - at least ;)
21:47:27 <andi5> ah, ok... that (recon-date) makes sense
21:48:24 <andi5> what still puzzles me is that you started the discussion by comparing "value date" and "transaction date", so they cannot be the same now, somehow :)
21:49:14 <Jannick> andi5: did I? :-( rückruder
21:49:24 <andi5> 03:30.45
21:50:34 <Jannick> Got me
21:50:56 <Ryanag> Jannick, I am afraid I am still confused.
21:51:04 <andi5> lol, everybody is confused :)
21:51:15 <Ryanag> is that expenses:bill:credit card:receivable??
21:51:59 <Jannick> That should read: The import date is different to the transaction date (=value date). Sounds ok doesnt it?
21:52:15 <Jannick> ryanag: Sorry for the confusion
21:52:22 <Ryanag> I think you do understand what I'm trying to do though: The goal is to use accounts to identify a credit card purchase to a particular payee as a business expense.
21:52:46 <Jannick> Ryanag: Right.
21:52:49 <Ryanag> I would like the payee to have an account in the traditional sense through which all payee transactions flow.
21:53:00 <Ryanag> but then it's like I need metadata on top of that
21:53:16 <Jannick> Hmm, I dont think so.
21:53:55 <Ryanag> So I buy a latte and transfer from Liabilities:Credit Card to Expenses:Vendors:Starbucks
21:54:18 <Ryanag> that latte could be a Siemens variable frequency drive in my application...
21:54:26 <Ryanag> but let's say it's a latte
21:54:41 <Jannick> ryanag: Lets come back to the crytic monster "expense/bill/credit card/receivable against company/personal bank account"
21:54:45 <Ryanag> now how do I make that show up as something the company I work for owes me?
21:54:51 <Ryanag> ok
21:55:03 <andi5> Jannick: ok, but what is the problem then? do you want include those splits dated later than your reconciliation date in the reconciliation in this case or not?
21:55:10 <andi5> +to
21:55:38 <Jannick> andi5: No I dont. They should be excluded.
21:55:51 <Ryanag> Jannick: I simply don't know what you mean by "epxense/bill/credit card/receivable"
21:55:56 <andi5> great, so i assume we are both on the same track :)
21:56:01 <Ryanag> can you break it down? (I know this is painful)
21:56:04 <Jannick> ryanag: coming now.
21:57:05 <Jannick> First you charge a bill against the expense. Then the expense it charged against your CC.
21:57:28 <Jannick> Forget that. New.
21:57:58 <Jannick> First you charge the expense on the bill in GnuCash.
21:58:53 <Ryanag> okay, so to Expenses:Starbucks?
21:58:56 <Ryanag> using the example?
21:59:12 <Ryanag> or, Expenses:[insert Vendor account here]?
21:59:13 <Jannick> ok
21:59:46 <Jannick> Expenses <-> employee account
21:59:50 <Jannick> ok?
22:00:17 <Ryanag> I think I am with you.
22:00:24 <Ryanag> the employee account is my account, yes?
22:00:28 <Ryanag> and it is an asset?
22:01:46 <Jannick> yep
22:01:52 <Jannick> an asset
22:02:09 <Ryanag> okay
22:02:43 <Ryanag> I am with you there. So how do I denote that I personally paid for this transaction with my credit card?
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22:04:56 <Jannick> Sorry let#s drop the vendor bill - for the moment. Sorry its 4h in the morning at my place
22:05:14 <Jannick> So expenses <-> credit card
22:05:18 <Ryanag> don't worry about me, go to bed and then I'll hit you up tomorrow.
22:05:30 <Ryanag> Where are you from?
22:05:37 <Jannick> germany
22:05:46 <Ryanag> oh yes, it would be about 4:05 there
22:05:54 <Ryanag> I did two jobs in Germany and lived there for a while
22:06:08 <Jannick> sounds good
22:06:31 <Jannick> what you can do is writing an email to the mailing list
22:06:48 <Jannick> are you already registered?
22:07:04 <Ryanag> no, but I can do that.
22:07:12 <Jannick> then i can reply via email.
22:07:26 <Ryanag> Okay, that works. Thanks for the help so far.
22:07:29 <Jannick> i think this might be better.
22:08:29 <Jannick> ... and interesting for others as well :-)
22:08:33 <Jannick> https://lists.gnucash.org/mailman/listinfo/gnucash-user
22:08:54 <Jannick> i really need to go to bed now. Till tomorrow.
22:09:00 <Jannick> Good night.
22:09:04 <Ryanag> thanks' night
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22:09:05 <andi5> gute n8
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