2007-08-19 GnuCash IRC logs
00:00:55 <chris> ok, you've got it, andi5. I'm off to bed. g'night.
00:01:01 <andi5> hehe
00:01:04 * andi5 has won
00:01:34 <andi5> it is getting rather light out here again
00:01:57 <andi5> or bright, even
00:02:53 <andi5> bye chris
00:18:39 <andi5> @all: please take a look at it #343448 ... i just tested it a tiny bit and it really seems to work.... would be nice to have it in 2.2.1
00:18:39 <gncbot> andi5: Error: "all:" is not a valid command.
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04:38:55 <Rol1> Hi there!
04:39:01 <Rol1> Any Germans around?
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06:41:26 <andi5> R0lf: no ;-)
06:41:46 <R0lf> hehe
06:41:49 <R0lf> looks like it
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09:50:55 <Chris_> Is there a public download of the OFX xml lists for GNUcash? Unfortunately, I do not have Linux to run the the script.
09:57:16 <andi5> "ofx xml lists"? "the script"?
09:58:16 *** warlord-afk is now known as warlord
09:58:27 <andi5> ah, hi warlord!
09:58:35 <warlord> Chris_: have you followed all the links from the wiki pages?
09:58:37 <warlord> andi5: good morning
09:58:41 <andi5> I need YOU (pointing my finger into your direction)
09:59:56 <Chris_> Yes... http://www.jongsma.org/gc/ I did not see(or maybe understand) how to run the script w/o Linux
10:04:06 <warlord> Chris_: There are other links, too.. There's not just a script; there's also a tar.gz. You dont need linux for that; you just need "tar" and "gzip"
10:04:18 <warlord> andi5: looks around to see who you're pointing at.
10:04:27 <andi5> *g*
10:04:40 <andi5> i am trying to create a bare announcement at the wiki
10:06:52 <andi5> http://wiki.gnucash.org/wiki/Announcement_2.2.1 ... it is missing a list of changes and probably other stuff as well
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10:10:54 <warlord> andi5: the "what's new" is something you create from the ChangeLogs; you build the NEWS file and then and copy that entry into the announcement.
10:12:30 <warlord> FYI, http://download.sourceforge.net/gnucash appears not to work.
10:13:01 <andi5> ouch... what the heck
10:14:04 <andi5> huh... now it worked again, redirecting me to http://sourceforge.net/project/showfiles.php?group_id=192
10:14:47 <warlord> Not I. It forwarded me to http://.dl.sourceforge.net/sourceforge/gnucash/index-sf.html whic didn't work.
10:15:14 <andi5> ok, i will just use above url then
10:17:46 <Chris_> Sorry... Yes... I see it now... Thank you
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10:21:56 <andi5> btw, why do we include branches like r-r in our changelog?
10:22:21 <warlord> You're welcome.
10:23:07 <warlord> andi5: I think because there's just not a good way (on trunk) to pull the logs from the merged branches.
10:30:14 <andi5> seems like we can determine what branches to include in macros/svn2cl ... maybe we should only include those that are merged (at least once)... most prominently, not r-r
10:32:45 <warlord> ok..
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12:01:03 <andi5> suggestions / comments regarding http://wiki.gnucash.org/wiki/Announcement_2.2.1 ?
12:06:36 <warlord> s/Import QSF/QSF Import
12:07:59 <warlord> andi5: also, why do you have the same URLs in both Download and Getting Gnucash?
12:10:51 <andi5> re import qsf: ack
12:11:18 <warlord> Other than those comments, it looks good to me..
12:11:25 <warlord> BIAB, need to reboot to test a new kernel.
12:11:26 <andi5> shall i remove those two links at the bottom?
12:11:42 <andi5> well, i guess they will not appear in NEWS, so i can at least continue :)
12:11:47 <warlord> I'd combine te two sections.
