2008-03-04 GnuCash IRC logs
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01:07:49 <erpo> warlord-afk: Re:"just as good" - I really like Gnucash's "everything is a transaction" attitude. If I record a credit my payroll bank account and debit my payroll expense account with an employee as the payee, it's totally clear what I'm doing and Gnucash accepts it. If I try to do the same thing in quickbooks, it warns me that I can't just record payroll as a transaction. I have to use its payroll interface, or it will record the transaction
01:07:49 <erpo> as a "non-payroll" transaction. If I do things the straightforward way in Gnucash and then import the data via QIF into quickbooks, will quickbooks classify those payroll transactions as non-payroll transactions?
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02:55:04 <erpo> warlord-afk: I need to turn off my PC and get some sleep. If you respond to my question when I'm not here, I"ll check the channel log for your answer. Thanks for your help. :)
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06:40:01 <scot1> Hello. this is my first use of IRC so I hope you will forgive me if I get anything wrong. I have a question about entering expenses.
06:54:38 <cortilap> ok so far!
06:55:15 <cortilap> people tend to 'idle' a lot on IRC, so the people in the user list are not all actually watching the channel all the time. it is best to ask the question immediatly and wait for a response
07:03:03 <scot1> ok, thanks for that. Question to follow.
07:05:24 <scot1> When I enter an expense, the transfer account records a negative number. I can understand that I am essentially moving value from one account to another. But if the transfer account is a liability -- for example a debt by the enterprise to partners -- should not the liability be increased rather than reduced to a larger negative number?
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07:43:50 <warlord> @tell erpo I have no idea if QB will do the right thing with that or not.
07:43:50 <gncbot> warlord: The operation succeeded.
07:44:30 <warlord> scot1: depends on your configuration. You can change your preferences for that.
07:55:03 <scot1> Thanks, warlord, I'll sort out how to use the preferences.
07:55:47 <warlord> Well, by default Credit accounts should be "negative", which means that a CC/Liability, etc accounts show you positive when you have a balance.
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08:08:19 <scot1> Actually, I think I had a conceptual problem. I have now set expenses against the cash account and then increased th cash account and owners' equity by the amount spent. I think this is the right accounting procedure. gnucash just seems to make sure I do it right. An excellent design feature. :-)
08:10:14 <warlord> true, gnucash DOES make sure your credits == debits in each transaction
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10:42:41 <Pupeno> Do you record rent as liability?
10:42:48 <Pupeno> A scheduled liabiliy?
10:43:02 <warlord> Rent you pay is an expense.
10:44:01 <Pupeno> warlord: Yes, but I'd like it to be substracted from the total before I pay it, because I'll have to pay it no matter what.
10:44:34 <warlord> What do you mean, "subtracted from the total before you pay it"?
10:50:24 <jsled> You want to have some sort of "forecasted liability" for forward-looking rent ?
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10:57:02 <Simon> I've tried to implement the feature in bug #106401... aside from some combinations being possible that don't make sense (because I haven't looked at how to hide the extra combo boxes for them), and some awful code in recurrenceNextInstance to stop it trying to go backwards, it seems to work ok: http://redrum.lp0.eu/tmp/gnucash-2.2.3_bug-106401.patch
10:57:53 <Pupeno> jsled: yes, the same way as for the credit card... only one month.
10:58:18 <Simon> (it may make more sense to store the date that was going to be used next before it's changed back/forward, so that that can be compared instead)
10:58:19 <jsled> Pupeno: Okay, now you lost me.
10:59:17 <Pupeno> ok, nevermind, I'll just play with it.
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11:01:06 <jsled> Simon: It roughly looks good. Can you attach it to the bug so it doesn't get lost?
11:01:12 <jsled> Also, nice! :)
11:05:03 <Simon> done
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16:45:41 <andi5> hi warlord :)
16:45:47 <warlord> hiya
16:46:18 <andi5> regarding AUTHORS, did you mean the linux CREDITS, or is there another file?
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16:54:19 <warlord> oh, probably
16:54:29 <warlord> it's been 14 years since I asked to get added.
16:55:02 <andi5> oh, nice :)
16:56:09 <andi5> there are not many in there
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16:57:15 <warlord> ??
16:57:51 <andi5> i have not counted them, but compared to the number of people working on the source code, this seems like a rather small subset... but i may be wrong :)
16:58:06 <warlord> hmm
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16:59:26 <andi5> personally, i also do not like that file, not even thinking about showing it in the gui when clicking on "Credits" :)
17:00:08 <andi5> but that is personal taste and is more about the file format and not the philosophy of who should be in there and how to handle
17:01:42 <warlord> Are you talking about AUTHORS or Linux's CREDITS?
