2007-09-15 GnuCash IRC logs

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08:03:36 <dorky> I just noticed that the scheduled transaction editor allows formulas.
08:03:42 <dorky> Is there a list of functions?
08:04:02 <dorky> And can I use formulas in a "normal" transaction?
08:05:41 <dorky> Specifically, I'd like to automate my paycheck entry, which is different every time. I'd like to be able to enter the gross, and have taxes, 401K contribution, and net automatically updated
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08:36:06 <warlord> dorky: the formulas are listen in fin.scm (IIRC)
08:36:27 <warlord> and you can use direct math in a paycheck, but not arbitrary formulae
08:38:43 <warlord> for example, you can type something like "1000 * .06" and it will change that to "60". But the formulas are NOT retained.
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10:13:32 <dorky> But the formulas are retained in a scheduled transaction, right?
10:14:46 <dorky> So in theory, I can set up my paycheck as a scheduled transaction, and when I come home with my paystub, I can enter the gross amount and everything else works itself out according to formulas, and the final amounts entered in the real transaction according to the results.
10:14:56 <dorky> Sort of like the mortgage druid thing.
10:15:38 <dorky> The scheduled transaction that the mortgage druid creates uses functions, and a variable "i".
10:15:52 <dorky> Where's the documention on available variables and functions?
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11:08:57 <jsled> dorky: yes
11:09:28 <jsled> dorky: http://wiki.gnucash.org/wiki/FAQ#Q:_How_do_I_use_variables_and_formula_in_scheduled_transactions.3F
11:11:36 <dorky> That you. I though I'd looked through the FAQ on the wiki, but I guess I missed it.
11:13:53 <dorky> Looks like exactly what I wanted. Thank you.
11:16:14 <jsled> But you don't need a new function to do what you want, it sounds like.
11:17:02 <jsled> Well, depending on how complex the values are, I suppose.
11:17:14 <dorky> Indeed I dont.
11:17:27 <dorky> I think that one variable "gross" is all I'll need.
11:18:03 <dorky> But It'd be nice to have some sort of intermediate step between scheduled transaction and entering the same thing again.
11:18:25 <jsled> How's that?
11:18:39 <dorky> I've noticed that if I entered a transaction correctly, and later go to enter the same transaction again, but just enter the new "net" amount,
11:18:54 <dorky> then the differance gets automatically put in "imbalance"
11:19:35 <dorky> This is far from ideal, it would be nice if there where some way to auto-magically remember or guess how that transaction was done last time,
11:19:51 <dorky> So that when I redid it, it would try to get the right values.
11:20:15 <dorky> You could make that really complex - look at the last X tranactions like this one, guess from that pattern what this should look like,
11:20:40 <dorky> or really simple - always reallocate the rest of the splits by percentage according to the new net amount entered,
11:21:43 <dorky> or less complex AI and more Complex UI - some method to have a "previous transaction" that is a user-specifed template with formulas, as a scheduled transaction is, but without the schedule, and with a "simpler" method of entry.
11:22:05 <dorky> Probably way to complex to realistically implement.
11:22:15 <jsled> Yeah. I've been thinking about a similar "template transaction" thing.
11:22:26 <jsled> A step below SXes, a step above Autocomplete.
11:22:38 <jsled> It's not that complex.
11:22:41 <dorky> Getting the UI "right" would be a difficult, and probably incremental, process.
11:23:34 <dorky> Ideally, it would encourage the user to move gracefully from "just like last time" to "complex formula with two entered variables, one of which is taken from the value entered as "net" in the ledger"
11:23:58 <dorky> I'm not even sure something like that is possible.
11:25:15 <dorky> I first step would be formulas remembered from transactions entered "normally" in the ledger, though. Even if the totals logic doesn't use it, it would be useful to remember what formula was entered into the field for later.
11:25:25 <dorky> s/I/1/
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11:26:27 <dorky> I need to learn scheme. Doesn't look all that different from lisp.
11:26:38 <jsled> it's a version of lisp, yes.
11:26:52 <jsled> but ... why do you need to learn it?
11:26:56 <dorky> That'd let me do some of the reports I want to do as well.
11:27:25 <dorky> I want a "money spent on utility X vs. month of year" report.
11:27:48 <dorky> And a "tithing vs. income report, highlighting income for which there is no matching tithe transaction"
11:28:01 <dorky> And... Um, there may have been a couple more too.
