2007-08-03 GnuCash IRC logs
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00:52:51 <AltiusBim1> is there a method for adding custom currencies to GnuCash?
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00:55:16 <warlord> AltiusBim1: not per se, no. why would you need a custom currency as opposed to some other type of security/commodity?
00:55:34 <warlord> (the currency list is built into the application)
00:55:50 <AltiusBim1> ahha! those might just be the answers to my question
00:59:31 <AltiusBim1> warlord: I could edit the list sure, but what about the comodity thing...can I have an account denominated in say...milligrams of palladium or Chuck E. Cheese Tokens?
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01:04:27 <warlord> AltiusBim1: sure, an account of type Stock or Mututal.
01:04:46 <AltiusBim1> warlord: excellent! thanks
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01:06:58 <warlord> you're welcome.
01:07:20 <AltiusBim1> warlord: it would seem I have to pretend the currency is on a real-life stock exchange though :)
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01:07:52 <AltiusBim1> warlord: oh, it looks like I can choose the exchange name too that's good :)
01:08:02 <warlord> Yep
01:08:41 <AltiusBim1> warlord: "yep" to the real-life exchange, since I seem to be mistaken about custom-named exchanges
01:09:01 <AltiusBim1> warlord: oh, but the type "FUND" is probably just a generic
01:09:34 <warlord> Actually, you can type in any exchange name
01:10:09 <AltiusBim1> I can type it but it doesn't stay in the textbox
01:10:26 <warlord> What version of gnucash?
01:12:09 <AltiusBim1> 2.2.0
01:12:21 <warlord> Hmm....
01:12:54 <warlord> let me test/verify
01:13:14 <AltiusBim1> sure, thanks :D
01:14:52 <AltiusBim1> warlord: (when I start to click on New, it replaces Type with "AMEX")
01:16:01 <warlord> Works fine for me.
01:16:23 <warlord> When I'm in the "New Security" dialog, I can type in whatever I want and it sticks just fine.
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01:27:55 <AltiusBim1> warlord: odd, I can only find the "Select security" dialog box
01:28:19 <warlord> Notice the "New" button?
01:28:45 <AltiusBim1> it's when I click on the New button that the Exchange reverts to "AMEX"
01:29:21 <AltiusBim1> OHHH
01:29:27 <warlord> Right.. and then you can enter what you want.
01:29:28 <AltiusBim1> it's backward!
01:29:35 <warlord> backward?
01:29:48 <AltiusBim1> I have to click on New *before* I start entering information
01:29:50 <AltiusBim1> xD
01:30:11 <AltiusBim1> I expected I was suppoed to enter the information then click on New to save it
01:30:24 <AltiusBim1> I guess that fixes it ^.^
01:30:48 <warlord> well, if you want to create a new security, yeah..
01:31:04 <warlord> you were on the 'select' page, not the 'new' page.
01:31:19 <warlord> Note that it should reset ALL the information you entered, not just the namespace.
01:31:20 <AltiusBim1> that's right
01:31:34 <AltiusBim1> right, but I never quite got that far :P
01:31:45 <warlord> * SIGHS *
01:31:49 <AltiusBim1> heheh
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01:43:12 <AltiusBim1> suggested feature: rename "New" to "New..."
01:44:10 <AltiusBim1> the lack of an ellipsis made me not expect a dialog box upon clicking on that button
01:44:46 <warlord> I'm not sure what the HIG says about that.
01:45:16 <warlord> Well, in Tools -> Security the label is "Add"
01:46:18 <warlord> Still, not sure why you'd think that only namespace and name are all you'd need to enter for a new commodity!
01:47:18 <AltiusBim1> probably due to my continual underestimating of what GnuCash is capable of :)
01:48:01 <warlord> heh
01:48:56 <AltiusBim1> ^^; nevertheless, every interface tradition I've ever seen uses "..." to represent commands which launch another dialog box when invoked
01:50:16 <warlord> Um, sorry to burst your bubble but there are LOTS of interfaces that DONT use elipses to indicate "popping up another dialog"
01:50:29 <warlord> it's nowhere near standard.
01:50:43 <warlord> You should go read the HIG and see what it has to say on the subject.
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01:51:00 <AltiusBim1> I'll take a look :)
01:51:53 <warlord> If the HIG is clear that the current interface is wrong then please file a bug report.