12:11:56 <warlord> BIAB
12:12:00 <andi5> at the top? ... i think the idea was to have the links above the rest
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12:33:37 <warlord> andi5: sorry, okay, I guess that makes sense to have the links at the top and the bottom.
12:35:50 <andi5> hm... i think it is ok at the top... is there anyone reading those messages until the end? ;-)
12:36:21 <andi5> maybe i should insert some random political statement in my last sentence ;-)
12:40:18 <warlord> LOL
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12:42:41 <administrator> hello to all !
12:42:43 <administrator> Does anybody know what type of Letter is setup in the print dialog as default. Is this the US Letter or A4 ?
12:42:44 <administrator> Exist also the possibility to change the Type of Letter somehow ?
12:42:46 <administrator> In the Print dialog this possibility don't exist !
12:44:43 <MrN> in my printer dialog, it can be configured
12:44:51 <MrN> the default is locale-dependent AFAIK
12:44:53 <warlord> administrator: what version of gtk? In my printer dialog I can configure it.
12:45:04 <MrN> so for most of the world, it would be A4
12:46:44 <administrator> Hmmm. I itself have my Printer connected in Ubuntu Feisty as a Network Printer
12:47:22 <administrator> could it be this the problem ?
12:47:38 <warlord> nope, shouldn't matter
12:48:15 <administrator> can you say me how can i found out what gtk version i have. the terminal command "gth -v" dont work
12:48:48 <MrN> this is what i use, but i have -dev packages installed: pkg-config --modversion gtk+-2.0
12:49:14 <warlord> rpm -q gtk2
12:49:31 <MrN> heh that's just as unportable :D
12:49:34 <warlord> administrator: (at least that's how I do it on my Fedora system)
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12:55:39 <administrator> Well i will spend more time on this issue and come back if i have more infos.
12:55:41 <administrator> At least i know that this is not a GnuCash Problem.
12:55:42 <administrator> One thing that i have allways wondered is if one time Gnucash would support
12:55:43 <administrator> also the CSS tags like "bottom" "top" and so on for creating Invoices.
12:55:45 <administrator> At the moment this tags dont work.
12:55:47 <administrator> http://www.dynamicdrive.com/style/layouts/item/css-left-top-bottom-and-right-frames-layout/
12:57:37 <warlord> administrator: gtkhtml doesn't support CSS.
13:03:10 <MrN> hmm which alternatives to gtkhtml would be feasible?
13:03:21 <MrN> i imagine that integrating gecko would be pretty hard
13:03:29 <administrator> Thats really Pitty.
13:03:31 <administrator> Without CSS support people dont have the easy possibility to put her adresses or information allways on the same position at the end of the Invoice.
13:05:47 <warlord> administrator: Well, are YOU willing to do the development work to find and integrate an alternative?
13:06:00 <warlord> MrN: there's been talk of Gecko via GtkMozEmbed
13:06:33 <MrN> what's the result?
13:06:37 <administrator> How about Dillo !
13:06:38 <administrator> http://www.dillo.org/
13:06:40 <administrator> If i am not wrong Dillo support CSS
13:07:11 <MrN> damn, dillo is even gtk 1.2
13:08:11 <warlord> administrator: um, it's not GTK2
13:09:10 <warlord> Or at least it's not obvious if it is.
13:09:12 <MrN> and no, dillo has not the slightest CSS support
13:10:16 <warlord> sorry, administrator
13:12:42 <administrator> Its OK. Thanks for the Helpfull answers till yet.
13:12:44 <administrator> Last question before i quit.
13:14:01 <MrN> administrator: are you a windows user?
13:14:19 <administrator> No I am a ubuntu user why ?
13:14:38 <MrN> your account is named "administrator"?
13:16:39 <administrator> I have choosed the name becouse i am a owner of small company in switzerland and i am doing normally administrative works all the time. My Nickname describe that what i am doing all the time :-)
13:18:52 <warlord> so... your last question? ;)
13:19:45 <administrator> warlord: What do you think about a totaly new rewritten Gnucash that is based on the Gecko Rendering engine.