11:29:19 <dorky> And if I need to write a function in lisp/scheme to customize my transactions properly, then I have no problem with that. I've done SOME lisp work, anyway.
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12:39:49 <dorky> Dialoge:
12:40:13 <dorky> The Scheduled Transaciton Editor cannot automatically balance this transaction. Should it still be entered?
12:40:14 <dorky> yes.
12:40:34 <dorky> Scheduled Transactions with variables cannot be automatically created.
12:40:36 <dorky> ?
12:41:01 <jsled> right.
12:41:22 <dorky> So... Ah, the "create automatically" checkbox.
12:41:24 <jsled> So, if you get the first one, there probably is a balance problem with the formula you entered.
12:41:37 <dorky> Then how to I create it?
12:41:58 <jsled> For the second, if there's variables, then it needs to dialog with you to get the variable values, so it can't automagically create the SXes (without intervention)
12:42:05 <jsled> Fix the balance problem... :)
12:42:16 <dorky> I double-checked. It balances. Gross*.8635 + gross*.0145 + gross*.062 + gross*.06 = gross.
12:42:47 <jsled> What's the formula exactly?
12:42:57 <jsled> Like, copy/pasted from the dialog?
12:43:09 <dorky> gross*.8635
12:43:14 <dorky> gross*.0145
12:43:17 <dorky> gross*.062
12:43:22 <dorky> gross*.06
12:43:26 <dorky> gross
12:43:33 <jsled> Each in different cells.
12:43:48 <dorky> Yes, with the last on the other side of the ledger to balance it out.
12:43:54 <jsled> Right.
12:44:12 <jsled> So, it determines that balance by doing 5 iterations of picking a random number for each variable and seeing if it balances.
12:44:19 <dorky> ?
12:44:25 <jsled> Given the *.8635 and whatnot, it's probably off by just a little bit.
12:44:32 <dorky> Doesn't it prompt for "gross" ONCE?
12:45:02 <dorky> Oh, So I have to enter a formula that does the rounding explicitly?
12:45:13 <jsled> Yes, it will. I'm talking about the code that backs this dialog ... that determines if it complains about the balance or not.
12:45:27 <jsled> Either that, or just say "Yes, still create it." :)
12:45:41 <dorky> But then it may enter incorrectly.
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12:46:23 <jsled> True.
12:46:39 <dorky> Kay. I'll go find a rounding function then.
12:54:53 <jsled> Unfortunately, this exposes a bit of silliness in how I did the SX function handling.
12:55:49 <jsled> Guile has both (ceiling ..) and (floor ..), but the SX functions are prefixed with 'gnc:'.
12:56:09 <jsled> So, simple enough, you'll just need to (define (gnc:ceil x) (ceiling x)) in fin.scm.
12:56:29 <jsled> But you shouldn't need to, of course.
12:57:43 <dorky> (define (gnc:round val) (/ (round (* val 100) )) 100 )
12:58:17 <dorky> Should work, but that depends on the precision of the value passed in?
12:58:35 <dorky> And the local currency, but since I'm just using dollars...
13:00:04 <dorky> Or I could to the calulation entirely in fin.scm (warlord was right about the name) with
13:00:11 <dorky> (define (gnc:percent amt percent) (/ (round (* (* val (/ percent 100) 100) )) 100 )
13:00:30 <dorky> Oh, and I just write the file and restart Gnucash, I'm assuming.
13:00:39 <jsled> Actually...
13:00:53 <jsled> (*headslap* of course ceil and floor are useless. nevermind me)
13:01:01 <jsled> You can modify the installed fin.scm...
13:01:29 <jsled> ... or you can add custom functions to ~/.gnucash/config.user
13:01:36 <dorky> Done, restart gnucash? (y/n)
13:01:41 <jsled> yes, restart needed.
13:01:43 <dorky> Ooohh, config.user?
13:01:56 <jsled> yeah. that's much more friendly w.r.t. upgrades and whatnot.
13:05:42 <dorky> Good idea. I'll do that.
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13:12:44 <dorky> Are you sure about the config.user thing? It's not working for me...
13:12:58 <dorky> It doesn't crash when I put extra parens in there.
13:13:06 <jsled> Yeah ... I'd tried it a while ago, even.