01:52:08 <AltiusBim1> it seems rather clear to me! http://www.google.com/custom?hl=en&cof=&domains=developer.gnome.org&q=ellipsis&btnG=Search&sitesearch=developer.gnome.org
01:52:26 <AltiusBim1> "Use an ellipsis (...) at the end of the label if the action requires further input from"
01:52:37 <warlord> AltiusBim1: "FURTHER input"
01:52:51 <AltiusBim1> yes...
01:52:52 <warlord> This isn't further input. It's not a continuation.
01:53:14 <unstable> If I use commercebank ( commerceonline.com ), can GNUCash hook up to that at all?
01:54:10 <warlord> unstable: Um, I dunno. check the wiki and follow the links and see if there's an OFX server URL available.
01:54:23 <AltiusBim1> warlord: debateable, but regardless—the lack of an ellipsis implies to my mind that the "New" button means "create a new stock using the entered information"
01:55:12 <warlord> AltiusBim1: that interface has been that way for nearly a decade and nobody else has complained about it.
01:55:29 <AltiusBim1> warlod: really? that's quite remarkable!
01:55:42 <warlord> I'm pretty sure, yes.
01:55:52 <warlord> hampton could answer for sure.
01:56:24 <warlord> but the point is that elipses are used when there is MORE to do in addition to the current page, not just to say that it pops up another dialog.
01:56:58 <AltiusBim1> well there are certainly many more and important options brought up by the New button
01:57:51 <AltiusBim1> I suppose it would be possible to create a new stock using only the Type and Security, but it wouldn't function well without a symbol
01:58:08 <AltiusBim1> *Symbol
01:58:27 <unstable> warlord: I searched the wiki for "commerce" and nothing came up.
01:58:48 <warlord> unstable: well, yeah, that's not what you should be searching for. the wiki has links off to OFX resources.
01:59:15 <unstable> I searched "OFX" and nothing came up
02:00:32 <warlord> unstable: we have multiple pages on OFX on the wiki
02:01:45 <unstable> Is something wrong with the search?
02:02:05 <unstable> bleh
02:02:07 * unstable just uses google
02:02:14 <unstable> OFX site:wiki.gnucash.org
02:02:25 <AltiusBim1> warlord: if I didn't have a life I would conduct a psychological survey to get people's impressions when they see a "New" button
02:02:32 <unstable> http://wiki.gnucash.org/wiki/OFX_Direct_Connect_Bank_Settings
02:03:23 <warlord> unstable: exactly. read that page.
02:03:32 <unstable> yea, nothing listed for COmmerce. o well
02:03:34 <warlord> AltiusBim1: neither do we.
02:03:39 <warlord> unstable: READ THE WHOLE PAGE
02:04:59 <AltiusBim1> warlord: HAHAHA!—I was expecting you would be the one to laugh...excellent response :D
02:05:43 <warlord> :-D
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02:32:04 <AltiusBim1> am I correct in assessing that when I sell shares I should list it as a negative number of shares?
02:33:07 <warlord> yes. and then you need to manually account for the cap gains/loss.
02:34:37 <AltiusBim1> thanks
02:44:21 <warlord> okay, bedtime for me. good night.
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02:44:35 <AltiusBim1> warlord: good night :)
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12:01:20 <pder> i am trying to delete all of my gnucash settings and start over. i have deleted $HOME/.gnucash, $HOME/.gnome/GnuCash and $HOME/.gnome/accels/GnuCash, but gnucash still seems to want to open my last accounts file. what else do i need to delete?
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12:02:07 <jsled> The gconf settings tree /apps/gnucash/, probably.
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12:26:58 <CashCow> There is a serious bug in GNUCash. I want to confirm that this isn't known before reporting.
12:27:30 <CashCow> This is the Win32 port of GnuCash 2.20.
12:27:56 <jsled> (It's 2.2.0.)
12:27:58 <jsled> What's the bug?
12:28:13 <CashCow> After installing GnuCash using the gnucash-2.2.0.exe installer on Windows XP SP2 as Administrator, the software does not work.
12:28:28 <CashCow> I have tried on different machines and fresh installs to confirm this.
12:28:48 <CashCow> Even on a fresh install on Windows XP SP2.
12:28:50 <jsled> Yeah, we've heard both that it does and doesn't work, but we've heard more of the later.