17:01:50 <andi5> linux's credits
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17:02:33 <andi5> sure, i did not mean to show the _linux_ credits in gnucash's credits dialog ;-) ... i just something similar with different names ;-)
17:03:24 <warlord> Oh, the Linux Credits file format sucks.
17:03:34 <warlord> But my point is that the means of editing the file is reasonable.
17:03:56 <warlord> I.e., someone sends in a patch, and can (at the same time) patch the Authors file if they so choose.
17:07:04 <andi5> well, from my pov that does not work out... maybe it would be better with a different format (e.g. only name [<mail address>]), but somehow i like to give credits to _all_ who are willing to contribute, to show respect.... i guess i would have never patched me into AUTHORS, unless someone had forced me (rather someone did it for me)
17:07:58 <warlord> WHat if the person doesn't want acknowledgement?
17:09:05 <andi5> if the person really wanted to stay anonymous it would have to write an anonymous mail or write privately to one with commit access... i guess in the latter case he would not be added to AUTHORS anyway
17:09:34 <andi5> and nobody says that "hey, do not put me into AUTHORS" or "please remove me from..." do not have consequences =)
17:14:10 <warlord> I'd rather have an opt-in than an opt-out.
17:16:17 <andi5> do you think that contributors should be asked whether they want to appear in that file, at least?
17:18:24 <warlord> Sure.
17:18:30 <warlord> That's reasonable.
17:19:31 <andi5> ok, that would be a policy i could support
17:20:21 <andi5> regarding a file format, i still suggest the change as written though :)
17:21:42 <warlord> i see nothing wrong with the current format
17:26:55 <andi5> ok, a few points from my pov: (1) contribution areas change but are very rarely updated later on (like: A has made trivial change at first, then refactored module M), (2) email addresses tend to get outdated; (3) who are the main developers? those with svn commit privileges? .... actually there are not a lot more, as it is not a complicated or desastrous file per se ;-)
17:28:21 <warlord> 1) then update the file when that happens.
17:28:29 <andi5> my other point was that at the moment i do not see any user-provided patches to AUTHORS at all, so writing texts is the burden of the committer at the moment :)
17:28:29 <warlord> 2) ditto
17:29:05 <warlord> 3) That's a good question. But yes, devs with commit access should be listed higher in the file.
17:29:24 * warlord shrugs
17:29:36 <andi5> do we track whether oldies still use their mail address once written to AUTHORS? ... i just do not think we have a notification mechanism for (2)
17:29:41 <warlord> ISTR sending in a patch for AUTHORS
17:30:00 <warlord> I dont think it matters much. Fix it when we get a request to fix it.
17:30:07 <warlord> The same would be true of any email address we use.
17:31:55 <andi5> have we ever received such a request? ... i doubt all our texts and mail addresses reflect reality :)
17:33:14 <andi5> if not i ask what is the point of included them at all :)
17:33:17 <warlord> I dunno.
17:33:23 <andi5> s,included,including,
17:35:12 <andi5> i suppose you have got my point, i am not the once to decide anything, i just proposed something :-D
17:36:56 <warlord> I get your point, I just a) dont want the file auto-generated, b) LIKE the extra text descriptions in there, c) dont want to hide email addresses, d) want to choose what email address is in there for me.
17:42:57 <andi5> ok... i guess we totally agree upon a) [i am unsure about adding those names from 2007/08 now].... i understand c) and d), but unfortunately i guess a mix of w/ and w/o mail address will look scary ;-) .... regarding b), do you mean the textual descriptions of the first few names revealing the project's history or all descriptions? i wonder whether the primer could be moved to a file HISTORY or something like that?
17:43:54 <andi5> oh, one minor point is also that in a completely localized version this would be one last(?) point of pure english text ;-)
17:44:11 <warlord> I dont mind that.
17:44:14 <andi5> sure
17:48:03 <warlord> Also, I meant all the descriptions.. In particular the history, but also descriptions of what pieces people have worked on.
17:48:32 <andi5> ok
17:49:02 <andi5> lucky you, inertia is on your side ;-)
17:49:50 <warlord> Inertial is a good tihng. :)
17:50:01 <andi5> you are a real unix hacker, are not you? :)
17:50:25 <andi5> no news...
17:51:09 <warlord> Er, Inertia
17:51:16 <warlord> no news?
17:51:36 <andi5> is good news
17:54:53 <warlord> heh
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18:42:37 <jsled> http://www.buxfer.com/blog/2008/03/02/introducing-the-buxfer-rest-api/
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