13:19:46 <administrator> We have very popular Programms like Firefox and Thunderbird with 1000 of extensions written by other people.
13:19:48 <administrator> Would it be not the best thing to start writing Gnucash as a XUL programm like FireFox and Thunderbird ?
13:19:49 <administrator> Imagine the pupblicity that you can get from the Mozilla fundation and the mozilla spread sites !
13:20:24 <warlord> administrator: http://wiki.gnucash.org/wiki/FAQ#Q:_Why_don.27t_you_rewrite_GnuCash_in_programming_language_xyz_so_that_I_can_contribute_easily.3F
13:20:25 <MrN> i like how gnucash is a gtk+ application.
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13:22:08 <warlord> administrator: there's a good 15-20 man-years of effort in gnucash (maybe more!) Are YOU going to fund the re-development? I certainly dont have the couple of million dollars handy to fund that kind of effort.
13:26:33 <administrator> My feeling say that at some point gnucash has to be rewritten if the developers want to have broad succes.
13:26:35 <administrator> I cant belive that with this code and this architecture at the moment that Gnucash have there is a bright future for GNUCash!
13:26:37 <administrator> Looks only at the Tax Problems and at the different needs to book Invoices in Gnucash.
13:27:08 <MrN> well you are of course allowed to fork gnucash
13:27:16 <MrN> it's open source after all
13:27:22 <warlord> That doesn't require a complete rewrite to fix those issues. you can fix them one at a time in the existing architecture. But you're always welcome to do whatever the heck you want.
13:30:28 <warlord> BTW, administrator, what "Tax Problems" are there? And what do you mean by "different needs to book Invoices"? I realize English isn't your first language, which is why I'm asking for clarification here.
13:35:09 <administrator> The need of different booking of Invoices is filled as a bug by a australian user.
13:35:11 <administrator> The actual archtecture of GNUCASH books the Invoices directly and save it. However a lot of companys need the possibility to book the Invoices after they are paid! This missing of that feature makes gnucash to look not very Professional as a accounting software
13:36:16 <warlord> Ahh, you mean Cash vs. Accrual accounting?
13:36:52 <warlord> So if you only book an invoice after it is paid, what do you do if the customer underpays you?
13:38:54 <administrator> Well i belive i have posted a link to the tax governement that say you have to book only the amount that you recive. For the Tax itself
13:38:56 <administrator> You have different Options
13:39:19 <warlord> As for not "look[ing] ... very professional", well, this IS freeware. You get what you pay for, and honestly, it still works for the majority of users. If they want something specific they're welcome to pay for it.
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13:40:28 <warlord> Book it how? Remember, this is double-entry, so the amounts have to come from and go elsewhere. What happens if not all of your invoice is taxable?
13:41:40 <warlord> How does one split it? How do you know how much is taxable, and how much isn't?
13:42:01 <warlord> Let's say you have a $100 invoice, and only $75 is taxable, and the user pays $63. How would you book that?
13:43:29 <MrN> first book $100 against A/Receivable and on payment split it between cash and rebate expenditures?
13:43:57 <warlord> MrN: and what's the OTHER end of the A/R txn?
13:44:22 <MrN> revenue? :D
13:44:40 <MrN> just like a direct txn just with A/R instead of cash
13:44:41 <administrator> You Book the amount of the Money that you recive nothing else.
13:44:42 <administrator> The amount of the Invoice "100 Dollars" you dont book in Gnucash
13:44:43 <administrator> In your case you book only the 63 Dollars as income.
13:44:45 <administrator> The other Moneys arent showed in the book
13:45:16 <warlord> administrator: and of those $63, how much is Income and how much is Tax?
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13:45:45 <administrator> For the Tax you have to write on the Invoice how you split the Tax. I think i have you given a link for this issue
13:46:12 <warlord> I've read nothing about how to split a partial payment.