12:29:43 <CashCow> gnucash-bin.exe is running in the task manager, but it never starts.
12:30:06 <jsled> That's symptomatic as well.
12:30:11 <CashCow> This is strange, because the first time I used the same version on a Windows XP SP2 machine, it worked. Not sure what is going on.
12:30:40 <CashCow> I hope this can be resolved. I know Windows is probably not priority, though.
12:30:45 <jsled> Well, if you're inclined/skilled/&c, it'd be great if you could help track it down.
12:31:16 <CashCow> Well, I primarily to software development on Linux and *BSD.
12:31:34 <CashCow> I guess I could use MinGW and get the source for gnucash.
12:31:45 <jsled> The developers primarily responsible for the windows port are indisposed, recently.
12:31:59 <CashCow> Indisposed?
12:32:15 <jsled> Well, "unavailable" is more direct.
12:32:16 <CashCow> Away?
12:32:18 <CashCow> Oh.
12:32:37 <jsled> In any case, I'm not sure if they saw these troubles beforehand, themselves.
12:32:56 <CashCow> I don't have time to do it today. But Sunday I could try my hand at debugging the problem. ;)
12:33:00 <warlord> I dont think they see this trouble now, either.
12:33:09 <warlord> cstim claims that it's always worked for him
12:33:36 <warlord> CashCow: some of the things to look into: admin rights; firewall; gconf file permissions
12:33:42 <CashCow> It must have something to do with Windows XP's interaction with gconf.
12:33:50 <CashCow> Hmm.
12:34:02 <jsled> CashCow: any help would be appreciated. There's some more details on the -user mailing list in particular.
12:34:12 <CashCow> Has this also happened on Windows 2000?
12:34:17 <jsled> Also, http://wiki.gnucash.org/wiki/Windows if you haven't seen it.
12:34:23 <CashCow> Okay.
12:34:27 <warlord> I dont believe it's happened on 2k
12:34:39 <CashCow> Hmm.
12:34:47 * jsled goes afk to get some lunch. biab.
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12:52:25 <[0x100]> When you are using a 2-line register, is the second line considered the "memo" line?
12:53:03 <warlord> I dont think there's a specific name for it.
12:53:25 <[0x100]> what line does "memo" refer to when you tell it to print that in reports? is it this line?
12:53:56 <[0x100]> the reason i'm asking is because most of my transactions are not split and i record "extra" information on this line
12:53:57 <warlord> Nope, the "memo" is from the Split when you expand the transaction.
12:54:12 <[0x100]> however, when i split a transaction, i have to record it next to the split amounts
12:54:14 <warlord> What you see in the double-line mode is the transaction notes.
12:54:32 <[0x100]> but when i run a report and tell it to print the memo fields, it only prints the ones from the split entries, not the non-split entries
12:54:44 <[0x100]> ah
12:55:09 <[0x100]> i wish i could get to the memo field in 2-line mode easily :(
12:55:37 <warlord> Sure you can, just click the "split" button to expand the transaction.
12:56:14 <[0x100]> it's faster to enter info in non-split mode
12:56:25 <[0x100]> but yeah, i can do that in the future
12:57:06 <warlord> Well, like I said, the 'memo' is part of the splits, not part of the transaction.
12:57:21 <[0x100]> yeah, i didn't understand that before
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15:14:06 <AltiusBimm> what's "meta-ask"? ("just ask and *wait^" seems to be what I automatically do, I'm guessing "meta-ask" means continuing to talk in hopes that the noise will get someone's attention)
15:14:56 <warlord> AltiusBimm: no, 'meta-ask' means asking "can I ask a question?"
15:15:30 <AltiusBimm> warlord: LOL, well I certainly wouldn't do that! ;)
15:15:39 <warlord> Lots of people do
15:15:49 <warlord> Or they half-ask their question
15:16:11 <AltiusBimm> it sounds like the type of behavior people often call "n00bish"
15:16:20 <warlord> Like, "I have a problem. Can anyone help me?" *waits*
15:16:27 <AltiusBimm> ohh
15:16:33 <AltiusBimm> well that borders on logical
15:17:03 <AltiusBimm> but that would be more like a chat room than an IRC channel about a technical subject
15:17:08 <warlord> Yeah, but *WE* have no idea what the problem is, so our next question is always going to be "what's the problem?" and, well, it's just easier if they say it outright.
