2007-01-12 GnuCash IRC logs
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01:23:44 <dgtlmoon> greetings
01:25:03 <dgtlmoon> when i have an invoice, and im adding an item to it, should the "Income Account" point to something under my "Income:Consulting" or should it be under Assets:Account receivable ??
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05:59:51 <cstim> andi5: should I extend install.sh/custom.sh so that gwenhywfar+aqbanking (but without qt) is downloaded and installed as well?
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06:04:55 <aphexer> i just created a new invoice, posted it and gnucash already says it has been paid, how is that possible?
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06:15:04 <sykesde1> hi folks
06:15:42 <sykesde1> I've been looking to see if there was any way to import paypal data into gnucash, I can't find anything
06:15:56 <sykesde1> is there a simple way to convert csv to gnucash?
06:17:38 <cstim> sykesde1: no, not with 2.0.x. The easiest is to convert your data to qif and import that one.
06:19:10 <sykesde1> ok, is there instructions somewhere for converting paypal to qif?
06:20:52 <cstim> like this: http://wiki.gnucash.org/wiki/FAQ#Q:_My_bank_doesn.27t_offer_OCX_or_QIF_but_only_CSV_or_similar._How_can_I_import_my_statement_data.3F
06:23:24 <sykesde1> excellent!
06:23:32 <sykesde1> perl/python - ouch!
06:23:37 <sykesde1> I'm a java dude!
06:23:46 <sykesde1> I feel a sore head coming on ;)
06:23:53 <sykesde1> Thanks for the help.
06:33:53 <cstim> you're welcome.
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09:29:05 <warlord> aphexer: It's possible if you already ran a Process Payment for that customer.
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09:29:57 <warlord> Man, JUST missed him... I'm pretty sure that paypal gives you a QIF or OFX download.
09:32:34 <aphexer> warlord, it's a new customer, it's his first bill
09:34:56 <warlord> The only way it would be marked paid is if it got attached to some Lot and the Lot is 0.
09:35:19 <warlord> The only way to attach to a Lot is to post invoices and process payments.
09:36:04 <aphexer> warlord, i created the customer and the invoice some days ago, but i posted it today, if it makes a difference
09:36:06 <aphexer> what's a lot?
09:36:23 <warlord> No, that shouldn't make a difference.
09:36:35 <aphexer> is there a way to see at what time he paid?
09:36:38 <warlord> a Lot is a way to tie different transactions together: think "stocks"
09:36:49 <warlord> Run a customer report?
09:36:56 <aphexer> ah yeah let's see
09:39:42 <aphexer> the invoice is posted, however in the accounts receivable log, it's a transaction of 0$
09:39:56 <aphexer> that's probably why it says it's been paid
09:40:00 <warlord> Yep
09:40:12 <aphexer> the customer report says total due: 15$
09:40:22 <warlord> Okay, next question: Currencies..
09:40:29 <warlord> What are the currencies in use here?
09:40:56 <aphexer> oh well i thought i'd make the conversation easier by always saying $. But i'm actually using €
09:41:14 <aphexer> so he needs to pay me 15€ :)
09:41:43 <aphexer> in accounts receivable the columns funds in/out are just empty
09:41:47 <aphexer> so meaning 0€
09:42:18 <aphexer> how can it be it says 0? why did it put 0 there?
09:42:44 <warlord> Well, if you have it all configured for different currencies it could have posted wrong..
09:43:00 <aphexer> well i recently upgraded to a new version
09:43:01 <warlord> What are the Account Currencies..
09:43:17 <warlord> And what is your Locale Currency?
09:43:56 <aphexer> that's in edit->preferences->locale currency right?
09:43:59 <aphexer> it's set to usd... hm
09:44:06 <aphexer> i did set it to eur before upgrading
09:44:50 <warlord> most preferences are lost in the upgrade from 1.8 -> 2.09
09:44:54 <warlord> er, 2.0
09:45:11 <warlord> Also, locale currency would be defined by your, um, computer's set locale.
09:45:18 <warlord> what do you get from: echo $LANG
09:45:24 <aphexer> instead of choosing 'locale: usd', should i choose 'choose: eur' ?
09:45:36 <aphexer> oh yes my computer is completely set to english
09:45:37 <warlord> What's the Customer's currency? What are each of the account currencies?
09:46:18 <aphexer> the account currencies are in eur
09:46:22 <aphexer> apparantly
09:46:39 <aphexer> customer in usd
09:47:04 <aphexer> i guess that by setting all of the settings to eur will solve things?
09:48:03 <warlord> You'll need to unpost the invoice..
09:48:09 <aphexer> ok
09:48:18 <warlord> And you MAY need to ignore it and start a new one.. I forget when it pulls the customer currency.
09:48:28 <warlord> but yes, make sure everything is un EUR
09:48:28 <aphexer> ok
09:48:34 <aphexer> thanks :) i'll go do that:)
09:50:48 <warlord> :)
10:13:52 <warlord> So... Did that work?