13:13:14 <jsled> Heh.
13:13:17 * jsled tries.
13:14:17 <jsled> It doesn't crash here, either; it does complain to the console that it was unable to read the file.
13:14:39 <jsled> Lovely. Then it has an "Exception during displaying of backtrace"
13:14:45 <dorky> I don't get that - what version was that feature added? I'm using 2.02
13:15:03 <jsled> What feature?
13:15:15 <dorky> the config.user
13:15:38 <jsled> Hmm. Good question. I thought it was before that, but let me see if I can check.
13:16:38 <jsled> Yeah, it looks like 2.0.2 supported config.user: http://svn.gnucash.org/repo/gnucash/tags/2.0.2/src/bin/gnucash-bin.c
13:16:56 <jsled> (in load_user_config(void))
13:24:11 <dorky> Well, I added it to fin.scm, which DOES crash on load with extra parens, and it still doesn't work - so maybe it just silently fails to load if there's an error in config.user?
13:25:12 <jsled> dorky: are you running gnucash from a terminal?
13:25:33 <dorky> Oh, and my scheduled transaction is still not working properly.
13:25:35 <dorky> Yes,
13:25:49 <jsled> Oh. I bet it goes to /tmp/gnucash.trace
13:25:52 <dorky> No error on the terminal screen either.
13:25:55 <dorky> I'll check.
13:26:08 <dorky> Yay!
13:26:31 <jsled> Sorry. I run with {--logto stderr}, so everything's on the console.
13:26:43 <dorky> And it is complaining about errors in config.user there as well.
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14:05:37 <dorky> OK! Got it to work.
14:05:57 <dorky> It still complains about an unbalanced transaction, but when I actually create it, it's balanced.
14:06:15 <dorky> Must not be balanced for all possible values.
14:06:44 <dorky> But it's close enough for what I need.
14:06:51 <dorky> Thanks.
14:14:31 <jsled> dorky: you're welcome. I'm glad the facilities are useful to you.
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16:24:20 <Clark> hi
16:24:24 <jsled> hello
16:24:43 <Clark> i have a question regarding gnucash and windows vista
16:24:52 <Clark> i have vista x86
16:25:03 <Clark> and gnucash 2.2.1 lock up
16:25:09 <Clark> its extremely slow
16:25:18 <Clark> i have read the wiki
16:25:52 <Clark> and if i disable network interfaces it may work i undeerstand
16:26:04 <Clark> but..how can i do that?
16:26:40 <jsled> I don't know; I don't use Vista or Windows at all, really...
16:26:58 <jsled> It might be the case that a procedure was detailed on the mailing list, but I really can't recall with certainty.
16:28:01 <jsled> http://lists.gnucash.org/ has links to both browsing and searching functionality for the mailing lists.
16:28:12 <jsled> I'd start iwht gnucash-user, and maybe try gnucash-devel after that.
16:28:51 <Clark> ok..thanks a lot
16:29:03 <jsled> Sorry I can't be more helpful. :/
16:31:15 <Clark> its ok...to be honest im thinking to migrate to gnu/linux, the debian distribution, but first i must buy my PC
16:31:30 <Clark> my dad doesnt want anything than windows!
16:31:54 <jsled> heh.
16:32:01 <Clark> i was shoocked after i saw the compiz fusion desktop
16:32:20 <jsled> Well, there's always vmware ... you could run linux inside windows...
16:32:28 <jsled> And he could be happy.
16:32:35 <Clark> i now have a p4 2.4 ghz and i cant even use windows aero
16:32:45 <jsled> Ah.
16:32:54 <Clark> with this pc i think i could run very well the compiz
16:33:30 <jsled> Well, I'm not much for the eye candy. I want a window manager that's small and stays out of the way. The screen's for application's and data, not chrome.
16:34:00 <Clark> i try a few years ago the doublebooting...but o prefer having my own pc
16:34:39 <jsled> Yeah ... I did dual-booting of dos+windows and OS/2 years and years ago. For a couple of months, only.
16:34:53 <jsled> Thankfully these days there's not much need.
16:35:07 <Clark> i have found all the equivalent software i use on windows with debian, so...
16:35:17 <Clark> theres no need to that
16:35:20 <jsled> yeah. Things get better every year. :)
16:35:34 <Clark> the only thing is problematic is the videogames
16:35:42 <Clark> but i know wine
16:43:11 <Clark> well..im going ou now
16:43:16 <jsled> take care.