15:17:32 <AltiusBimm> that's good, and I agree :)
15:18:30 <warlord> also, most of us are in the USA, so we tend to keep US "day" hours. Some people come in at 3am US/ET and expect a response, but most of us are asleep then
15:18:43 <AltiusBimm> good point
15:19:59 <warlord> Most of this is on http://wiki.gnucash.org/wiki/IRC
15:20:06 <warlord> (and if it's not, it should be)
15:23:37 <AltiusBimm> ahha, well I only asked because the term was in the Topic and I couldn't find any reference to it on the web
15:24:46 <AltiusBimm> new query: I seem to be running into problems with downloading my transaction histories from my banks' websites into GnuCash. Namely, when I download transaction histories from two accounts between which I often transfer funds, there end up being many duplicate copies of the transactions (since both banks list the transaction)
15:25:29 <warlord> AltiusBimm: Please read the logs. this was discussed (with YOU even, IIRC) fairly recently.
15:26:11 <AltiusBimm> haha, are you refering to the situation with "Imbalance"?
15:26:40 <warlord> No.
15:26:52 <AltiusBimm> I'll review the logs then
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15:32:02 <warlord> Hmm.. maybe I'm misremembering.
15:33:56 <AltiusBimm> it would seem so
15:34:19 <AltiusBimm> I can't find any reference to this specific concern
15:34:32 <warlord> Huh, maybe I dreamed it.. WEIRD.
15:34:44 <warlord> But I distinctly remember seeing this question recently.
15:34:56 <AltiusBimm> HAHAHA! I must be making quite an impression :P
15:34:57 <AltiusBimm> ah
15:35:13 <AltiusBimm> the documentation section on Split Transactions seems almost relavent
15:35:20 <warlord> ANyways, the answer is that it's unclear if gnucash can properly handle duplicate matching one transaction against two ofx imports from different sources.
15:35:43 <AltiusBimm> that's about where I stand too
15:35:52 <AltiusBimm> "unclear" is a good way to put it
15:35:54 <warlord> IN particular, gnucash tries to save the OFX Transaction ID, but I dont think it can save two TXNIDs into the same txn
15:36:08 <AltiusBimm> ahha
15:36:21 <warlord> Having said that, the importer SHOULD let you manually map the import txn to the existing txn.
15:37:03 <warlord> But then when you go back to the other side again it'll think it's another duplicate and make you mannually map it, again, because the txnid will get overwritten.
15:37:12 <warlord> at least, that's how i think it will work.
15:37:19 <warlord> I dont know. I dont use OFX.
15:37:33 <AltiusBimm> neither do I, my banks provide QIF
15:38:39 <warlord> Oh, then why not use the QIF importer?
15:38:46 <warlord> Why are you even ASKING about OFX?
15:38:47 <AltiusBimm> but regardless, the importer does not seem to list all transactions, so even if I wanted to risk doing all those edits in a non-saveable dialog box, I don't think it would let me
15:38:55 <AltiusBimm> I'm not......
15:39:16 <AltiusBimm> " seem to be running into problems with downloading my transaction histories from my banks' websites into GnuCash."
15:39:38 <AltiusBimm> I hadn't said at that point what format it was
15:40:22 <warlord> OH.. Well, then, ignore everything I just said. It only applies to OFX.
15:40:27 <warlord> QIF import is ALL manual.
15:40:29 <warlord> 100%
15:40:57 <AltiusBimm> ohhh
15:41:31 <AltiusBimm> well I think I'm up to the chalenge, but I don't know what needs to be done
15:42:11 <warlord> For every transaction in the list in the LHS, click on the txn and then click on the txn on the RHS that's its duplicate.
15:42:12 <AltiusBimm> to link the disconnected transactions on both sides
15:43:30 <warlord> "disconnected"?
15:43:45 <AltiusBimm> I mean they aren't associated with each other
15:43:56 <AltiusBimm> they have the same ammounts but not exactly the same descriptions
15:44:15 <warlord> The duplicate matcher shouldn't care about the descriptions.
15:44:19 <AltiusBimm> how do I make GnuCash recognize that one is simply the other end of the other?
15:44:22 <AltiusBimm> hmm
15:44:36 <warlord> Choose it as a duplicate.