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10:41:12 <jsled> hey hampton
10:41:24 <jsled> [ot] Pachelbel rant - http://youtube.com/watch?v=JdxkVQy7QLM
10:41:31 <hampton> morning jsled
10:42:08 <hampton> so what, this is the morning evolution dies for everyone? Its crashed on both my laptop and my desktop in the last five minutes. :-(
10:43:31 * elb_ passes out free copies of a real mailreader
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10:43:40 <jsled> such as?
10:43:45 <elb> I use mutt, myself
10:44:09 <jsled> I used to use mutt. Does it have imap header caching, yet?
10:44:32 <elb> yes and no
10:44:33 <warlord> I like Thunderbird, personally...
10:44:43 <elb> it does a pretty good job within a mailbox, but ditches everything when you change boxes
10:45:08 <jsled> sure. it practically doesn't, then.
10:45:31 <elb> right
10:45:35 <elb> it also doesn't crash ;-)
10:45:44 <elb> well, provided you don't link it against gnutls
10:45:47 <elb> which sucks ASS
10:45:55 <jsled> hampton: istm that evolution-2.8 reverted the (noticeable) memory-handling improvements in 2.6. :(
10:46:05 <elb> even then it doesn't crash any more (it used to) but it still disconnects when gnutls eats itself
10:46:32 <elb> I'm not clear if the non-crashiness is because gnutls no longer crashes and used to, or because mutt is better insulated
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10:47:56 <jsled> yay @ http://wiki.gnucash.org/wiki/Custom_Reports
10:48:57 <hampton> jsled: ROTFL at that youtube video
10:49:25 <cstim_lunch> jsled: yeah, the video rocks
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10:55:28 <andi5> http://www.stgraber.org/?cat=5 and http://paste.stgraber.org/27 ... sounds nice
10:56:24 <jsled> interesting.
10:57:37 <jsled> I wonder how much more complex it is than 'curl --delete @topost.data [...]' :)
10:57:47 <jsled> s/--delete/--data/. geez.
10:57:55 <andi5> hehe... /me installs some other packages as well
11:01:55 <andi5> well... it is 109 lines of python code... but at least it worked out-of-the box, unlike webboard (which looks more flashy as gnome panel applet :))
11:06:08 <cstim> andi5: should I extend install.sh/custom.sh so that gwenhywfar+aqbanking (but without qt) is downloaded and installed as well?
11:06:52 <andi5> i do not know.... let me first ask you whether you could provide the qt3 hbci setup program as binary package?
11:07:03 <warlord> cstim: can one still setup AQB w/o Qt?
11:07:27 <andi5> s,hbci,aqbanking,
11:08:00 <cstim> one can always compile and install aqbanking without the qt parts; however, the usability is limited because the connection setup is much more difficult then.
11:09:25 <cstim> andi5: I was thinking of a separate aqbanking-qt-binary package; in principle this is totally possible (rpm's do that all the time), but I haven't set this up for windows so far.
11:10:43 <andi5> cstim: maybe we need some refactoring to let the install.sh user decide what he wants and what now, without modifying custom.sh? or split custom.sh somehow?
11:11:13 <warlord> andi5: maybe we need a configure script ;)
11:11:17 <warlord> Oh... Wait.. ;)
11:12:13 <andi5> meta-configure.ac.in.in
11:12:25 <warlord> LOL
11:13:49 <andi5> cstim: so basically i would say YES.. but i am unsure whether the majority of builders would want these optional components built by default
11:14:53 <cstim> I'd like to have it built by default to get more feedback on that side as well.
11:16:00 <andi5> cstim: but you have aqbanking working completely on windows?
11:16:02 <cstim> heh, and as it turns out some parts of import-export/hbci won't build on win32 in the current form :-(
11:16:54 <cstim> re aqbanking: it builds and performs correct startup/shutdown. For more testing I would have to set up a test account access, which I don't have from my windows machine :-(
11:17:13 <cstim> src/import-export/hbci/druid-hbci-initial.c:557: warning: implicit declaration of function `fork'
11:17:28 <warlord> cstim: might as well build libofx, too ;)
11:17:43 <andi5> warlord: ack
11:17:51 <andi5> from cvs?
11:18:10 <cstim> warlord: no, because libofx requires libjade and whatever else, and I haven't seen this on win32 so far.
11:18:26 <cstim> well, of course if you *can* find the dependencies on win32 then we should build it as well, yes.
11:19:50 <andi5> cstim: will you fix line 557?
11:19:56 <warlord> Okay.
11:25:01 <cstim> yes
11:25:14 <cstim> well, no
11:25:24 <andi5> yo
11:25:29 <cstim> there is no fork() on win32. Same issue as the gzip child process in io-gncxml-v2.c
11:25:48 <andi5> i know, g_spawn_* should be our friend (at least for the primer)
11:27:55 <andi5> cstim: i tried to import doc/examples/downloaded.mt940 but it does not show any transaction and prints "aqbanking(7374):swift940.c: 451: Missing bank reference ()" to the terminal
11:28:36 * andi5 needs a way to test the general import matcher
11:29:09 <cstim> to test the import matcher? Use the ofx example file in libofx
11:29:36 <andi5> ah right... i started to build with ofx only recently
11:29:57 <cstim> doc/ofx_sample_files/ofx_spec201_*
11:30:06 <cstim> in libofx
11:32:01 <andi5> ooops... why the heck do you started a thread about ofx sample files today ;-)
11:32:12 <cstim> it wasn't me
11:32:16 <andi5> you all
11:37:51 <andi5> cstim: i think we need ChangeLog entries for 2.0 :) ... but maybe one combine that with backporting whatever will happen to the general import matcher...
