2008-02-03 GnuCash IRC logs

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02:27:32 <Jannick> Hi, is it possible to automatically split one-line transactions imported with the on-line banking feature for taxation? Thanks!
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08:08:45 <IanL> good evening all
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08:53:41 <Dave_is_sexy> Hey guys. If I transfer money from one account to another, but it takes a few days to transfer, then I can't just match up the transactions. What's the best way to go about connecting them?
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08:56:17 <warlord> Dave_is_sexy: this should be a FAQ (but it's not). Use the "Cleared" setting of the reconiled flag.
08:56:48 <warlord> Or you can use a suspense account... But then you lose the endpoint mappings
08:58:08 <Dave_is_sexy> warlord: Thanks. I'll take a look :)
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09:19:49 <klee> wie erreicht man die klassische, d.h. T-Konten-Ansicht in GnuCash?
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09:31:11 <warlord> klee: in English, please?
09:39:52 <IanL> klee: Also, please see the german mailing list: https://lists.gnucash.org/mailman/listinfo/gnucash-de
09:40:12 <IanL> if indeed that was german :-/
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10:26:10 <klee> excuse me, I forgot this is an english list. So my question again: Is there a way to put GnuCash into a mode where the relationship between the left and right sides of the accounts are shown?
10:27:54 <klee> ...I should have asked: where the relation between the right and left sides ... is shown.
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10:29:43 <Dave_is_sexy> klee: What do you mean by "left and right" sides? Possibly: View > Transaction Journal ?
10:30:07 <warlord> klee: sure. put the register into Journal mode
10:35:06 <Dave_is_sexy> Warlord: I can't quite get this Reconcile thing to do anything. For now I'm using Assets:Transfers. I click the transaction, then the reconcile button, then set the balance to remain unchanged, then... do something with the double panes?
10:35:29 <warlord> ummm.. you have your monthly statement in hand?
10:35:39 <Dave_is_sexy> ya (kinda)
10:36:02 <warlord> well, then, plug in your ending balance and then check off all the debits and credits
10:36:19 <warlord> this is all in the docs.. you should go read the chapter on reconciliation
10:36:54 <Dave_is_sexy> but the accounts end fine. it's just that i want transfers to link up across accounts when they have different dates
10:38:15 <Dave_is_sexy> I don't mind the Transfers account too much. I don't know if Assets:Transfers is the best place for it though.
10:38:33 <warlord> That's different. And as I said earlier, you use the 'cleared' setting of the reconciled flag. That means in the register just click on the 'R' column to change the 'n' to 'c'
10:39:45 <warlord> But generally you don't want to do what you're trying to do.. Think about it like when you write a check; you write it on Feb 1 but the person doesn't deposit it until Feb 10, and then it doesn't hit your account until Feb 12.
10:39:58 <warlord> You still want the txn dated Feb 1, even though the bank wont see it until Feb 12.
10:40:08 <warlord> Your asset transfers are exactly the same.
10:40:14 <warlord> Date it when you initiate.
10:40:19 <warlord> Then 'clear' it in the other side when it hits.
10:41:04 <Dave_is_sexy> OK. I don't seem to have Ns and Cs though. Just ticks
10:41:21 <warlord> IN THE REGISTER
10:43:28 <Dave_is_sexy> Ah! Got it. C = cleared. N = not cleared :)
10:43:47 <warlord> correct.
10:43:54 <warlord> and 'y' == "yes, reconciled"
10:45:36 <warlord> be back later
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14:19:50 <ron_> can anyone tell me why gnucash re-runs a report everytime I make the slightlest change? This makes updateing reports extremely inconvinient. Every time I cahnge the name of a report, or the size of the display, it has to go back through and crunch all the numbers again. This can be a long time, especially if I'm working with a multi-column report which has multiple reports on it. How do I get gnucash to only update a report when I've compl
14:23:33 <warlord> ron_: you dont
14:23:43 <warlord> at least not without a lot of coding.
14:24:07 <ron_> there;s no "Don't update report yet" checkbox?
14:24:42 <warlord> that checkbox is labeled "Ok" and "Apply"
14:25:28 <ron_> yeah, that's not really what I'm talking about. If I change the name of a report , it doesnt really make sense to recalculate everything when I clikc "OK" or "Apply".
14:25:45 <ron_> ok, well, I guess that's just the way it is.
14:27:15 <ron_> can you point me to some documentation for how the gnucash data file is structured? i;ve been looking at the XML code, but I don't know what all the fields mean. Is there an explanation somwhere? Maybe you can tell me which function in the source code is the function which reads and parses the data file?