15:44:52 <warlord> (which means you have to have already pointed them to the right places)
15:44:52 <AltiusBimm> so I have to give up half my descriptions?
15:45:59 <warlord> Yes.
15:46:02 <AltiusBimm> ahha
15:46:30 <AltiusBimm> well thanks, at least I know what must be sacrificed :)
15:49:49 <warlord> Yeah, duplicate checking is always lossy.
15:49:57 <warlord> you have to throw something away
15:50:28 <warlord> note it's only really an issue when transfering between assets and liabilities. MOST transactions are income/expense transactions where you wont get a secondary qif.
15:51:18 <AltiusBimm> that's true, that's probably why the system hasn't been developed to the point that it can realize when a transaction is simply the same transaction from another point of view
15:51:54 <warlord> It does a fairly decent job of guessing.
15:52:11 <warlord> but it still wants to make sure its right.
15:53:11 <AltiusBimm> hmm, I guess the problem is I can't find it lol
15:53:24 <AltiusBimm> I mean, the duplicate checker for existing accounts
15:53:28 <warlord> Or gnucash doesn't think it's a duplicate.
15:53:35 <warlord> The checker is part of the qif importer.
15:53:46 <AltiusBimm> oh...that's the only one I know of
15:53:51 <warlord> The page is labeled "Match Duplicates"
15:53:59 <warlord> (i think)
15:54:11 <AltiusBimm> that's a bit of a problem because I can't save my progress and resume later when using the QIF importer
15:54:57 <jsled> why would you need to?
15:55:21 <AltiusBimm> what if I have hundreds of transactions?
15:55:48 <AltiusBimm> it could take hours if a person has too many transactions
15:56:01 <jsled> then start it when you have time to do it.
15:56:10 <AltiusBimm> >.<
15:56:32 <jsled> Nevermind. You're right. It would be better if it was arbitrarily stop/start-able.
15:56:48 <AltiusBimm> jsled: thank you
15:57:02 <jsled> I'm not sure how much of a "problem" it is, though.
15:57:28 <AltiusBimm> well let me put it this way, without hibernate mode, it would make life miserable for people who have huge accounts
15:57:42 <jsled> In most cases, the number of transactions is small... a months worth of transactions.
15:58:05 <AltiusBimm> jsled: that can still be a large number of transactions
15:58:50 <AltiusBimm> and worse, I don't think the importer lists all transactions visually
15:58:55 <warlord> Even if it's 100 transactions, that's not a huge time overhead.
15:59:16 <warlord> It only lists txns that actually have matches. It doesn't want to waste your time.
15:59:31 <AltiusBimm> it could be 10,000—the number can't be predicted
15:59:42 <AltiusBimm> ohh, maybe that's why the list seemd short
15:59:49 <warlord> Anyone with 10,000 transactions per month shouldn't be using gnucash.
16:00:00 <AltiusBimm> is the duplicate checker looking at existing accounts as well as the contense of the QIFs ?
16:00:40 <AltiusBimm> warlord: I fortunatly don't have that many, but what would you suggest then? Quicken? or some even higher program?
16:01:14 <AltiusBimm> (my question about the checker is more on-topic)
16:01:50 <warlord> That question is imprecise, so let me answer the question I THINK you're asking. I think you're asking, "does the importer look at both the to-be-imported- AND existing- transactions when trying to find duplicate to-be-imported transactions" and the answer is NO. It only compares the to-be-imported to the already-existing. At least that's what it's SUPPOSED to do.
16:02:28 <warlord> Someone who's got 10,000 txns per month is probably better off with a more enterprise-level accounting system, like GnuE or something.
16:02:50 <AltiusBimm> then is there any method for dealing with more than one bank?
16:02:50 <warlord> 10k/mo is over 300 txns a day.
16:03:13 <AltiusBimm> lol
16:03:32 <warlord> what kind of question is that?
16:03:41 <AltiusBimm> which one?
16:03:49 <warlord> Your most recent one.
16:04:55 <jsled> AltiusBimm: "deal" how?