11:40:51 <cstim> you mean, for the back-ported changes? But we haven't been adding *any* ChangeLog entries for the last 3-4 months by now, neither to trunk nor to branch-2.0
11:42:36 <andi5> hm.... i have thought that derek added them for every change he backported... the changelog has quite some entries for december '06
11:44:29 <cstim> oh, I see - indeed he added the entries to ChangeLog although there haven't been any entries on trunk's version of ChangeLog.
11:44:41 <cstim> ok, we can continue that for the rest of the 2.0.x branch.
11:45:24 <andi5> maybe the idea is not that bad, even for backports to 2.2
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11:46:10 <andi5> major changes would then be in NEWS or whatever... (/me does not really care ;-))
11:48:33 <cstim> I'm not so sure how this can be handled. The topic should be picked up on -devel again. Last time when we discussed that, some people including myself still liked the manual ChangeLog entries, but this has now changed.
11:48:39 <cstim> libtool sucks.
11:48:44 <cstim> in case you didn't know.
11:49:36 <andi5> oh, i remember... but i rarely use ChangeLog's if i have other tools to access source history
11:49:58 <andi5> and i just do what you (all) tell me to do ;-)
11:50:23 <andi5> someone needs his room to be tidied?
11:50:33 <cstim> andi5: but not (yet) everyone has git or svk installed locally...
11:50:43 <cstim> ?
11:51:19 <jsled> what does git/svk have to do with it?
11:51:50 <andi5> yeah, i use trac more often, i think
11:51:53 <cstim> jsled: to have *fast* access to the version history
11:52:06 <jsled> Ah.
11:52:33 <jsled> I think we should only use the vc tool's logs, but somehow mark log entries that should be included in a ChangeLog.
11:52:39 <jsled> (similar to the "BP" flags)
11:55:28 <cstim> hm... doesn't sound too convincing because you cannot edit these afterwards... have to think about this.
11:56:05 <jsled> you can.
11:58:09 <jsled> `svn propedit svn:log -r ${rev} --revprop`, or something.
11:59:04 <jsled> Though, unfortunately, only a subset of us are allowed, not including you for some reason. :/
11:59:27 <andi5> cstim is not allowed to make mistakes
11:59:55 <jsled> we should probably make it an exclusion list, rather than a whitelist; or just let (all committers) do it.
12:03:59 <andi5> oh, FYI, http://lists.gnucash.org/pipermail/gnucash-devel/2005-December/014965.html (*reading*)
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12:04:53 <cstim> andi5: YES, that's what I had in mind. Did you read through all 30 messages of the thread :-)))
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12:06:55 <jsled> So someone should summarize that thread and re-open the discussion.
12:09:22 <cstim> andi5: on win32, how did you force libtool to create DLLs without version numbers?
12:09:31 <cstim> libfoo.dll instead of libfoo-123.dll ?
12:09:36 <andi5> either -module or -avoid-version
12:09:41 <cstim> ok
12:09:50 <andi5> the primer implies the second
12:10:35 <andi5> ok, that is not strictly correct, but on my two platforms i think -modules are always numberless
12:20:45 <cstim> see ya
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12:28:10 <andi5> reading through all these emacs tips back in december 2005, i really hope you all use `psvn' nowadays ;-)
12:29:19 <jsled> yeah, I think it's bundled with subversion.
12:29:51 <jsled> Though it still doesn't seem to support svn blame. :( But maybe the version included with svn-1.4 will.
12:31:28 <andi5> strangly enough, svn-status does not work anymore for me ;-) .... well, i use psvn in combination with vc-svn (as i do with git, btw) ... simply press C-x v a then
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13:22:31 <jsled> Geez, is g-wrap-1.9.7 still looking for glib-1?
13:22:59 <jsled> s/is (.*) still/\1 is still/. :(
13:24:47 <warlord> Could be..
13:25:06 <warlord> Read: It wouldn't surprise me,
13:25:07 <jsled> is it. At least now its configure failure message is specific about the version, though.
13:27:17 * jsled notes to file bugs against g-wrap (and gentoo) tomorrow.
13:27:58 <warlord> Good luck getting the bugs fixed. ;)
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15:01:59 <aphexer> warlord, sorry was away for a while
15:02:05 <aphexer> it didn't work unfortunately
15:02:11 <aphexer> i even got gnucash to crash in the meanwhile
15:02:58 <warlord> oh.. lovely
15:03:10 <aphexer> indeed
15:03:29 <aphexer> i deleted a lot, and then unposted the related invoice, then it 'hung'
15:03:46 <aphexer> gnome asked me: "the program isn't responding, do you want to kill it?:)"
15:04:08 <warlord> deleted a lot?
15:04:29 <aphexer> right clicking on accounts receivable: view lots
15:04:32 <aphexer> then select one and click delete
15:04:55 <warlord> Oh, well THAT'S a mistake!!!