13:46:22 <warlord> what bug#?
13:48:26 <administrator> We have allready spoked about that for a long time ago !
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13:48:27 <administrator> As a answer you giveed me a filled GNUCASH BUG.
13:48:29 <administrator> After that you have closed the bug with the comment that this need a totaly rewritment of gnucash and that you dont want to resolve this bug. You can't remember ?
13:49:03 <administrator> The Bug was from the year 2003 if i remember right.
13:49:05 <administrator> The person was a asutralian.
13:49:33 <warlord> You expect me to remember a bug I closed four years ago as WONTFIX?
13:49:54 <MrN> administrator: may i query you in a completely unrelated matter?
13:50:01 <administrator> That was this year for about maximal 3 Months
13:50:26 <administrator> MrN: yea allways
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13:56:12 <warlord> administrator: without a bug# I'm afraid I have no idea which bug you're talking about.
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14:09:39 <administrator> warlord: i will try to find it. just a moment !
14:11:17 <warlord> ty
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14:22:25 <warlord> hey, andi5 ... when you "make distcheck" are you doing it from an actual SVN checkout?
14:22:59 <andi5> [ot] i think i finally solved my connection problem... the router was set to keep-alive internet connection which was disconnected every 24 hours, always in the evening :)
14:23:14 <andi5> yes... that is what i did an hour ago or so... the tarballs are ready
14:23:26 <andi5> i will build them once again and do some tests
14:23:41 <warlord> okay. Great!
14:23:58 <warlord> hmm... keepalive usually means "make dead"
14:24:14 <andi5> hehe
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14:25:00 <administrator> Well i think i have found it warlord.
14:25:02 <administrator> http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=95700
14:25:04 <administrator> Here is also your conversation about this allready
14:25:05 <administrator> http://lists.gnucash.org/logs/2007-05-19.html#T15:36:14
14:25:32 <warlord> Ahh, that bug's not closed!
14:25:51 <andi5> warlord: would you mind compiling it once for me? ... you never know, maybe my autotools suck ;-)
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14:27:22 <warlord> andi5: Um, sure. pm me the url where I can pull the tarball.
14:27:51 <andi5> do you think i can upload it to f.g.o?
14:28:08 <meznak> 'lo all. I just upgraded to Ubuntu Feisty and gnucash 2.0.2. Before I did the upgrade, I exported my accounts to a .qif file. Now that I'm trying to import the .qif, I'm getting an error saying that it doesn't appear to be a valid qif.
14:28:08 <warlord> Oh, you could do that I guess.
14:28:39 <warlord> meznak: why not just use your original gnucash data file?
14:29:33 <meznak> which file would that be? I took a full backup of my home directory, but I'm not sure which file I need.
14:30:12 <warlord> Well, it would be wherever you saved your data file.
14:30:46 <warlord> I can't tell you where you decided to save it.. Just like I can't tell you where you saved your resume or your last letter to mom.
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14:32:28 <meznak> i understand that. what's the default save location? ~/.gnucash?
14:33:17 <warlord> Hopefully not.
14:33:52 <warlord> find files named '*.xac" or "*.log"
14:34:34 <meznak> ok. I see lots of date-stamped .xac and .log files in my backed-up .gnucash directory
14:34:43 <meznak> is the .xac the one i need?
14:36:17 <warlord> No.. You want the [foo] that matches [foo].YYYYMMDDHHMMSS.xac
14:36:35 <warlord> where in ~/.gnucash do you have it?
14:36:45 <warlord> That's really not a good place for your datafile.
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14:38:03 <andi5> warlord: the tar.bz2 has been uploaded
14:39:41 <warlord> Oh, you're building both the gz and bz2?
14:39:53 <andi5> yep
14:40:17 <andi5> is it correct that the splash screen shows "version 2.2.1 svn (r...)"? (something along this line)
14:40:24 <warlord> yes
14:40:37 <andi5> great... it does not print "this is a dev version" to the terminal, at least
14:40:44 <warlord> it just .... right.