16:05:35 <AltiusBimm> deal means eliminate, in this context (I'm writing a longer example for you)
16:06:24 <AltiusBimm> ah, I mean, when I import the QIFs from one bank, no duplicates are found because there are none in the QIFs, then when I import QIFs from another bank, no duplicates are found because there are none in the QIFs for that bank either...but there are now many duplicates in my GnuCash files because both banks have their own copies of all transactions which occurred between them
16:06:36 <AltiusBimm> (that was my example)
16:07:03 <warlord> Then you're not mapping the qif accounts properly to gnucash accounts.
16:07:39 <warlord> Let me give you an example. (lots of typing to come... be patient)
16:07:42 <AltiusBimm> meaning I have to set the correct "Transfer"s? I'm doing that
16:07:43 <AltiusBimm> sure
16:08:53 <warlord> let's say you get foo.qif and bar.qif, from two banks. the importer will call these "qif accounts" "foo" and "bar". in 'foo.qif' you have a transfer to bar.. and in bar.qif you have a transfer from foo.
16:09:17 <AltiusBimm> right!
16:09:45 <warlord> now, the importer is going to do a few things. first, it's going to try to map the qif account names, "foo" and "bar" to GnuCash account names, "Assets:Bank:Foo:Checking" and "Assets:Bank:Bar:Savings"
16:10:07 <warlord> you need to make these mappings yourself, manually, for each import.. And you have to be consistent.
16:10:36 <warlord> next, it tries to map QIF Categories to GnuCash Income/Expense accounts..
16:10:47 <AltiusBimm> (are you indicating that I must import both foo.qif and bar.qif at the same time?)
16:10:56 <warlord> Then if all else fails it tries to use the Payee/Memo.
16:11:04 <warlord> no
16:11:07 <AltiusBimm> good
16:11:33 <warlord> Okay, so you import foo.qif and get your transaction from A:B:F:C -> A:B:B:S
16:12:27 <AltiusBimm> that notation is slightly confusing
16:12:43 <warlord> Next, you import bar.qif, go through the same mapping, and then when it goes through the duplicate checking it will notice "hey, I've got a $100 transaction from A:B:F:C -> A:B:B:S, and that matches this $100 transaction here. Maybe it's the same". And it will display that in the duplicate matcher.
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16:13:27 <warlord> Then in the matcher you have to tell the importer "yep, that's a duplicate. "
16:13:59 <warlord> At least, that's how it's SUPPOSED to work. Sometimes, however, it's not quite so easy.
16:14:41 <warlord> For example, NetBank's qif isn't quite right. It doesn't really tell the difference between inter-account transfers and real income/expense. So I have to manually massage the qif file before I import it.
16:15:06 <AltiusBimm> using what program?
16:15:40 <AltiusBimm> (I think this does get back to the possibility that I am not mapping the accounts correctly)
16:16:01 <AltiusBimm> (I should probably delete my bank accoutns in GnuCash and try again)
16:16:02 <warlord> I wrote a perl script.
16:16:22 <AltiusBimm> (or at least try again in a different file)
16:16:38 <warlord> "manually massage" means you have to do it manually, outside gnucash, using whatever tool you want to use.
16:17:01 <AltiusBimm> are you saying QIF files are in plain text?
16:17:08 <warlord> Of course they are!
16:17:30 <warlord> you didn't even bother to look?
16:17:30 <AltiusBimm> wow, I would have expected less from a closed-source company like Intuit
16:17:41 <AltiusBimm> (8/3/2007 1:17:31 PM) AltiusBimm: wow, I would have expected less from a closed-source company like Intuit
16:17:59 <warlord> well, they are text, but there's no real standardization to them, so different places generate slightly different QIF.
16:18:05 <AltiusBimm> ahha
16:18:16 <warlord> hense all the problems.
16:18:37 <AltiusBimm> I assumed they were binary since the standard was created for Intuit Quicken
16:19:10 <warlord> Never assume.
16:19:17 <AltiusBimm> indeed
16:19:34 <AltiusBimm> well that's good news :)
16:19:36 <jsled> `file` is your friend... if only to tell you if it's worth opening the thing in a text editor or via `less`.
16:19:53 <AltiusBimm> hehhe
16:19:58 <jsled> (though less has been getting really good about handling terminal-corrupting binaries)
16:21:48 <AltiusBimm> well Konqueror almost always tells me when a file contains text, but Windows Explorer does not
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16:23:09 <warlord> windows only cares about the filename extension.