15:05:08 <aphexer> could be, but that doesn't mean it should crash right?:)
15:05:22 <aphexer> please tell me, what's so bad about that?
15:05:48 <warlord> Well, what happens if you're walking across a bridge and I pull out the support beams?
15:06:07 <aphexer> i use my magical flying wings to go across?
15:06:51 <aphexer> well perhaps a warning was in place then if it were that bad :) but anyway, after restarting gnucash it seems the invoice is unposted
15:06:55 <aphexer> so i'm going to try again
15:07:13 <warlord> The real answer is that the business features assume the lots it creates are always there..
15:07:20 <warlord> Well, the Lots Viewer is new..
15:07:31 <warlord> And honestly I didn't know you could delete a lot through it.
15:07:35 <aphexer> yeah i noticed, it wasn't there before:)
15:07:42 <aphexer> lol :)
15:07:48 <aphexer> well i'll remember i shouldn't do it :)
15:08:00 <aphexer> but i do like the viewer, it gives a nice summary
15:08:26 <warlord> okay
15:08:27 <aphexer> when i edit the invoice it says at the bottom left EUR 15
15:09:34 <aphexer> and the customer is set to eur, and the account too
15:09:38 <warlord> It says "EUR", not € ??
15:10:18 <aphexer> yeah literally: 'Total: EUR 15.00'
15:11:07 <warlord> well, that means your LOCALE currency is set up improperly... I bet your LANG is en_US or something.
15:11:18 <aphexer> yeah it is, what's wrong with that?
15:11:39 <aphexer> in edit, preferences, i set everything to eur
15:12:07 <warlord> Yeah, but your locale currency is set by your locale.
15:12:20 <aphexer> that's dumb
15:12:21 <warlord> and your locale currency is used in a few places.
15:12:45 <warlord> dumb?!?
15:12:51 <aphexer> yeah it sucks actually
15:12:58 <warlord> Go complain elsewhere.
15:13:01 <aphexer> sorry:)
15:13:02 <jsled> it should default based on locale, but be settable.
15:13:05 <warlord> that's just how it works.
15:13:10 <jsled> ^- yup.
15:13:13 <aphexer> i won't complain:)
15:13:25 <aphexer> just in my opinion, it would be better if it's independent of the user locale setting
15:13:47 <warlord> in 99% of the cases (or maybe even more), the locale currency is correct.
15:13:52 <warlord> You're a (rare!) exception.
15:14:05 <aphexer> hehe:)
15:14:24 <warlord> In any event.. What happens if you just create a new invoice now?
15:14:31 <aphexer> euhm ok let's try that
15:14:44 <aphexer> btw, i read that gnucash can't "delete" an invoice.. what should i do with such one then?
15:14:53 <aphexer> everytime i ask a list of invoices it's there
15:15:40 <warlord> OH! There's another way to do it.
15:15:59 <warlord> (just looked at the code)
15:16:09 <aphexer> it works when creating a new invoice
15:16:10 <aphexer> oh tell me?:)
15:16:11 <warlord> When you have the invoice open, click "Edit".. Then click "OK"
15:16:27 <aphexer> let's try
15:16:29 <warlord> That will reset the invoice currency to the customer's (new) currency.
15:16:48 <warlord> If you want to hide an invoice, mark it Inactive. (see that little "Active" checkbox??)
15:17:14 <aphexer> oh joy it works:)
15:17:24 <aphexer> ah that's what it's for :D
15:17:29 <aphexer> ok
15:17:51 <aphexer> or i can use the "empty" invoice for the customers next one
15:18:10 <warlord> There's that, too :)
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15:18:50 <aphexer> so what was the thing with EUR instead of €?
15:18:56 <aphexer> could that cause another problem?
15:19:45 <warlord> That's your locale curency issue.
15:19:59 <warlord> it only gets a currency symbol for the locale currency.
15:20:09 <warlord> (because the currency symbol comes from the locale)
15:21:54 <aphexer> oh but i don't really require a € instead of EUR. So besides the way it prints that, it doesn't affect the way gnucash works?
15:22:49 <warlord> It will affect the GL and Stock registers.
15:23:31 <aphexer> GL?
15:24:43 <warlord> General Ledger
15:25:20 <warlord> http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=116353
15:26:36 <aphexer> ah yes ok
15:27:29 <aphexer> ok thanks for the great help ;)
15:28:20 <warlord> you're welcome.
15:43:23 <aphexer> the "profits" bar at the bottom, how is that value calculated?
15:43:42 <aphexer> could it be it's since the beginning of this year?
15:47:17 <warlord> it could.
15:47:27 <warlord> I dont know the actual algorithm i'm afriaf.
15:47:31 <warlord> afraid, even
15:59:19 <aphexer> ok
16:02:31 <jsled> yeah, it's based on the start/end of the accounting period.
16:04:55 <jsled> which is in prefs, it appears.
16:05:13 <jsled> Yeah, first tab. And defaults to start/end of the current year.
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16:19:11 <aphexer> ah there it is :) thanks again :)
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18:58:57 <minDscrm> ah jsled here as well :)
18:59:42 <jsled> heh.