14:40:59 <warlord> The splash shouldn't say "dev" either.
14:41:29 <warlord> Er... Hmm.
14:42:03 <andi5> ah... that may be a translation error
14:42:12 <andi5> yep
14:42:33 <warlord> Actually, yeah, it should only say: Version: GnuCash-%s (r%s built %s)
14:42:36 <andi5> the german translation does not distinguish between dev and dist version
14:42:42 <warlord> AH.
14:42:45 <warlord> Translation bug.
14:42:52 <warlord> phew
14:42:55 <andi5> CSTIM! ;-)
14:43:39 <andi5> my upload speed still is not very good (~25KB/s)
14:45:19 <warlord> Okay, I'm just running a "make all check" from the tarball. I dont plan to install it.
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14:47:56 <andi5> thanks
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14:48:31 <andi5> i will not sign the builds now... i guess i can do that later as well, right? .... ah, right... one needs a key to sign ;-)
14:48:40 <andi5> s,builds,tarballs,
14:48:55 <warlord> hehe...
14:51:49 <andi5> ok... make all check worked here... i think it is time to wait for nathan now
14:52:03 <andi5> nbinont: oh hi, you are here? :)
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14:58:03 <andi5> ok... i am out... will come back in three hours and if everything works out as planned, do the announcements tomorrow morning CEST
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15:00:39 <warlord> @tell andi5 "make check" succeeded.
15:00:39 <gncbot> warlord: The operation succeeded.
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15:09:38 <nbinont> @tell andi5 Ready to build whenever the tarball is ready
15:09:38 <gncbot> nbinont: The operation succeeded.
15:11:16 <nbinont> @tell andi5 I'm not sure if you have it up (if you do)
15:11:16 <gncbot> nbinont: The operation succeeded.
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16:22:25 <warlord-afk> nbinont: there is a tarball up.
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16:55:40 <foo> Hm, I'm going to be adding a credit card account. For opening balance, do I put my credit limit? ANd "use equity 'Opening Balances' account" ? hmm
16:56:34 <warlord> No, the opening balance should be the total amount of charges currently on the card, the current "outstanding balance".
16:57:22 <foo> ah, ok. So, I should just leave opening balance at $0, and no need to define my credit limit - correct?
16:59:34 <warlord> Right.
17:00:21 <foo> Gotcha, thank you warlord.
17:00:23 * foo bows
17:00:43 <warlord> you're welcome
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17:07:19 <andi5> nbinont: did you find it?
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19:08:22 <nbinont> warlord: where is the tarball...I checked sourceforge and the two download links off of the main page without any luck
19:09:04 <warlord> nbinont: um, I downloaded it from www.gnucash.org/pub/
19:09:15 <warlord> (which needs to get reorganized)
19:10:49 <nbinont> ah, there it is...thanks
19:11:02 <nbinont> missed it the first time
19:11:06 <warlord> Yeah, so did I.
19:12:14 <nbinont> me rummages around to find my build machine
19:12:22 <warlord> Good luck.
19:14:38 <nbinont> ah..here it is ;)
19:15:05 <warlord> :-D
19:15:27 <MrN> n8
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19:20:31 <sorush20> hi
19:20:32 <sorush20> hi
19:21:03 <sorush20> is there any way that I could open gnucash accounts with sage line 50 is there anyway to export to qif or other formats?
19:21:49 <warlord> gnucash2qif
19:22:22 <sorush20> is that in the faq
19:23:58 <warlord> You can look as easily as I can
19:32:50 <sorush20> warlord: its not
19:33:01 <sorush20> anyways gnucash2qif is not working
19:33:18 <sorush20> why doesn't the gnucash files have an extension
19:33:33 <warlord> why do we need one?