14:27:52 <warlord> there is no single file. it's all in src/backend/file and src/business/business-core/file
14:28:09 <warlord> the XML is hand-generated/hand-parsed. there are no normative docs on it.
14:28:17 <ron_> gah
14:28:19 <ron_> ok
14:28:25 <warlord> but there are a handful of perl/python readers out there.
14:28:29 <ron_> thanks
14:28:38 <warlord> the gnucash view is that you shouldn't be touching the XML file.
14:29:27 <ron_> well, yeah, but I'm not really happy with the gnucash UI. So I'm trying to parse my data file into a binary file and roll my own set of reports in my own program.
14:29:38 <ron_> I mean, the gnucash reports UI
14:29:43 <ron_> I like the entry UI
14:37:29 <warlord> Well, then, submit a patch to fix the ui ;)
14:50:11 <ron_> I remember older versions of gnucash allowed you to click on a report (like a slice of a piegraph) and it would open a similar report that zoomed in on that section of the report. Does that functionality still exist? I can't seem to get it to work...
14:50:20 <jsled> ron_: yeah, that is a silly thing about the report options. I'm (intending to) overhaul them; I'll see if I can add that in when I do.
14:50:34 <ron_> cool
14:50:34 <jsled> ron_: that was lost, unfortunately, when we switched from guppi to goffice for graphing in 2.0.
14:50:45 <ron_> oh no
14:50:50 <jsled> the goffice library (at the time) didn't support it; I'm not sure if the more recent library versions do.
14:50:51 <ron_> that was REALLY useful.
14:51:10 <ron_> it was one of the reasons I stayed with gnucash rather than switching to something else...
14:51:27 <ron_> ok, well, consider this a vote for putting it back in. :)
14:51:34 <jsled> :)
14:52:18 <warlord> it's hard to put it in when the graphics library we use (now) doesn't support it.
14:52:38 <warlord> it wasn't our choice to remove the feature.
14:52:58 <ron_> warlord suggested I submit a patch - but I get overwhelmed trying to dive into the source code. I'm an experienced programmer (embedded C code, LabView programming, some scripting), but without some documentation explaining how the code is structed, standards used, etc, diving into the source code itself is a jungle.
14:53:09 <ron_> yeah, I understand
14:53:29 <warlord> read the HACKING file, and README.svn
14:54:47 <ron_> ok thanks
14:54:54 <warlord> yes, there's a learning curve, but what do you expect from an organically-grown project over a decade old that now has over 300kloc
14:55:47 <ron_> I don't mind a curve, just need a starting point. I'll look at those files, thanks.
14:56:28 <warlord> If you have specific questions you're welcome to ask and one of us can try to answer.
14:56:35 <ron_> thx
14:57:15 <jsled> ron_: Also, for the bit you're referring to, you'll want to look at the option(db) editing dialog in src/gnome-utils/dialog-options.[ch]
14:57:40 <jsled> But, really, what's needed is the options need to declare whether/if they should cause a report re-rendering when changed.
14:57:58 <ron_> right, thats what I was thinking too.
14:58:08 <ron_> we'll see how far I get.
14:58:12 <jsled> Of course, given how monolithic the rendering interface is, I'm not sure if that would even help.
14:58:46 <jsled> As there's a single "render-the-report" function that the report provides … no matter what the option changes, that's the only thing that can be done.
14:59:04 <jsled> So, even to change the name at the top of the report, the whole renderer would need to be run.
14:59:14 <ron_> that's what I was afraid of.
14:59:18 <jsled> Which would entail all the heavy number crunching.
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15:31:44 <andi5> hiho cstim :-)
15:33:50 <cstim> hey andi5
15:34:01 * cstim is the babysitter for tonight
15:34:14 <jsled> @notes cstim,
15:34:14 <gncbot> jsled: Sent 2 days, 21 hours, and 40 minutes ago: <jsled> could you please give me the rundown of how the interaction between the clones and the master repo is suppsoed to work (c.f. <http://wiki.gnucash.org/wiki/Git>). Is it: cd trunk; git commit; git push; cd ../all; git-svn dcommit; cd ../trunk; git pull; ?
15:34:40 <jsled> (hi!:)
15:35:00 <cstim> If the girls keep quiet, I could give #gnucash a little while before having to go to bed
15:35:05 <cstim> jsled: yes
15:35:09 <cstim> jsled: rehi
15:35:24 <warlord> hiya cstim.
15:35:32 <warlord> I might be in Germany in July or August.
15:35:46 <cstim> warlord: hi. cool - let's meet and get some Eiswein :-)
15:35:57 <warlord> Absolutely!
15:36:08 <cstim> I am so drowned in work and childcare, I even stopped reading the IRC logs completely approx. 3 weeks ago.