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01:23:44 <dgtlmoon> greetings
01:25:03 <dgtlmoon> when i have an invoice, and im adding an item to it, should the "Income Account" point to something under my "Income:Consulting" or should it be under Assets:Account receivable ??
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05:59:51 <cstim> andi5: should I extend install.sh/custom.sh so that gwenhywfar+aqbanking (but without qt) is downloaded and installed as well?
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06:04:55 <aphexer> i just created a new invoice, posted it and gnucash already says it has been paid, how is that possible?
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06:15:04 <sykesde1> hi folks
06:15:42 <sykesde1> I've been looking to see if there was any way to import paypal data into gnucash, I can't find anything
06:15:56 <sykesde1> is there a simple way to convert csv to gnucash?
06:17:38 <cstim> sykesde1: no, not with 2.0.x. The easiest is to convert your data to qif and import that one.
06:19:10 <sykesde1> ok, is there instructions somewhere for converting paypal to qif?
06:20:52 <cstim> like this: http://wiki.gnucash.org/wiki/FAQ#Q:_My_bank_doesn.27t_offer_OCX_or_QIF_but_only_CSV_or_similar._How_can_I_import_my_statement_data.3F
06:23:24 <sykesde1> excellent!
06:23:32 <sykesde1> perl/python - ouch!
06:23:37 <sykesde1> I'm a java dude!
06:23:46 <sykesde1> I feel a sore head coming on ;)
06:23:53 <sykesde1> Thanks for the help.
06:33:53 <cstim> you're welcome.
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09:29:05 <warlord> aphexer: It's possible if you already ran a Process Payment for that customer.
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09:29:57 <warlord> Man, JUST missed him... I'm pretty sure that paypal gives you a QIF or OFX download.
09:32:34 <aphexer> warlord, it's a new customer, it's his first bill
09:34:56 <warlord> The only way it would be marked paid is if it got attached to some Lot and the Lot is 0.
09:35:19 <warlord> The only way to attach to a Lot is to post invoices and process payments.
09:36:04 <aphexer> warlord, i created the customer and the invoice some days ago, but i posted it today, if it makes a difference
09:36:06 <aphexer> what's a lot?
09:36:23 <warlord> No, that shouldn't make a difference.
09:36:35 <aphexer> is there a way to see at what time he paid?
09:36:38 <warlord> a Lot is a way to tie different transactions together: think "stocks"
09:36:49 <warlord> Run a customer report?
09:36:56 <aphexer> ah yeah let's see
09:39:42 <aphexer> the invoice is posted, however in the accounts receivable log, it's a transaction of 0$
09:39:56 <aphexer> that's probably why it says it's been paid
09:40:00 <warlord> Yep
09:40:12 <aphexer> the customer report says total due: 15$
09:40:22 <warlord> Okay, next question: Currencies..
09:40:29 <warlord> What are the currencies in use here?
09:40:56 <aphexer> oh well i thought i'd make the conversation easier by always saying $. But i'm actually using €
09:41:14 <aphexer> so he needs to pay me 15€ :)
09:41:43 <aphexer> in accounts receivable the columns funds in/out are just empty
09:41:47 <aphexer> so meaning 0€
09:42:18 <aphexer> how can it be it says 0? why did it put 0 there?
09:42:44 <warlord> Well, if you have it all configured for different currencies it could have posted wrong..
09:43:00 <aphexer> well i recently upgraded to a new version
09:43:01 <warlord> What are the Account Currencies..
09:43:17 <warlord> And what is your Locale Currency?
09:43:56 <aphexer> that's in edit->preferences->locale currency right?
09:43:59 <aphexer> it's set to usd... hm
09:44:06 <aphexer> i did set it to eur before upgrading
09:44:50 <warlord> most preferences are lost in the upgrade from 1.8 -> 2.09
09:44:54 <warlord> er, 2.0
09:45:11 <warlord> Also, locale currency would be defined by your, um, computer's set locale.
09:45:18 <warlord> what do you get from: echo $LANG
09:45:24 <aphexer> instead of choosing 'locale: usd', should i choose 'choose: eur' ?
09:45:36 <aphexer> oh yes my computer is completely set to english
09:45:37 <warlord> What's the Customer's currency? What are each of the account currencies?
09:46:18 <aphexer> the account currencies are in eur
09:46:22 <aphexer> apparantly
09:46:39 <aphexer> customer in usd
09:47:04 <aphexer> i guess that by setting all of the settings to eur will solve things?
09:48:03 <warlord> You'll need to unpost the invoice..
09:48:09 <aphexer> ok
09:48:18 <warlord> And you MAY need to ignore it and start a new one.. I forget when it pulls the customer currency.
09:48:28 <warlord> but yes, make sure everything is un EUR
09:48:28 <aphexer> ok
09:48:34 <aphexer> thanks :) i'll go do that:)
09:50:48 <warlord> :)
10:13:52 <warlord> So... Did that work?