16:23:35 <AltiusBimm> yup
16:23:50 <AltiusBimm> and considering it's propensity for malware that's probably a good thing ;)
16:24:07 <AltiusBimm> *its
16:24:27 <AltiusBimm> i.e. scanning the content of a file could be bad for one's health in Windows heh
16:24:37 <AltiusBimm> without an auto-scanning virus scanner
16:34:56 <AltiusBimm> AHHA! I think I got it :D I have to make sure that all applicable transactions in bar.qif have already been marked as going to/coming from the account created from foo.qif
16:35:16 <AltiusBimm> before importing bar.qif
16:35:18 <warlord> "account created from"?
16:35:35 <warlord> It sounds like you're not properly mapping accounts in the qif importer.
16:36:10 <AltiusBimm> probably, but I don't want to, I'll let you know how my further tests go, but so far I seem to have figured out what appears to work
16:36:25 <warlord> "I dont want to"?
16:36:42 <AltiusBimm> I don't want do the mapping at import-time
16:36:57 <AltiusBimm> that dialog-box interface is poor
16:36:58 <warlord> why not? you're causing yourself all this pain later as a result.
16:37:13 <warlord> the importer remembers your mappings.
16:37:16 <AltiusBimm> maybe I don't understand what you mean by mapping
16:37:20 <warlord> so subsequent imports are much easier.
16:37:45 <warlord> "foo" -> "Assets:Bank:Foo:Checking", ...
16:37:59 <AltiusBimm> but doesn't mapping after importing have the same effect? as long as I finish with one account before importing another
16:38:02 <warlord> mapping qif accounts to gnucash accounts; qif categories to gnucahs accounts, and then payee/memos to gnucash accounts.
16:38:24 <warlord> Nope, mapping after importing does NOT have the same effect, because the importer wont remember those mappings for future imports.
16:38:27 <AltiusBimm> I'm talking about "payee/memos to gnucash accounts."
16:38:47 <AltiusBimm> hmm
16:38:53 <AltiusBimm> I'm talking about "payee/memos to gnucash accounts."
16:38:53 <warlord> It doesn't really matter if you only plan to import once. But if you import from the same place (e.g. bank) multiple times... you DEFINITELY want to map it in the importer.
16:39:04 <warlord> So you've said.. twice now.
16:39:34 <AltiusBimm> (I repeated it because I didn't want the "hmm" to appear to negate the remark)
16:39:47 <warlord> it didnt.
16:39:51 <AltiusBimm> ah good
16:39:58 <warlord> it appeared to be a response to my "nope"..
16:40:16 <AltiusBimm> yup :)
16:40:33 <AltiusBimm> my point is there are three kinds of mapping
16:40:42 <AltiusBimm> account, category, and transfer
16:40:53 <warlord> yes.....
16:41:08 <AltiusBimm> I'm only complaining about the idea of doing the transfer mapping in the wizard
16:41:19 <AltiusBimm> the other's I'm fine with, but I'm not quite sure if I'm doing them rigt
16:41:21 <AltiusBimm> *right
16:42:22 <warlord> well, if you DONT do it in the druid, then the druid wont remember them for next time. But if you map the payee "Kroger" to "Expenses:Groceries" in the druid, then the next time you import the same qif account, the druid will remember that mapping for you.
16:42:45 <warlord> (i'll note that this is all documented in the wonderful gnucash documentation)
16:45:10 <AltiusBimm> that is both wonderful and terrible: wonderful for what it can do, and terrible for where it must be done
16:45:26 <AltiusBimm> (I appreciate your patience with me very much :) )
16:45:29 <warlord> well, we ARE hoping to get the QIF importer rewritten.
16:45:35 <warlord> but that GSoC project failed.
16:45:43 <AltiusBimm> that's all I needed to hear ^.^
16:46:58 <AltiusBimm> no that I step back a bit, it's funny, I was actually vigorously trying to get you to admit that the current mapping interface is not good
16:47:03 <AltiusBimm> *now
16:47:23 <jsled> The current interface sucks ass.
16:47:26 <jsled> Is that better?
16:48:48 <AltiusBimm> well vularity is unnecessary, but the empathy is appreciated :)
16:49:01 <AltiusBimm> *vulgarity
16:51:43 <AltiusBimm> new query: I'm aware of the memo field, but I can't find any way (or reference to a way) to make it appear as a column in the ledger
16:51:58 <warlord> Click "Split"
16:52:08 <warlord> .. to expand the transaction
16:52:58 <AltiusBimm> each description for each split is considered a "memo"?