15:37:37 <warlord> Well, hopefully it'll be better come summer.
15:37:49 <jsled> cstim: hmm. When I do the pull, it doesn't seem to transfer the git-svn-id's to the revisions that I originally committed to the clone repo. It also seems to add a "merge" revision that complicates things. :(
15:38:06 <andi5> note: locally i actually clone using `git clone -l -n -s all trunk` ...
15:38:48 <cstim> jsled: 1. My git foo is still limited. I started the wiki page mainly so that others can replace my initial recipe by a better one. Unfortunately this didn't happen so far.
15:38:57 <warlord> well, I know I'll be in Dublin. There's a high probability I'll get over to germany.
15:39:20 <cstim> jsled: 2. Get rid of the merges by doing "git rebase origin/master" (or whatever the originating branch was called) frequently.
15:40:11 <cstim> warlord: I'm in Hamburg pretty much all summer, maybe except for short 2-3 day trips.
15:41:00 <cstim> andi5: why the "-n"?
15:41:47 <andi5> ok, the -n probably does not matter
15:41:53 * cstim hates those long collections of magic options to git commands that everyone seems to use.
15:43:09 <cstim> For example, I'm sure there is some magic collection of options to "git pull" that will make a local rebase instead of merge, but I neither know that nor am able to find it in the man-pages or any documentation. Seems to be very well hidden.
15:43:34 <andi5> actually, i never do any `git pull`
15:43:40 <andi5> where do you use it?
15:43:59 <andi5> i am used to run `git fetch` to get something from my master repo
15:44:26 <cstim> You mean, git fetch, followed by git rebase?
15:44:31 <andi5> yep
15:44:43 <cstim> git pull (AFAIU) should have done both in one step
15:45:00 <warlord> cstim: I'll let you know. Now that I know the IETF is in Dublin I'll talk to my manager in a week.
15:45:18 <cstim> yeah. That would be great!
15:45:20 <andi5> seems like pull does a merge instead of a rebase, just as you said
15:45:48 <andi5> cstim: did you see the translations patches on gnucash-devel?
15:45:59 <cstim> andi5: some of them. Which one?
15:46:15 <andi5> de_CH, a chinese one... and something yesterday
15:46:26 <andi5> russian
15:46:30 <cstim> right
15:46:41 <cstim> (Hannah screaming... bbiab)
16:11:29 <cstim> I'm not so happy with the de_CH contribution.
16:15:41 <andi5> what is wrong about it?
16:15:51 <cstim> did you see my reply?
16:16:30 <andi5> hm... no, it has not reached my mailbox yet :(
16:16:35 <andi5> but hey, there is pipermail
16:16:55 <cstim> effectively, it contains exactly one wording change: "Gewinn-/Verlustrechung" into "Erfolgsrechnung".
16:17:11 <andi5> wow
16:17:16 <cstim> heck, there might even be de_DE businesses that prefer the second term over the first one.
16:18:56 <andi5> actually, i assumed something different, given his mail ...
16:20:53 <cstim> same here, yes.
16:30:39 <cstim> see ya
16:30:44 <andi5> ciao
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16:51:46 <olsen> isnt there a way to pay an invoice in the "daybook"
16:52:13 <olsen> or the journal or whatever you call it (you may excuse me, english is not my native language and this is as far as the dictionary helps me)
16:53:12 <olsen> i import bank statements by csv which i convert to qif and import to gnucash to my bank account inthere... some of theese lines are payments thats associated with an invoice
16:55:27 <warlord> No, you cannot pay an invoice through the register.
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17:06:19 <warlord> GO PATS!
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17:53:28 <Dave_is_sexy> Here's an interesting one. My PayPal transactions are listed as occuring a few days before the coresponding transactions in my current account. What's the best way to associate these? (And why are they like that, anyone know?)
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18:03:07 <Dave_is_sexy> have to go, but will be back :)
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18:16:34 <andi5> fyi: http://webspectrum.blogspot.com/2008/02/website-review-of-gnu-cash.html
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18:47:20 <klee> to warlord and Dave_is_sexy: thank you for your answers some hours ago. I still have some difficulties to understand the bookkeeping lingo and to sort the corresponding terms like deposit/credits etc. I finally found out what I really searched for the moment: Simply how to change the words "deposit"/"withdrawal" to "credits"/"debits". I'll keep on getting familiar with the program and thank you for the while!
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19:27:29 <Dave_is_sexy> I was just reading through the FAQ (which is very good), and it says that tac refunds should go into a special asset account. I put mine into expenses:tax:income tax as a rebate. That's ok isn't it? I also noticed that my income+liabilities != assets+expenses. It's very close, but not equal. Does that mean I've allocated a few things wrongly?
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