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10:41:12 <jsled> hey hampton
10:41:24 <jsled> [ot] Pachelbel rant - http://youtube.com/watch?v=JdxkVQy7QLM
10:41:31 <hampton> morning jsled
10:42:08 <hampton> so what, this is the morning evolution dies for everyone? Its crashed on both my laptop and my desktop in the last five minutes. :-(
10:43:31 * elb_ passes out free copies of a real mailreader
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10:43:40 <jsled> such as?
10:43:45 <elb> I use mutt, myself
10:44:09 <jsled> I used to use mutt. Does it have imap header caching, yet?
10:44:32 <elb> yes and no
10:44:33 <warlord> I like Thunderbird, personally...
10:44:43 <elb> it does a pretty good job within a mailbox, but ditches everything when you change boxes
10:45:08 <jsled> sure. it practically doesn't, then.
10:45:31 <elb> right
10:45:35 <elb> it also doesn't crash ;-)
10:45:44 <elb> well, provided you don't link it against gnutls
10:45:47 <elb> which sucks ASS
10:45:55 <jsled> hampton: istm that evolution-2.8 reverted the (noticeable) memory-handling improvements in 2.6. :(
10:46:05 <elb> even then it doesn't crash any more (it used to) but it still disconnects when gnutls eats itself
10:46:32 <elb> I'm not clear if the non-crashiness is because gnutls no longer crashes and used to, or because mutt is better insulated
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10:47:56 <jsled> yay @ http://wiki.gnucash.org/wiki/Custom_Reports
10:48:57 <hampton> jsled: ROTFL at that youtube video
10:49:25 <cstim_lunch> jsled: yeah, the video rocks
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10:55:28 <andi5> http://www.stgraber.org/?cat=5 and http://paste.stgraber.org/27 ... sounds nice
10:56:24 <jsled> interesting.
10:57:37 <jsled> I wonder how much more complex it is than 'curl --delete @topost.data [...]' :)
10:57:47 <jsled> s/--delete/--data/. geez.
10:57:55 <andi5> hehe... /me installs some other packages as well
11:01:55 <andi5> well... it is 109 lines of python code... but at least it worked out-of-the box, unlike webboard (which looks more flashy as gnome panel applet :))
11:06:08 <cstim> andi5: should I extend install.sh/custom.sh so that gwenhywfar+aqbanking (but without qt) is downloaded and installed as well?
11:06:52 <andi5> i do not know.... let me first ask you whether you could provide the qt3 hbci setup program as binary package?
11:07:03 <warlord> cstim: can one still setup AQB w/o Qt?
11:07:27 <andi5> s,hbci,aqbanking,
11:08:00 <cstim> one can always compile and install aqbanking without the qt parts; however, the usability is limited because the connection setup is much more difficult then.
11:09:25 <cstim> andi5: I was thinking of a separate aqbanking-qt-binary package; in principle this is totally possible (rpm's do that all the time), but I haven't set this up for windows so far.
11:10:43 <andi5> cstim: maybe we need some refactoring to let the install.sh user decide what he wants and what now, without modifying custom.sh? or split custom.sh somehow?
11:11:13 <warlord> andi5: maybe we need a configure script ;)
11:11:17 <warlord> Oh... Wait.. ;)
11:12:13 <andi5> meta-configure.ac.in.in
11:12:25 <warlord> LOL
11:13:49 <andi5> cstim: so basically i would say YES.. but i am unsure whether the majority of builders would want these optional components built by default
11:14:53 <cstim> I'd like to have it built by default to get more feedback on that side as well.
11:16:00 <andi5> cstim: but you have aqbanking working completely on windows?
11:16:02 <cstim> heh, and as it turns out some parts of import-export/hbci won't build on win32 in the current form :-(
11:16:54 <cstim> re aqbanking: it builds and performs correct startup/shutdown. For more testing I would have to set up a test account access, which I don't have from my windows machine :-(
11:17:13 <cstim> src/import-export/hbci/druid-hbci-initial.c:557: warning: implicit declaration of function `fork'
11:17:28 <warlord> cstim: might as well build libofx, too ;)
11:17:43 <andi5> warlord: ack
11:17:51 <andi5> from cvs?
11:18:10 <cstim> warlord: no, because libofx requires libjade and whatever else, and I haven't seen this on win32 so far.
11:18:26 <cstim> well, of course if you *can* find the dependencies on win32 then we should build it as well, yes.
11:19:50 <andi5> cstim: will you fix line 557?
11:19:56 <warlord> Okay.
11:25:01 <cstim> yes
11:25:14 <cstim> well, no
11:25:24 <andi5> yo
11:25:29 <cstim> there is no fork() on win32. Same issue as the gzip child process in io-gncxml-v2.c
11:25:48 <andi5> i know, g_spawn_* should be our friend (at least for the primer)
11:27:55 <andi5> cstim: i tried to import doc/examples/downloaded.mt940 but it does not show any transaction and prints "aqbanking(7374):swift940.c: 451: Missing bank reference ()" to the terminal
11:28:36 * andi5 needs a way to test the general import matcher
11:29:09 <cstim> to test the import matcher? Use the ofx example file in libofx
11:29:36 <andi5> ah right... i started to build with ofx only recently
11:29:57 <cstim> doc/ofx_sample_files/ofx_spec201_*
11:30:06 <cstim> in libofx
11:32:01 <andi5> ooops... why the heck do you started a thread about ofx sample files today ;-)
11:32:12 <cstim> it wasn't me
11:32:16 <andi5> you all
11:37:51 <andi5> cstim: i think we need ChangeLog entries for 2.0 :) ... but maybe one combine that with backporting whatever will happen to the general import matcher...