16:43:18 <Clark> thanks a lot for your help
16:43:21 <Clark> see ya
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22:14:50 <andi5> hi nbinont... have you tried 1.1.22 already?
22:15:48 <nbinont> libxslt?
22:15:52 <andi5> yep
22:16:38 <nbinont> no...I'm not sure what the policy is for bumping library dependencies on micro releases is
22:17:28 <andi5> i am not sure we really have a policy :-) ... maybe you are right and we should just stick to 1.1.19 for 2.2.x releases
22:18:57 <nbinont> If there's something in there that fixes a bug we have, I'd go for it, but otherwise I'm inclined to leave it at 1.1.9
22:19:08 <nbinont> *1.1.19
22:19:23 <andi5> that is what i have said before as well, so it is fine for me
22:19:46 <nbinont> have you seen http://cyberbird.yi.org/gnucash/ ?
22:19:56 <andi5> no
22:20:04 <nbinont> ..just set it up a couple days ago
22:20:05 <andi5> gimme a second
22:22:24 <andi5> cool :)
22:23:13 <nbinont> It's set to check for a new revision and build it every 6 hours (ok, so I know it's excessive ;) )
22:23:49 <andi5> it is a pity, but i have a lot less spare time now... i still hope to manage to work a bit more on gnucash again in the future :-)
22:23:55 <andi5> hui
22:25:57 <andi5> what is your plan with that url, btw... can we point testers to it?
22:26:26 <andi5> i mean... bug reporters to verify fixes and alike
22:27:40 <nbinont> yes and no...It's on a very slow link, so I don't mind the occational tester, but It can't handle much more than that - 10Kb/s is about all you'll get
22:28:16 <andi5> ok... but watch out the mighty search engine crawlers :-D
22:28:22 <nbinont> I was hoping to get a bash script setup that could pull a version over to gnucash.org once a day...but I haven't done that yet (and haven't asked if it's ok)
22:29:20 <nbinont> ...gotta write the script first
22:29:25 <andi5> we do not offer win32 builds on gnucash.org at all currently... but maybe we should, at least the latest version
22:29:47 <andi5> release version, i mean, sorry it is late
22:30:39 <nbinont> well...I don't know if we want the official releases on it...the bandwidth is insane
22:31:09 <andi5> i have not checked the download numbers recently
22:31:22 <andi5> somehow i expected them to drop, because i did not fix bugs anymore ;-)
22:31:23 <nbinont> over 50k
22:32:09 <nbinont> at a rate of about 600/day or 30gb transfer a day
22:32:30 <andi5> ok
22:33:12 <nbinont> I don't know what bandwidth capability gnucash.org has...any idea?
22:34:14 <andi5> hm... i saw some threads about build problems on vista, but .... did not read it carefully... have you all come up with some solution?
22:34:32 <nbinont> alas, I don't have vista :(
22:34:33 <andi5> no, i have no clue (that is true in more contexts)
22:36:03 <andi5> btw, does your script detect build errors, so that we can fix them asap?
22:36:08 <nbinont> I think the vista problems are due to this strange network access reported back in the 2.1.x series, but haven't had a chance to track it down
22:36:54 <nbinont> yes, if the build fails the buildlog will be posted without the binary (there's 3 logs there now)
22:37:15 <andi5> there is quite a good bug report out there, created by a very helping hand, without dozens of subscribers
22:38:15 <andi5> http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=469464 it is... two weeks since last comment, damnit
22:40:20 <nbinont> hmm...missed that one, thanks
22:43:01 <andi5> honestly, it is non-trivial for me to follow the track of bugs with lots of active commentors writing about different bugs/problems and whatever... and you know, there are good comments and not so good ones :-D
22:43:18 <andi5> anyway, i have to get some sleep
22:43:42 <nbinont> ok, thanks for the pointers
22:43:43 <nbinont> night
22:44:00 <andi5> nbinont: thank you for your commitment... please send us a line for AUTHORS! :-)
22:44:13 <nbinont> :)
22:44:30 <andi5> night
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23:12:35 <Alistair> Should I put in a feature request for ability to delete custom reports - seems only option is to edit the reports file which I cannot find on system in any case.
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