16:53:45 <warlord> if you look closely it's labeled "memo"
16:54:01 <AltiusBimm> LOL, you're right!
16:54:10 <AltiusBimm> thanks warlord :)
16:54:31 <AltiusBimm> you single-handedly make this channel great :D
16:54:44 <warlord> Just be glad I haven't thrown my brick at you, yet. ;)
16:54:54 <AltiusBimm> hehehhe
16:55:48 <AltiusBimm> I do apoligize for the frequency of my questions, I find it much easier to sort-out my thoughts in a conversation than to come up with the right keyword for searching the documentaion
16:56:31 <AltiusBimm> and I enjoy jsled's quips as well :)
16:57:59 <jsled> heh.
17:00:46 <AltiusBimm> as well as his or her suggestions ;)
17:00:51 <jsled> (his)
17:07:05 <AltiusBimm> as well as his suggestions ;)
17:10:35 <AltiusBimm> in fact that was the last of my questions list I made within the first couple of hours of using GnuCash :)
17:10:54 <warlord> ok
17:11:29 <AltiusBimm> (consider that remark like a minor wikipedia barnstar for those who have assisted me)
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17:31:08 <dbr> unstable: see http://pastebin.ca/644784 for ofxdirect connection. If it works, please add to the wiki
17:40:23 <warlord> dbr: I wonder how hard it would be to integrate the fidata lists into the OFX-DC impl in GnuCash/AQB directly?
17:40:38 <warlord> like, to make the setup druid able to read the fidata lists...
17:41:04 <dbr> warlord: martin has some of that code in place, and intends to expand it in the future
17:41:26 <warlord> ok
17:41:39 <dbr> one of the pieces I figured out is that one has to ignore any data associated with Yodlee
17:42:37 <warlord> Right.
17:42:44 <warlord> Which is too bad.
17:43:02 <dbr> but just what Intuit wants...
17:43:18 <warlord> Is Yodlee an Intuit company?
17:43:31 <warlord> I wonder how Yodlee even works?
17:45:46 <dbr> Yodlee is an intermediary whose sole function is to figure out how banks can sell you more services
17:46:07 <warlord> Um.. okay.
17:46:25 <dbr> the way it works is that they store all the current real data server details, and quicken logs into the Yodlee server with
17:46:56 <dbr> some of the bank info, the server returns the real data address, then quicken logs into the real data server
17:47:34 <warlord> Uhuh... So it's a redirector.. And why couldn't we teach libofx (or the ABQ setup) how to use the redirector?
17:47:58 <warlord> how does quicken log into the Yodlee server?
17:48:09 <warlord> (or don't we know that?)
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17:48:14 <dbr> through a published default anonymous login
17:48:22 <dbr> real secure...
17:48:28 <warlord> Heh
17:48:38 <warlord> So it sounds like it COULD be solved.
17:48:55 <dbr> and if they follow the spec, they aren't allowed to refuse that anonymous connection
17:49:28 <dbr> yep. could be solved. smop :)
17:50:35 <warlord> right
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19:16:10 <warlord> jsled: does Gentoo use HAL?
19:16:20 <jsled> yup.
19:17:37 <jsled> 0.5.9-r1 (installed 12:05:33 PM 06/21/2007) here.
19:17:55 <jsled> bias.
19:18:00 <warlord> And it's used on Debian/Ubuntu, too? and SuSE? (I guess HAL is pretty much the standard now?)
19:23:43 <jsled> oh, yeah.
19:23:55 <jsled> why do you ask?
19:24:39 <warlord> just making sure I was right.
19:26:43 <warlord> Thanks.
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19:50:16 <AltiusBimm> that reminds me of Windows
19:50:50 <AltiusBimm> when the MBR is still intact but none of the system files can be found, it says "hal32.dll not found"
19:51:39 <AltiusBimm> amusing that we should use the same acronym as Aurthur C. Clarke, except here it means hardware abstraction layer
19:53:02 <warlord> right
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20:44:08 <Janssen> I'm trying to create a report that works like the expenses bar chart but shows me the actual amount numbers. Any quick solution?
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