11:40:51 <cstim> you mean, for the back-ported changes? But we haven't been adding *any* ChangeLog entries for the last 3-4 months by now, neither to trunk nor to branch-2.0
11:42:36 <andi5> hm.... i have thought that derek added them for every change he backported... the changelog has quite some entries for december '06
11:44:29 <cstim> oh, I see - indeed he added the entries to ChangeLog although there haven't been any entries on trunk's version of ChangeLog.
11:44:41 <cstim> ok, we can continue that for the rest of the 2.0.x branch.
11:45:24 <andi5> maybe the idea is not that bad, even for backports to 2.2
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11:46:10 <andi5> major changes would then be in NEWS or whatever... (/me does not really care ;-))
11:48:33 <cstim> I'm not so sure how this can be handled. The topic should be picked up on -devel again. Last time when we discussed that, some people including myself still liked the manual ChangeLog entries, but this has now changed.
11:48:39 <cstim> libtool sucks.
11:48:44 <cstim> in case you didn't know.
11:49:36 <andi5> oh, i remember... but i rarely use ChangeLog's if i have other tools to access source history
11:49:58 <andi5> and i just do what you (all) tell me to do ;-)
11:50:23 <andi5> someone needs his room to be tidied?
11:50:33 <cstim> andi5: but not (yet) everyone has git or svk installed locally...
11:50:43 <cstim> ?
11:51:19 <jsled> what does git/svk have to do with it?
11:51:50 <andi5> yeah, i use trac more often, i think
11:51:53 <cstim> jsled: to have *fast* access to the version history
11:52:06 <jsled> Ah.
11:52:33 <jsled> I think we should only use the vc tool's logs, but somehow mark log entries that should be included in a ChangeLog.
11:52:39 <jsled> (similar to the "BP" flags)
11:55:28 <cstim> hm... doesn't sound too convincing because you cannot edit these afterwards... have to think about this.
11:56:05 <jsled> you can.
11:58:09 <jsled> `svn propedit svn:log -r ${rev} --revprop`, or something.
11:59:04 <jsled> Though, unfortunately, only a subset of us are allowed, not including you for some reason. :/
11:59:27 <andi5> cstim is not allowed to make mistakes
11:59:55 <jsled> we should probably make it an exclusion list, rather than a whitelist; or just let (all committers) do it.
12:03:59 <andi5> oh, FYI, http://lists.gnucash.org/pipermail/gnucash-devel/2005-December/014965.html (*reading*)
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12:04:53 <cstim> andi5: YES, that's what I had in mind. Did you read through all 30 messages of the thread :-)))
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12:06:55 <jsled> So someone should summarize that thread and re-open the discussion.
12:09:22 <cstim> andi5: on win32, how did you force libtool to create DLLs without version numbers?
12:09:31 <cstim> libfoo.dll instead of libfoo-123.dll ?
12:09:36 <andi5> either -module or -avoid-version
12:09:41 <cstim> ok
12:09:50 <andi5> the primer implies the second
12:10:35 <andi5> ok, that is not strictly correct, but on my two platforms i think -modules are always numberless
12:20:45 <cstim> see ya
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12:28:10 <andi5> reading through all these emacs tips back in december 2005, i really hope you all use `psvn' nowadays ;-)
12:29:19 <jsled> yeah, I think it's bundled with subversion.
12:29:51 <jsled> Though it still doesn't seem to support svn blame. :( But maybe the version included with svn-1.4 will.
12:31:28 <andi5> strangly enough, svn-status does not work anymore for me ;-) .... well, i use psvn in combination with vc-svn (as i do with git, btw) ... simply press C-x v a then
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13:22:31 <jsled> Geez, is g-wrap-1.9.7 still looking for glib-1?
13:22:59 <jsled> s/is (.*) still/\1 is still/. :(
13:24:47 <warlord> Could be..
13:25:06 <warlord> Read: It wouldn't surprise me,
13:25:07 <jsled> is it. At least now its configure failure message is specific about the version, though.
13:27:17 * jsled notes to file bugs against g-wrap (and gentoo) tomorrow.
13:27:58 <warlord> Good luck getting the bugs fixed. ;)
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15:01:59 <aphexer> warlord, sorry was away for a while
15:02:05 <aphexer> it didn't work unfortunately
15:02:11 <aphexer> i even got gnucash to crash in the meanwhile
15:02:58 <warlord> oh.. lovely
15:03:10 <aphexer> indeed
15:03:29 <aphexer> i deleted a lot, and then unposted the related invoice, then it 'hung'
15:03:46 <aphexer> gnome asked me: "the program isn't responding, do you want to kill it?:)"
15:04:08 <warlord> deleted a lot?
15:04:29 <aphexer> right clicking on accounts receivable: view lots
15:04:32 <aphexer> then select one and click delete
15:04:55 <warlord> Oh, well THAT'S a mistake!!!