19:33:49 <sorush20> its probebly a faq
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19:34:07 <guzzlefry> hey everyone
19:34:08 <warlord> In general we could use ".xac" and ".gnc" for data files.
19:34:23 <guzzlefry> I'm having a problem opening my account stuff. :)
19:34:35 <sorush20> guzzlefry: explain
19:34:40 <guzzlefry> .gnucash/books/financialstuff:2: parser error : Start tag expected, '<' not found
19:34:45 <guzzlefry> That's from console.
19:34:51 <guzzlefry> I get a parse error in the application.
19:35:15 <warlord> guzzlefry: you destroyed your data file by storing it in gnucash's private directory.
19:35:28 <warlord> grab a backup and copy it elsewhere.
19:35:40 <guzzlefry> Where would the backup be? :)
19:36:26 <warlord> in the same place... a .xac file
19:37:12 <warlord> Honestly, THIS should be a FAQ entry..
19:37:32 <warlord> I wish I knew why so many people decided to store their data files in ~/.gnucash/books ?
19:38:51 <guzzlefry> Looks like the place they should go. :)
19:39:47 <sorush20> when I try to convert the gnu cash files I keep getting the message that there is Corrupt gnucash file xml is worng
19:40:17 <warlord> guzzlefry: BZZT, you lose. ~/.gnucash is OWNED BY GNUCASH. "no user servicible parts inside"
19:40:47 <warlord> sorush20: did you uncompress them first?
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19:41:47 <nbinont> I wonder if the default saving dirctory is .gnucash/foo...
19:41:57 <nbinont> (for first time users)
19:42:14 <guzzlefry> It's ~/.gnucash
19:42:41 <nbinont> hmm...maybe we better change that
19:43:10 <guzzlefry> yeah.. :)
19:43:26 <nbinont> because there's no other easy way to get there (.gnucash is hidden I think)
19:43:27 <guzzlefry> Move the destructo directory to ~/.gnucash/destructo
19:43:29 <warlord> I've never seen gnucash default to that.
19:43:38 <nbinont> maybe on windows
19:43:43 <warlord> "destructo"?
19:43:59 <guzzlefry> ~/.gnucash/books
19:44:05 <guzzlefry> Is that some kind of temp directory?
19:44:09 <warlord> No..
19:44:17 <warlord> It's the directory for storing metadata
19:44:31 <warlord> in 1.8 and prior it used the an encoded full-path.
19:44:40 <warlord> but in 2.0 it changed to just the filename..
19:44:51 <warlord> so if you store your data file there, the metadata will overwrite it.
19:45:13 <guzzlefry> ah
19:52:10 <warlord> Okay, guzzlefry: http://wiki.gnucash.org/wiki/FAQ#Q:_Why_can.27t_GnuCash_find_my_data_file_anymore.3F__It_just_says:_parser_error_:_Start_tag_expected.2C_.27.3C.27_not_found
19:52:41 <warlord> Hmm, I wonder where the ~/.gnucash/books default comes from?
19:52:43 <warlord> What distro/OS?
19:52:59 <guzzlefry> Gentoo
19:53:36 <guzzlefry> Found a good backup though, so everything is fine.
19:53:44 <warlord> Hmm..
19:53:54 <warlord> I'll need to figure out how to set up an environment as a new user.
20:04:50 <guzzlefry> Everything is working fine now.
20:04:52 <guzzlefry> Thanks :)
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22:46:10 <twunder> where does dialog-sx-since-last-run.c decide what SXs get listed? gsslrtma_populate_tree_store()?
22:50:07 <warlord> twunder: maybe jsled will answer.
22:52:12 * twunder is trying to take warlord's advise and making the SLR behave like he wants (and not havng much luck)
22:52:56 <twunder> managed to rename what displays in the Status column, but that's it :(
22:53:17 <warlord> :(
22:54:37 <warlord> I suspect it's an output from a query, but I dont know what Josh is doing.
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