15:05:08 <aphexer> could be, but that doesn't mean it should crash right?:)
15:05:22 <aphexer> please tell me, what's so bad about that?
15:05:48 <warlord> Well, what happens if you're walking across a bridge and I pull out the support beams?
15:06:07 <aphexer> i use my magical flying wings to go across?
15:06:51 <aphexer> well perhaps a warning was in place then if it were that bad :) but anyway, after restarting gnucash it seems the invoice is unposted
15:06:55 <aphexer> so i'm going to try again
15:07:13 <warlord> The real answer is that the business features assume the lots it creates are always there..
15:07:20 <warlord> Well, the Lots Viewer is new..
15:07:31 <warlord> And honestly I didn't know you could delete a lot through it.
15:07:35 <aphexer> yeah i noticed, it wasn't there before:)
15:07:42 <aphexer> lol :)
15:07:48 <aphexer> well i'll remember i shouldn't do it :)
15:08:00 <aphexer> but i do like the viewer, it gives a nice summary
15:08:26 <warlord> okay
15:08:27 <aphexer> when i edit the invoice it says at the bottom left EUR 15
15:09:34 <aphexer> and the customer is set to eur, and the account too
15:09:38 <warlord> It says "EUR", not € ??
15:10:18 <aphexer> yeah literally: 'Total: EUR 15.00'
15:11:07 <warlord> well, that means your LOCALE currency is set up improperly... I bet your LANG is en_US or something.
15:11:18 <aphexer> yeah it is, what's wrong with that?
15:11:39 <aphexer> in edit, preferences, i set everything to eur
15:12:07 <warlord> Yeah, but your locale currency is set by your locale.
15:12:20 <aphexer> that's dumb
15:12:21 <warlord> and your locale currency is used in a few places.
15:12:45 <warlord> dumb?!?
15:12:51 <aphexer> yeah it sucks actually
15:12:58 <warlord> Go complain elsewhere.
15:13:01 <aphexer> sorry:)
15:13:02 <jsled> it should default based on locale, but be settable.
15:13:05 <warlord> that's just how it works.
15:13:10 <jsled> ^- yup.
15:13:13 <aphexer> i won't complain:)
15:13:25 <aphexer> just in my opinion, it would be better if it's independent of the user locale setting
15:13:47 <warlord> in 99% of the cases (or maybe even more), the locale currency is correct.
15:13:52 <warlord> You're a (rare!) exception.
15:14:05 <aphexer> hehe:)
15:14:24 <warlord> In any event.. What happens if you just create a new invoice now?
15:14:31 <aphexer> euhm ok let's try that
15:14:44 <aphexer> btw, i read that gnucash can't "delete" an invoice.. what should i do with such one then?
15:14:53 <aphexer> everytime i ask a list of invoices it's there
15:15:40 <warlord> OH! There's another way to do it.
15:15:59 <warlord> (just looked at the code)
15:16:09 <aphexer> it works when creating a new invoice
15:16:10 <aphexer> oh tell me?:)
15:16:11 <warlord> When you have the invoice open, click "Edit".. Then click "OK"
15:16:27 <aphexer> let's try
15:16:29 <warlord> That will reset the invoice currency to the customer's (new) currency.
15:16:48 <warlord> If you want to hide an invoice, mark it Inactive. (see that little "Active" checkbox??)
15:17:14 <aphexer> oh joy it works:)
15:17:24 <aphexer> ah that's what it's for :D
15:17:29 <aphexer> ok
15:17:51 <aphexer> or i can use the "empty" invoice for the customers next one
15:18:10 <warlord> There's that, too :)
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15:18:50 <aphexer> so what was the thing with EUR instead of €?
15:18:56 <aphexer> could that cause another problem?
15:19:45 <warlord> That's your locale curency issue.
15:19:59 <warlord> it only gets a currency symbol for the locale currency.
15:20:09 <warlord> (because the currency symbol comes from the locale)
15:21:54 <aphexer> oh but i don't really require a € instead of EUR. So besides the way it prints that, it doesn't affect the way gnucash works?
15:22:49 <warlord> It will affect the GL and Stock registers.
15:23:31 <aphexer> GL?
15:24:43 <warlord> General Ledger
15:25:20 <warlord> http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=116353
15:26:36 <aphexer> ah yes ok
15:27:29 <aphexer> ok thanks for the great help ;)
15:28:20 <warlord> you're welcome.
15:43:23 <aphexer> the "profits" bar at the bottom, how is that value calculated?
15:43:42 <aphexer> could it be it's since the beginning of this year?
15:47:17 <warlord> it could.
15:47:27 <warlord> I dont know the actual algorithm i'm afriaf.
15:47:31 <warlord> afraid, even
15:59:19 <aphexer> ok
16:02:31 <jsled> yeah, it's based on the start/end of the accounting period.
16:04:55 <jsled> which is in prefs, it appears.
16:05:13 <jsled> Yeah, first tab. And defaults to start/end of the current year.
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16:19:11 <aphexer> ah there it is :) thanks again :)
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18:58:57 <minDscrm> ah jsled here as well :)
18:59:42 <jsled> heh.
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